cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) (01/17/91)
I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based SCSI hard disk system. Does anyone know what kind (brand name/ model no.) of SCSI tape drive ICD sells in their FaST Backup setup? I'm interested in one but I want a reputable mechanism as it will see daily use. ICD doesn't seem to know (or care to disclose) the mechanism they use so I'm worried that it may be a cheapo unit.... cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu E-Mail replies requested...
boyd@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) (01/19/91)
In article <1991Jan16.184447.14109@d.cs.okstate.edu>, cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: >I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based >SCSI hard disk system. Does anyone know what kind (brand name/ model no.) >of SCSI tape drive ICD sells in their FaST Backup setup? I'm interested in one I understand that ICD does not release their software to drive this device either, so you may be stuck with buying theirs. If you do manage to get a driver for tape backup, please post about it!! -- Mickey R. Boyd | "God is a comedian playing to an FSU Computer Science | audience too afraid to laugh." Technical Support Group | email: boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu | - Voltaire
hojo@cbnewsl.att.com (HC Johnson) (01/23/91)
In article <1991Jan19.021429.2157@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, boyd@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) writes: > In article <1991Jan16.184447.14109@d.cs.okstate.edu>, cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: > >I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based > >SCSI hard disk system. Does anyone know what kind (brand name/ model no.) > >of SCSI tape drive ICD sells in their FaST Backup setup? I'm interested in one > > I understand that ICD does not release their software to drive this device > either, so you may be stuck with buying theirs. If you do manage to get > a driver for tape backup, please post about it!! > There are other sources. 1. Berkely Micro Systems sells CT backup and software. 2. My own BACKUP program works well for me on the Adaptec 3530 SCSI controller. 3. Theres another fellow posting recently on his own driver. So go ahead, put a system together. The mechanics of driving a CT is not all that difficult. And there is software. Howard Johnson ATT BELL LABS att!lzsc!hcj hcj@lzsc.att.com
cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) (01/23/91)
In article <1991Jan22.160946.16793@cbnewsl.att.com> hojo@cbnewsl.att.com (HC Johnson) writes: >In article <1991Jan19.021429.2157@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, boyd@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) writes: >> In article <1991Jan16.184447.14109@d.cs.okstate.edu>, cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: >> >I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based >> >SCSI hard disk system. >> < mention of worries about software availability to drive tape system > >There are other sources. >1. Berkely Micro Systems sells CT backup and software. >2. My own BACKUP program works well for me on the Adaptec 3530 SCSI controller. >3. Theres another fellow posting recently on his own driver. > >So go ahead, put a system together. The mechanics of driving a CT is not >all that difficult. And there is software. > >Howard Johnson Okay... som more questions... I need software that will backup 1) Specific file extensions from a list of partitions (say all *.arc and *.lzh filed from drive d: and e:) 2) Backup only specific subdirectories... (the BBS subdirectories on drives g: and h:) 3) handle incremental backups, appending them to the tape backup the incremental is incremental to... (I guess appending to the tape in the drive is what i really mean...) 4) I really would like to do IMAGE backups as the restore of a partition should be swift that way... but file backups as above are nice... 5) Can I still backup my Spectre partition w/o ICDs software???? thanks jc cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu
dclemans@mentorg.com (Dave Clemans @ APD x1292) (01/24/91)
From article <1991Jan22.160946.16793@cbnewsl.att.com>, by hojo@cbnewsl.att.com (HC Johnson): > In article <1991Jan19.021429.2157@mailer.cc.fsu.edu>, boyd@mailer.cc.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) writes: >> In article <1991Jan16.184447.14109@d.cs.okstate.edu>, cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: >> >I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based >> >SCSI hard disk system. Does anyone know what kind (brand name/ model no.) >> >of SCSI tape drive ICD sells in their FaST Backup setup? I'm interested in one >> >> I understand that ICD does not release their software to drive this device >> either, so you may be stuck with buying theirs. If you do manage to get >> a driver for tape backup, please post about it!! >> > There are other sources. > 1. Berkely Micro Systems sells CT backup and software. > 2. My own BACKUP program works well for me on the Adaptec 3530 SCSI controller. > 3. Theres another fellow posting recently on his own driver. About the ICD FAsT Tape Backup system: They use TEAC tape cassette drives. There are 60meg, 150meg, etc. capacities available, though ICD only uses the 150meg drives. They are now starting to become more readily available; I was visiting Schaumburg, IL and dropped in at a Soft Warehouse store out of curiosity. They were carrying those drives with IBM PC controllers and software. However, the drives sold by ICD have had their SCSI ID proms (or whatever the appropriate term is) changed to a non-standard value. That value is explicitly checked for by their software. As is, their controller software will only work with drives sold by ICD. Technical manuals for the drives are available from TEAC. I know someone locally whose working on a third party tape backup package using these TEAC drives, though I'm not sure how close he is to a release (it's not a full-time effort.....) dgc
hojo@cbnewsl.att.com (HC Johnson) (01/24/91)
In article <1991Jan23.141953.16793@d.cs.okstate.edu>, cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: > > Okay... some more questions... I need software that will backup > > 1) Specific file extensions from a list of partitions > (say all *.arc and *.lzh filed from drive d: and e:) > > 2) Backup only specific subdirectories... > (the BBS subdirectories on drives g: and h:) > > 3) handle incremental backups, appending them to the tape backup the incremental > is incremental to... (I guess appending to the tape in the drive is what > i really mean...) > > 4) I really would like to do IMAGE backups as the restore of a partition > should be swift that way... but file backups as above are nice... > > 5) Can I still backup my Spectre partition w/o ICDs software???? > This is how I do these 5 things. 1. and 2. I use FIND (posted long ago) to identify files and groups and CPIO corrupted from the UNIX specs, with a CT driver embedded. Really, about all that I use this for is to exchange data with UNIX systems. 3. According to the specs, you cannot APPEND to a CT. In fact, the Adaptec 3530 interface enforces that. Simply put, you cannot write after a read. This does not prevent putting multiple files on one tape: it just has to be done as one continuous set of write calls. 4, and 5. This is my main use for CT. I build a list of partitions from a drive (not necessarily contiguous) and output them as files to a CT. Any partition works: TOS, MINIX, Spectre, as long as they show in Sector 0 of the hard disk. A TOS partition, that has been saved on a CT can be read and interpreted to retrieve files. I hacked up the MINIX tos.c command to do this. It is of much less use that just overlaying a partition with the CT file and sucking out the wanted files. This works best if the CT can be selectively read into any partition on and disk. My program does this; if you write your own, remember to limit the transfer by the size of the receiving partition! Howard Johnson ATT BELL LABS att!lzsc!hcj hcj@lzsc.att.com
obryan@gumby.cc.wmich.edu (Mark O'Bryan) (01/31/91)
In article <1991Jan16.184447.14109@d.cs.okstate.edu> cummins@d.cs.okstate.edu (John Cummins) writes: > > I'm wanting to add a tape backup system to my ICD Host Adapter based > SCSI hard disk system. Does anyone know what kind (brand name/ model no.) > of SCSI tape drive ICD sells in their FaST Backup setup? The tape drive ICD uses is the TEAC MT-2ST/N50 streaming cassette unit, available in single-quantity prices around $400. But I wouldn't rush out to buy one just yet. As someone else here mentioned, ICD uses a custom ROM in the units it ships, which at the very least has a special device ID that its backup software queries for, and that off-the-shelf TEAC drives do not have. Also, ICD does not sell their backup software separately, so you'd have to write your own. It's my understanding that ICD plans to unbundle their FaST tape backup package sometime during the 1st quarter of '91, probably to coincide with the release of the new 2.0 version of their backup software. > I'm interested in one > but I want a reputable mechanism as it will see daily use. ICD doesn't > seem to know (or care to disclose) the mechanism they use so I'm worried that > it may be a cheapo unit.... The TEAC drive is definitely NOT a "cheapo unit" and should stand up to daily use for years. This is the same drive that's in widespread use on both Macs and PCs, and has received excellent reviews for drives in its class (150 megs, 6-7 megs/minute). I've been very happy with the one I've had here at work for about a year. I'm not diligent enough to back up every day, but at twice a week I've never had a glitch. The tapes are rated at 1,000-2,000 passes, which translates into 10-20 years at my frequency. Plus, I rotate three tapes, which gives me some backup redundency and extends things even further. They really are extraordinarily fast, averaging 6+ megs/minute in real- life use. Their only serious limitation is that the current backup software is totally sequential. This means that if you back up, for example, 60 megs onto a tape, when you come back later to restore one small file located at the end, it takes 10 minutes to scan for EOT. The same thing is true if you want to append save sets onto one tape. I have no idea if the v2.0 software will alleviate this situation. Dave Small and Charles Johnson seem to like their ICD tape backups a lot, and I have no serious complaints about mine (I just don't append save sets, which means I "waste" large chunks of 150 meg tapes). The packages go for ~$770-780 at places like Joppa, Micro-Tyme, and Toad. Which isn't a bad price for an assembled: drive, host adapter, power supply, enclosure, backup software, cable, and one tape. Especially if you then amortize that cost by dropping in a 3.5" hard drive in the same box, as I did. Tapes run $25-35, depending on where you get them. Plan on buying at least one or two extra tapes (I have about a dozen tapes, but this is for a business, and some are kept off-site). [One additional proviso just occurred to me. Most hard drives these days have transfer rates in the 500+ kB/sec range. But if you happen to have an older drive that runs < ~300 kB/sec (my old 20-meg Mini- Scribe clocked in around 200 kB/sec), the FaST tape backup isn't fast any more. I.e., things slow WAY down. The reason is that the hard drive can't keep up with the SCSI tape, so the tape has to stop, turn around, back up, then get back up to speed and resync before writing again. This happens over and over again. I wouldn't recommend the FaST unit for drives in this category.] -- Mark T. O'Bryan Internet: obryan@gumby.cc.wmich.edu Paradigm Software Products (makers of Omni-Banker ST) Kalamazoo, MI 49009 -- Mark T. O'Bryan Internet: obryan@gumby.cc.wmich.edu Western Michigan University Kalamazoo, MI 49008