glennd@athena.arc.nasa.gov (Glenn Deardorff - GDP) (05/02/91)
I recently heard from someone who said that using an improved mouse (improved over the standard Atari mouse, that is) significantly improved the performance of his GEM windows - if I understood him right. That is to say, that windows would raise faster, grab the focus faster, etc. just by using an improved mouse - so that GEM would like it was significantly speeded up. He said he used a "Golden Image" mouse. Do others that have bought better mice notice anything like this? If so, it would certainly seem like a worthwile investment. Thanks. - Glenn Also, recommendations on better mice?
iho@cac.washington.edu (Il Oh) (05/02/91)
glennd@athena.arc.nasa.gov (Glenn Deardorff - GDP) writes: >I recently heard from someone who said that using an improved mouse >(improved over the standard Atari mouse, that is) significantly improved >the performance of his GEM windows - if I understood him right. That is >to say, that windows would raise faster, grab the focus faster, etc. >just by using an improved mouse - so that GEM would like it was >significantly speeded up. He said he used a "Golden Image" mouse. Do >others that have bought better mice notice anything like this? If so, >it would certainly seem like a worthwile investment. I seriously doubt that GEM would perform faster because of a better mouse. However, you would be able to use it faster. A better mouse responds more quickly to your movements and clicks. The Golden Image is supposed to be very good, a lot like the Microsoft Mouse for DOS machines. I've tried the Beetle mouse, and it's also very nice. I'm one of the lucky few. I've got a really good Atari mouse. -- "I'm sorry. | Il Hwan Oh If you were right, | University of Washington, Tacoma I would agree with you." | iho@cac.washington.edu -- Dr. Malcolm Sayer, _Awakenings_ |
boyd@bind.cs.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) (05/03/91)
In article <1991May1.213059.21272@milton.u.washington.edu>, iho@akbar.UUCP (Il Oh) writes: >glennd@athena.arc.nasa.gov (Glenn Deardorff - GDP) writes: >>I recently heard from someone who said that using an improved mouse >>(improved over the standard Atari mouse, that is) significantly improved >>the performance of his GEM windows - if I understood him right. That is >>to say, that windows would raise faster, grab the focus faster, etc. >>just by using an improved mouse - so that GEM would like it was >>significantly speeded up. He said he used a "Golden Image" mouse. Do >>others that have bought better mice notice anything like this? If so, >>it would certainly seem like a worthwile investment. > >I seriously doubt that GEM would perform faster because of a better mouse. >However, you would be able to use it faster. A better mouse responds more >quickly to your movements and clicks. The Golden Image is supposed to be >very good, a lot like the Microsoft Mouse for DOS machines. I've tried >the Beetle mouse, and it's also very nice. I'm one of the lucky few. >I've got a really good Atari mouse. Beware! Faster mice (ie higher dpi) are not always better. At some point, the ST hardware cannot handle the increased input, and you get the 'sticking pointer' problem. Try this: move your Atari mouse very quickly in any direction (I mean VERY quickly, like a snap). You will notice that the mouse pointer will kind of "shudder", but will not move in the desired direction. Basically, you are overloading hardware/software with too much mouse output. Now, the higher dpi mice give more output per inch moved. This means that this overload is easier to attain with the higher dpi mice. I have a buddy who cannot use his Golden Image mouse because he would have to "pace" himself to get it to work. A better way to get a "faster" mouse is through software acceleration, which should not have this problem (and you can choose from direct, proportional, exponential, etc, types of acceleration). There are several PD accelerators which work well (I use MouseDoubler2). Thus, if you are considering purchasing a third-party mouse, make sure that the dpi is not too high (unfortunetely the marketeers seem to think that bigger is better when it comes to dpi). Failing that, you should find out if you can set the dpi rate with a dip switch or pot or something. I believe the Atari mice are rated at 150dpi. I have seen mice advertised at up to 400dpi (thus meaning that you would have to move the mouse only about 1/3 as fast to get it to "shudder"). You will often see ads proclaiming "No mouse accelerator needed!" on such mice. This is true, but the damn things force you to slow down (and at least in my case, miss what I am trying to point at)!! -- ---------------------------------+------------------------------------- Mickey R. Boyd | "Kirk to Enterprise. All clear FSU Computer Science | down here. Beam down Technical Support Group | yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ." email: boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu | ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
garrick@greyrock.mso.colostate.edu (Kevin O. Garrick) (05/03/91)
You mentioned MouseDoubler2. I use MACELL3 and have had no difficulty. It also has a built in screen saver. There are three different speeds for the mouse and the screen saver is adjustable. I have never had any trouble with my Atari mouse, either, but have seen a few that sure needed help! Kevin -- +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ + Kevin Garrick + Do not worry about your + + Math major, Colorado State Univ. + difficulties in mathematics; + + garrick@greyrock.mso.colostate.edu + I can assure you that mine are + + Microcomputer Services Org. + still greater. -Albert Einstein + +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
la_carle@sol.brispoly.ac.uk (Les Carleton) (05/03/91)
I use the Golden Image mouse too, but GEM doesn't actually respond any faster. What your friend may have been describing is the increased throughput gained by having a mouse which you only move half the distance (physically) to go the whole distance (on the screen). Also microswitched buttons make a great difference to the usability of the GEM system. It's just a pity that the ST doesn't sample the mouse fast enough to use it at full pelt. ...Les... "Ex-BBC owner still hating GEM"
scale@abode.wciu.edu (Luis Outumuro) (05/03/91)
Hi Glenn, Yes, a "better" (higher resolution) mouse does "appear" to speed up the system. Or at least mouse pointer movement is smoother and more accurate. The Golden Image GI-250 scored the best in ST Journal's mouse review this last year; and I am quite happy with the GI-250 that I have. There are also couple of new mouse's that have introduced more recently such as the Beetle Mouse from Talon. Bye................ Luis -- """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Luis Mark Outumuro III | "Well... you're damned if you do, Computer Office Products 818/813-1051 | and you're damned if you don't!" Infoline 818/813-1053 | - Bart Simpson, 1990...
boyd@nu.cs.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) (05/03/91)
In article <GARRICK.91May2132429@greyrock.greyrock.mso.colostate.edu>, garrick@greyrock.mso.colostate.edu (Kevin O. Garrick) writes: >You mentioned MouseDoubler2. I use MACELL3 and have had no >difficulty. It also has a built in screen saver. There are three >different speeds for the mouse and the screen saver is adjustable. I >have never had any trouble with my Atari mouse, either, but have seen >a few that sure needed help! >Kevin >-- Those that are interested in such things :-) might like this. There are now at least 4 different variants of the Atari mouse. Here is how to identify them (the "ball door" is the opening on the bottom of the mouse which allows the removal of the ball, the rollers are the bars that touch the ball and relay it's movement to the optical sensors. The rollers are visible when you take out the ball). 1. Sliding mouse door, thin metal rollers, made in Germany. 2. Sliding mouse door, thin metal rollers, made in Taiwan. 3. Rotating mouse door, large teflon rollers, made in Japan. 4. Sliding mouse door, small teflon rollers, made in ????. Numbers 1 and 2 are no longer sold, number 3 is the current ST mouse (and does NOT have the problems of the first two), and number 4 is white and comes with the TT. I have beaten the crap out of a number 3 for almost three years, and it still works perfectly. -- ---------------------------------+------------------------------------- Mickey R. Boyd | "Kirk to Enterprise. All clear FSU Computer Science | down here. Beam down Technical Support Group | yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ." email: boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu | ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------
whitcomb@aurs01.UUCP (Jonathan Whitcomb) (05/04/91)
In article <1991May2.133114.26227@mailer.cc.fsu.edu> boyd@nu.cs.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) writes: -Beware! Faster mice (ie higher dpi) are not always better. At some point, -the ST hardware cannot handle the increased input, and you get the 'sticking -pointer' problem. Try this: move your Atari mouse very quickly in any -direction (I mean VERY quickly, like a snap). You will notice that the -mouse pointer will kind of "shudder", but will not move in the desired -direction. Basically, you are overloading hardware/software with too much -mouse output. Now, the higher dpi mice give more output per inch moved. -This means that this overload is easier to attain with the higher dpi mice. -I have a buddy who cannot use his Golden Image mouse because he would have to -"pace" himself to get it to work. A better way to get a "faster" mouse is -through software acceleration, which should not have this problem (and you -can choose from direct, proportional, exponential, etc, types of -acceleration). I use the Golden Image mouse, and have had no problems. In fact I had terrible troubles with mouse accellerators before I bought it. The Atari Mouse Accellerator (1, 2 and 3) all caused my system to crash occasionally, or cause a reboot loop. (How do I know it was the accellerator? I took it out, and the problem stopped. Real scientific, huh?) The GI mouse also feels nice in the hand, and has great action on the buttons. Perhaps your friend should just drink less coffee before he uses his mouse. ;^) Actually, I tried the new mouse with the accellerator still in, and it was impossible to do anything useful. I'm sure it's all a matter of personal taste, but I'd say if you have half decent motor control (and remember to turn off your mouse accellerator), you should have no problem with the Golden Image mouse. ********************************************************************** Jonathan Whitcomb UUCP: <whitcomb%aurgate@mcnc.org> Alcatel Network Systems, Raleigh, NC Delphi: JBWHIT
jon@nabob.cc.mcgill.ca (Jonathan Carroll) (05/04/91)
In article <1991May3.153622.1433@abode.wciu.edu> scale@abode.wciu.edu (Luis Outumuro) writes: > Hi Glenn, > Yes, a "better" (higher resolution) mouse does "appear" to > speed up the system. Or at least mouse pointer movement is smoother and more > accurate. Ditto. While a mouse does nothing to speed up redraws, I (and I expect a lot of people) spend a considerable amount of time just moving the mouse around : selecting files, icons, moving windows etc etc... The Golden Image makes that a little faster without any nasty surprises. > The Golden Image GI-250 scored the best in ST Journal's mouse > review > this last year; and I am quite happy with the GI-250 that I have. Yup, I *love* my Golden Image mouse. Up until I got it, I had thought the Micosoft Mouse (for IBM types) was the best money could buy. I think the Golden Image is marginally better -- I like the fact that it is wider. > > Luis > Jon
boyd@nu.cs.fsu.edu (Mickey Boyd) (05/08/91)
In article <59795@aurs01.UUCP>, whitcomb@aurw04.UUCP (Jonathan Whitcomb) writes: > >I use the Golden Image mouse, and have had no problems. In fact I had >terrible troubles with mouse accellerators before I bought it. The Atari >Mouse Accellerator (1, 2 and 3) all caused my system to crash occasionally, >or cause a reboot loop. (How do I know it was the accellerator? I took >it out, and the problem stopped. Real scientific, huh?) Whooops. The problem mouse was not a Golden Image, it was made by Naksha (which is a british company, despite the name). Sorry about that . . . -- ---------------------------------+------------------------------------- Mickey R. Boyd | "Kirk to Enterprise. All clear FSU Computer Science | down here. Beam down Technical Support Group | yeoman Rand and a six-pack . ." email: boyd@fsucs.cs.fsu.edu | ---------------------------------+-------------------------------------