bryce@HOSER.BERKELEY.EDU (Bryce Nesbitt) (09/04/87)
Empty drives on the Amiga make a clicking noise. With one empty drive in a
quiet room it is annoying. With two it gets on the nerves. With three it
drives one up the wall. And with four... well by that time you are over
the wall, and down the other side.
There is hope! No longer will you need to stick a disk into a drive just
to get it to shut up. I hereby unveil:
noKLICKstart
A program to patch your V1.2 Kickstart disk. After the modification the OS
will test for disk insertion silently. If you have an Amiga with Kickstart
in ROM you have just discovered a disadvantage of Kickstart in ROM.
When Kickstart V1.3 comes out you won't need this. It will be part of
the Operating System. Right Dale? 1/2 :-)
Technical mumbo jumbo: It's quite simple, really. The /CHNG signal is set
low and latched by the drive when a disk is pulled out. In order to see if
a disk has been inserted the latch must be unlatched. This is done by
stepping the head. Normally the Amiga goes from track 0 to 1 and back.
This is what makes the noise.
Now these drives all have track 0 sensors. You can't make the drive go
past track zero. You can, however, reset the latch by _trying_ to step out
past track zero. Sony literature confirms that the latch will be reset,
but the head will not move. Great!
All that is needed is to patch Kickstart. You need to change one solitary
bit, and then fix the checksum. Which bit?? heh... heh... there are
2,097,152 choices... what's it worth to 'ya? Nothing??? Ok then, I'll
tell you. Change the long word at $00FE99E8 from $086B001 to $08EB001. I
don't know where the real checksum is kept, so I just mangle the Copyright
notice by changing $00FC007C from $6D6F646F to $6CEF646F.
This turns a "BCHG" instruction into a "BSET".
What? The Kickstart ram is not writable?? You mean you don't have a button
to do that?? Gee. Maybe you'd like a program. Here's one:
(To decode get "uudecode" from Fish disk #53 and type:
"uudecode <name_of_this_file>" from the CLI.)
begin 644 noKLICKstart
M```#\P`````````!``````````````$X```#Z0```3@L>``$D\E.KO[:*D!P'
M`"(M`*QF($'M`%Q.KOZ`0>T`7$ZN_HPD`$ZN_WPB0DZN_H9P_DYU+'@`!$/YI
M```#)$ZN_F@L0"I`3J[_Q"(`0?D```,P)`@F/````:U.KO_0MH!F'$ZN_\HB3
M`&<468\D#W8$3J[_UA`76(\,``!Y9P1P"DYU(CP````#(#P```(`+'@`!$ZN_
M_SI*@&?D)$!P`2!*80`!%&9@#*IM;V1O`'QF``!,)7QL[V1O`'QP`2!*80`!D
M`&9"(#P```%-($IA``#H9C0,J@AK``$!Z&8@)7P(ZP`!`>@@/````4T@2F$`K
M`-)F%$'Y```"=G888!)!^0```LIV26`(0?D```*.=CPD""Q-3J[_Q"(`3J[_H
MT")-+'@`!$ZN_F(@/````@`B2DZN_RYP`$YU+PHB/``!``%P(DZN_SHD0$J`W
M9Q1P_TZN_K9R_[*`9@XB2G`B3J[_+B1?<`!.=15```\5?`````X5?``$``A"P
M*@`)D\E.KO[:)4``$$'J`!0@B%B00J@`!"%(``@@"B1?3G4O"7#_$T``""-`;
M`!1P`!`I``].KOZP(E]P(D[N_RY(YS`2-CP``F`(2.<P$C8\``,L>``$)``F7
M2)_\````.'`W($]"&%'(__QA`/]49P``>"]```X??``%``A!^0```Q,B3W``(
M<@!.KOY$2H!F6#]#`!PO?````@``)'`)X:(O0@`L+TL`*")/3J[^.!`O`!]F)
M)#]\``0`'")/3J[^.#]\``D`'$*O`"0B3TZN_CA^`!XO`!]@$C]\``D`'$*OG
M`"0B3TZN_CA^_R)O``YA`/\RW_P````X3-](#"`'3G5N;TM,24-+<W1A<G0@*
M:6YS=&%L;&5D+@IN;TM,24-+<W1A<G0@9F%I;&5D+B`@4&5R:&%P<R!Y;W5RF
M(&1I<VL@:7,@=W)I=&4M<')O=&5C=&5D/PI9;W4@8V%N)W0@9F]O;"!M92$@_
M.BTI(%1H870G<R!N;W0@86X@=6YM;V1I9F5D(%8Q+C(@*#,S+C$X,"D@2VECR
M:W-T87)T(2$*=')A8VMD:7-K+F1E=FEC90!D;W,N;&EB<F%R>0!N;TM,24-+W
M<W1A<G0@5C$N,"X@J3$Y.#<@0G)Y8V4@3F5S8FET="X*1G)E92P@<F5V;VMA?
M8FQE(&QI8V5N8V4@9W)A;G1E9"!T;R!A;GEO;F4@;W(@86YY=&AI;F<@;W1H&
M97(@=&AA;@I2;V)E<G0@5RX@4VMY;&5S+"!3:WEL97,@16QE8W1R:6,@5V]R$
M:W,@26YC+BP@2F%M97,@1')E=RP@4F5G9VEE"E=A<G)E;B!O<B!-96=A<V]FO
M="!);F,N"E1H:7,@<')O9W)A;2!C:&%N9V5S(&$@2VEC:W-T87)T(&EN=&\@:
M82!N;TM,24-+<W1A<G0[(&5M<'1Y"F1R:79E<R!W:6QL(&YO(&QO;F=E<B`B9
M8VQI8VLB(0I5<V4@=&AI<R!O;B!A(&)A8VMU<"!O9B!Y;W5R(%8Q+C(@2VEC.
M:W-T87)T(&1I<VLN"@I);G-E<G0@2VEC:W-T87)T(&EN=&\@9')I=F4@1$8P9
M.BX@(%1Y<&4@>2!T:&5N(%)%5%523B!T;PIC;VYT:6YU92P@;W(@:G5S="!2I
M15154DX@=&\@86)O<G0N(`````````/L````!@````````'T```!"````/X`(
3``#T````3@```#H````````#\@``Q
``
end
size 1324
|\ /| . Ack! (NAK, EOT, SOH)
{O o} .
( " ) bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce
U If "hoser" does not work, try my old address at "cogsci"
If you have a problem with this program, please send EMail. I want
to know.bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) (09/05/87)
After my posting of the Kickstart disk patch to eliminate empty drive
click several people wrote to me worried that it might not work
on their machines. If they had only tried it first... :-).
After coming up with the idea I tested it. (Insert delay of about 1.5 years)
I then contacted Sony. Their rep and spec. sheet says that the method will
work. (Sony invented the 90mm drive then got together with other manufactures
to make it a standard). The NEC rep said the same thing... and that the
method chosen was quite common (and the method the Amiga uses quite wierd).
Drives from any manufacturer should be just fine. It has been tested on
drives from Sony, NEC, Mitsubisi and Panasonic. (not all of those where Amiga
drives). Have any other brands been used in the Amiga? Probably. Just
count the number of different style plastic eject button mouldings. :-)
Oh, and before you ask, this Kickstart patch is not going to bother any
software. Software could not care less about the empty drive detection
method.
|\ /| . Ack! (NAK, EOT, SOH)
{o O} .
( " ) bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!brycesjm@well.UUCP (Stephen Moehle) (09/05/87)
Previously, Bryce Nesbitt wrote concernting his noKLICKstart mod to KlickStart: >Drives from any manufacturer should be just fine. It has been tested on >drives from Sony, NEC, Mitsubisi and Panasonic. (not all of those where Amiga >drives). Have any other brands been used in the Amiga? Probably. Just >count the number of different style plastic eject button mouldings. :-) I applied this patch to a KickStart disk, turned off the computer and brought it back up. Uh, well, all that happened was that my drives simply made different noises when there was no disk present. It was a sharper clicking noise, not the dull thudding I usually associate with my drives. So I don't know what went wrong.... I just took apart my external drive, and it says Matsushita. Stephe "I wish I knew where I was and had something to disclaim."
ewhac@well.UUCP (Leo 'Bols Ewhac' Schwab) (09/06/87)
In article <3897@well.UUCP> sjm@well.UUCP (Stephen Moehle) writes: > I applied this patch to a KickStart disk, turned off the computer >and brought it back up. Uh, well, all that happened was that my drives >simply made different noises when there was no disk present. [ ... ] Ten bucks says your drive doesn't observe track 0 detect. Apple pulled this stunt years ago. "Lets save a few cents on the drive," they said. "Let's leave out the track 0 detect switch," they said. "We'll just ram the head against the physical stop 39 times," they said. "It can't possibly do any harm; just give the user indigestion." Sigh. _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ Leo L. Schwab -- The Guy in The Cape ihnp4!ptsfa -\ \_ -_ Bike shrunk by popular demand, dual ---> !{well,unicom}!ewhac O----^o But it's still the only way to fly. hplabs / (pronounced "AE-wack") "Work FOR? I don't work FOR anybody! I'm just having fun." -- The Doctor
bryce@hoser.UUCP (09/06/87)
Well it's obvious that there is much interest in not having empty drives
click; my mailbox tells me that! (Almost filled /usr/spool/mail :-).
The original posting was a patch for the V1.2 Kickstart disk to eliminate
the click that empty drives make. The posting also gave absolute
addresses for those who have ROMs.
The mail came in three categories:
-------------------
Mail> Thanks! [That's always bugged the heck out of me.]
Me> You're welcome.
-------------------
Mail> I get this message-> "You can't fool me! :-) That's not an unmodified
V1.2 (33.180) Kickstart!!". I type "version" and it gives me 33.180.
What gives?
Me> You have a "Gamma 1" Kickstart and not the "Release" version. You must
upgrade to use noKLICKstart. (Cost $12-$15. Includes Kickstart, Workbench,
Extras and documentation including important V1.2 technical info. Dealers
know it as the "V1.2 Enhancer Software".)
A glitch at Commodore-Amiga caused the version number not to be auto-
incremented like it should have been.
-------------------
And now the most serious category of responses. I made an assumption with
noKLICKstart, a good one from my point of view. I checked with Sony and NEC
and tested with others including Mitsubishi and Panasonic. It worked
flawlessly on several A1000's, several A500's and a dealer's A2000 (German
design).
I put it out on the net partially to get it tested on a wider base.
Several people wrote that one or more of their drives did not stop
clicking. In fact, they get louder. Each case where I know, it has been
with an early A1000, usually purchased from developer support back when the
machine first came out. Some purchased from dealers early on.
My assumption was that >any< transition of /STEP would reset the /CHNG latch.
This has held true for all respondents. I also assumed that before /STEP
got to the stepper it would pass through a gate that would block it
if the DIRection was outwards and the track zero sensor was active. All
drives I've ever seen that have an interface with DIR and /STEP have been
like this.
Not those unlucky few. Two of the people with this problem wrote or
posted that "Matsushita" was the brand stamped on their disk drives.
In conclusion, it seems that noKLICKstart will work on most, but not all
disk drives. Matt Dillon has a still-clicking external drive, so maybe I'll
ask if he will swap for my NEC while I look into the problem. (I'll also
try to track down the technical scoop from Matsushita).
Until then it does no harm to try noKLICKstart on your system... but if the
clicking does not stop I can't recommend that you use it. If it does
stop... may you, um. "Rest In Peace". :-)
|\ /| . Ack! (NAK, EOT, SOH)
{o O} .
( " ) bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce
U bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) (09/06/87)
In article <3905@well.UUCP> ewhac@well.UUCP (Leo 'Bols Ewhac' Schwab) writes: >In article <3897@well.UUCP> sjm@well.UUCP (Stephen Moehle) writes: >> >> [noKLICKstart won't stop the clicking on my Matsushita drives] > > Ten bucks says your drive doesn't observe track 0 detect. Ten bucks? I'll give you the address to send it. Read on... > Apple pulled this stunt years ago. "Lets save a few cents on the >drive," they said. "Let's leave out the track 0 detect switch," they said. >"We'll just ram the head against the physical stop 39 times," they said. >"It can't possibly do any harm; just give the user indigestion." I believe it was 45 times. You had to step 45 times to be *sure* that you hit the stop to calibrated back to zero. (1541's number, don't know about Apple) Stepen Moehle's drive *has* the track 0 detect switch. It just does not listen to it internally. See the "Re: noKLICKstart" posting for the details of what's wrong. Basically the drive depends on the host to look at /TRK0 instead of also disabling an outward /STEP at that time. Darn non-standard garbage. :-( (I consider Sony the standard for lack of an ISO or ANSI spec) The old, old (Woz era) Apple drives used a plastic disk that held up well to having no zero detect switch. The //c and the DuoDisk use a more "modern" disk mechanism -> designed to need a track zero detect; but there is none. I seriously wonder how many heart attacks that has caused. It is a very, very, loud, obnoxious sound. The Commodore 1540 and 1541 suffered from the same difficulties, but not so loud (The //c's case is specifically designed to amplify the noise :-). Worse yet lots of protection schemes would bang the head. (They have a track zero sensor now, sort of) Now most amazing of all was the maker of 1541 clones, The Comtel Group. They purchased drives with track zero detect. Now, get this -> They *removed* them from each drive. Arghhh!! > Sigh. Sigh, sigh, SIGH, and double sigh. >"Work FOR? I don't work FOR anybody! I'm just having fun." -- The Doctor Tell that to your employer. :-) |\ /| . Ack! (NAK, EOT, SOH) {o O} . ( " ) bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce U
hah@omepd.UUCP (09/06/87)
In article <3609@zen.berkeley.edu> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu.UUCP (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: >After my posting of the Kickstart disk patch to eliminate empty drive >click several people wrote to me worried that it might not work >on their machines. If they had only tried it first... :-). > I did try it...... I LOVE IT !!!! Hans
jgh@root.co.uk (Jeremy G Harris) (09/07/87)
In article <3617@zen.berkeley.edu> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: >The Commodore 1540 and 1541 suffered from the same difficulties Then there was the C64/1541 proggie which played "Daisy, daisy" on the endstop........ Jeremy -- Jeremy Harris jgh@root.co.uk
bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) (09/11/87)
[ Cross-posted to sci.electronics because it's about electronics,
though the problem showed up with the Amiga Computer. Please edit the
group line if your response is not approprate to both groups. ]
[ You need to know that the 90mm disk drives of the Amiga Personal Computer
make a clicking noise when empty. You also need to know that 90mm ~=
3.5 inches ]
Recently I posted a Kickstart patch to turn 1.2 Kickstart into 1.2
noKLICKstart. I know it was popular because hundreds of people
responeded (Email and otherwise). Sadly, many of those
complained that it did not stop the click of *their* drives. What
follows is a technical desciption of what goes on and how to fix
it:
Seems that Amy has been "sleeping around" with a lot of different drive
manufacturers. No offical word, but my spies report:
Mitsumi
Matshshita
Sony
NEC
Chinon (Amiga 500)
Panasonic
Which reads as a "whos who" of 90mm drive manufactures.
The reason for the clicking in the first place is to detect disk insertion.
The drives all have a /CHANGE signal, which is latched LOW when a disk is
removed. This must be a latch, or you would run the possibility of missing
a disk change. To see if a new disk is in, you must RESET the latch. This,
for reasons byond my comprehension, is done with the /STEP signal. (BTW:
I know the reasons, I just don't agree.)
So now you know why the drives click. To prevent it I patched Kickstart
to continutally step OUTWARD instead of forth and back. When the head
reaches the track zero sensor the drive says "hey", "you can't go that
way". It resets the /CHANGE latch, but does not step or click. Saves
wear and tear on the drives, is silent, and is generally a good idea.
"But no" said some manufacturers. The drives that don't like this are a bit
dim... you try to step the head past zero and they simply let you bash
the head into the stop. No noise or wear and tear savings here! These
drives all have ample circutry to do it the first way... they just don't.
Drives that are know to work include----
Sony
NEC
Chinon (Used in the Amiga 500, single +5 supply, very low power)
Panasonic
Drives that don't----
Matshushita
Mitsumi
Drives that I have received a conflicting report on----
Panasonic (one person says it's the same as Matsushita... unconfirmed)
Drives that are not used in the Amiga, but won't work anyway----
Fujitsu
SOME drives provide an alternate /CHANGE reset signal, often on Pin 1. But
all the drives that do, *already work fine*. If you want to get a non
working drive to work you would need to either:
A> Cut /STEP on the drive PCB so it gets to the latch, but not the stepper
motor. Now add a gate that will disallow /STEP if the track zero sensor
is active and the direction is out.
B> Tap the change sensor on the board and drag it external. Use /STEP to
reset your external latch (ignore the internal one). Now add the circuit
to disable /STEP when track zero is active and the direction is out.
Both are simple, but painful to do. I don't expect that anyone will try
them.
There seem to be no *real* standards in 90mm drives. Every manufacturer
is a little different. The /CHANGE signal is the most volitaile of all.
The definitions of Pins 1,2 and 34 are wildly different from manufacturer
to manufacturer. Such is life...
|\ /| . Ack! (NAK, EOT, SOH)
{O o} .
(") bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce
U jdow@gryphon.CTS.COM (Joanne Dow) (09/15/87)
In article <3688@zen.berkeley.edu> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: >[ Cross-posted to sci.electronics because it's about electronics, > though the problem showed up with the Amiga Computer. Please edit the > group line if your response is not approprate to both groups. ] >[ You need to know that the 90mm disk drives of the Amiga Personal Computer > make a clicking noise when empty. You also need to know that 90mm ~= > 3.5 inches ] > >Recently I posted a Kickstart patch to turn 1.2 Kickstart into 1.2 >noKLICKstart. I know it was popular because hundreds of people >responeded (Email and otherwise). Sadly, many of those >complained that it did not stop the click of *their* drives. What >follows is a technical desciption of what goes on and how to fix >it: >all the drives that do, *already work fine*. If you want to get a non >working drive to work you would need to either: > >A> Cut /STEP on the drive PCB so it gets to the latch, but not the stepper >motor. Now add a gate that will disallow /STEP if the track zero sensor >is active and the direction is out. > >B> Tap the change sensor on the board and drag it external. Use /STEP to >reset your external latch (ignore the internal one). Now add the circuit >to disable /STEP when track zero is active and the direction is out. > >Both are simple, but painful to do. I don't expect that anyone will try >them. > Er, there may well be a better way. If you're going to hack at the drive why not tell the fool thing to not step the head unless the head is loaded? The clicks come with the head unloaded. Hence going in and adding a gate to intercept the head step pulses unless the head is loaded should do the trick admirably. Hm, maybe my hardware background is showing here... SW weenies shouldn't know this kinda stuff, nie? <^_-> -- <@_@> BIX:jdow INTERNET:jdow@gryphon.CTS.COM UUCP:{akgua, hplabs!hp-sdd, sdcsvax, ihnp4, nosc}!crash!gryphon!jdow Remember - A bird in the hand often leaves a sticky deposit. Perhaps it was better you left it in the bush with the other one.
bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) (09/15/87)
In article <1544@gryphon.CTS.COM> jdow@gryphon.CTS.COM (Joanne Dow) writes: )In article <3688@zen.berkeley> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: )> >>[Description of two painfull ways to make a drive that won't stop stepping >> at track zero stop] ) >Er, there may well be a better way. If you're going to hack at the drive why >not tell the fool thing to not step the head unless the head is loaded?... Yes, add a third way. A friend an I looked into this a few days ago. This is slightly less desirable than the first ones because some systems will try to recalibrate the heads, but if they are not stepping they will stick in a loop until a disk is insterted. Also, you still need to add a chip and cut a wire. It's not easier. I don't think there are any elegant solutions. Those with clicky drives are probably stuck for life. |\ /| . Ack! (NAK, ENQ, SYN) {o O} . (") bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce U How can you go back if you have not yet gone forth?
bryan@mothra.cs.utexas.edu (Bryan Bayerdorffer) (09/16/87)
In article <3754@zen.berkeley.edu> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: >I don't think there are any elegant solutions. Those with clicky drives >are probably stuck for life. '...Just gotta get used to it, This is no social crisis, Just another clicky day for you...' Sorry, I just couldn't resist. 8^} ______________________________________________________________________________ /_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/_____/ |_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____| _No dark sarcasm in the classroom|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|___ |____Teachers leave the kids alone__|_____|_____|bryan@ratliff.cs.utexas.edu__| ___|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_{ihnp4,seismo,...}!ut-sally!ut-ratliff!bryan |_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|
wtm@neoucom.UUCP (09/18/87)
In my engineering tunure, I've discovered disk drive interfaces are nearly as frustrating as RS-232 (and other) serial ports :-). A wihile back I was trying to tame a cantankerous Teac 55-B drive in an AT&T 6300. I called Teac to get the low-down on the drive. When I got through to their engineer he asked "What have you got", to which I said "55-B". He said, "like I said, what have you got". It turns out that there were something like 95 OEM versions of the 55-B. Their engineer further expalained that on average, the layout of the PCB for the "generic" models of the 55-B changes about every two weeks (!). The upshot of this is that drives you get on the surplus market can be almost anything at all. In the case of Teac, they disavow all knowledge of any of the OEM versions. Thus, buyer beware when adding surplus drives to your system. Pins 1, 2, and 34 as Bryce noted can be almost anything. At least defacto standardization has taken over for most of the rest of the interface. For the moment, I'll stick with my engineering solution of leaving something in the drive. Bill wtm@neoucom.UUCP <<disclaim this article at your own risk>>
grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) (09/29/87)
In article <3688@zen.berkeley.edu> bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu (Bryce Nesbitt) writes: > > Seems that Amy has been "sleeping around" with a lot of different drive > manufacturers. No offical word, but my spies report: > > Mitsumi > Matshshita > Sony > NEC > Chinon (Amiga 500) > Panasonic > > Which reads as a "whos who" of 90mm drive manufactures. > I think the "official vendors are NEC, Matsushita and Newtronics for the A1000, Chinon for the A500 and A2000. The Chinon drives aren't 5 volt only, although a number of drives tentativly approved for the A500 are. > There seem to be no *real* standards in 90mm drives. Every manufacturer > is a little different. The /CHANGE signal is the most volitaile of all. > The definitions of Pins 1,2 and 34 are wildly different from manufacturer > to manufacturer. Such is life... No hard and fast standards, when you order a few tens of thousands, you just tell them what options you want and send the money. This track zero thing has never been a requirement, since the software normally takes care of the problem. -- George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {ihnp4|rutgers|allegra}!cbmvax!grr but no way officially representing arpa: out to lunch... Commodore, Engineering Department fone: 215-431-9255 (only by moonlite)
bryce@hoser.berkeley.edu.UUCP (09/30/87)
In article <2412@cbmvax.UUCP> grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) writes: > >I think the "official" vendors are NEC, Matsushita and Newtronics for the >A1000... Gack! From that only the NEC will work with noKLICKstart. The statistics are grim. Close to 60% of the people who contacted me had drives that cannot be "un-clicked". This a somewhat self-selected sample since those whom it worked for did not need to ask me if there was any way to get it to work. >...Chinon for the A500 and A2000.... ....This track zero thing >has never been a requirement, since the software normally takes care of the >problem. The Chinon drives work. (including the older models, I was 100% wrong about the A500 using the single +5 volt Chinon) This is a sort of humble public request that the track zero thing be added to the requirments list. (Drive must obey internal track zero sensor) I have not the foggiest idea about how to write a RAM resident noKLICKstart, but I know that it *can* be done. (Though Kickstart patches would be needed to prevent $C00000 sizing munging, $D80000 "is it clock or bad RAM" confusion, and allow WB to boot from any auto-mounted floppy). |\ /| . Ack! (NAK, ENQ, SYN) {o O} . (") bryce@hoser.berkeley.EDU -or- ucbvax!hoser!bryce U How can you go back if you have not yet gone forth?