kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) (11/20/87)
[]
This is a good news bad news story.
The good news was that a friend gave me his spare Fujitsu M2243AS
hard disk drive. This baby has a formatted storage capacity of
67 megabytes! YUMM.
The bad news is that I can't get it to format with my A2090 controller.
After running prep, booting the system and starting the format, it merrily
formats through cylinder 204. But, when it gets to 205, format tries,
tries and retries for about fifteen minutes. Then it finally gives up
saying "can't open Device".
Could anyone answer the following questions to help me use the drive?
1. I do not have the defect list. How can I determine the flaws and
tell them to the Amiga? There is no utility I've found supplied
with the controller or with AmigaDos to determine the flaws.
Format tells you each cylinder it is formatting, but not the
head, sector or position.
2. How do you add new flaws to the flaw map? The prep command is the
only way I know to enter the flaws, but when you run prep, you must
reformat the whole disk. Isn't there a way to add additional flaws
to the flaw map, should they appear, without using prep?
3. Why does the format retry so much? It seems to be wasting its time
going for fifteen minutes on the same cylinder. And, why does it
quit instead of going to the next cylinder? Shouldn't format just
decide that the cylinder is flawed, put it in the flaw map and
go on?
4. Is there any written documentation on the questions prep asks?
The controller docs say that prep will ask some questions, but doesn't
tell you what they are or what they mean. For example, one question
prep asks is "pre-comp" cylinder. It suggests using cylinder 754
(the highest cylindar). The Fuji manual doesn't say anything about a
"pre-comp" cylinder, so I don't know what to use, other than the
suggested default. Is this correct?
Please Don't let me down. I have always received excellent help
here before, and I really want to be able to use the drive.
Thanks a million.
Kerry Zimmerman
# {ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!cadovax!kaz Contel Business Systems 213-323-8170
A difference between an amateur and a professional,
is that a professional has the right tools.rad@masscomp.UUCP (Bob Doolittle) (11/21/87)
In article <1884@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: >[] >The good news was that a friend gave me his spare Fujitsu M2243AS >hard disk drive. This baby has a formatted storage capacity of >67 megabytes! YUMM. >The bad news is that I can't get it to format with my A2090 controller. I have heard from my local service rep that you can't tell the 2090 about a disk with greater than 50Mb capacity :-(. Maybe the new FS will solve this problem (let's hope). He said you must fool the formatter, by reducing the number of cylinders to make your disk look like a 50Mb, then you can at least use that much. >2. How do you add new flaws to the flaw map? > Isn't there a way to add additional flaws > to the flaw map, should they appear, without using prep? I don't think you can do this under UNIX, either. You must back up, reformat, and restore your disk (which is what I did). Diskdoctor does work on hard disks (just specify dh0:), and will facilitate your backing up. I'm not sure just what diskdoctor does exactly - it finds bad cylinders, and removes files which reside on them. My question is, does it somehow leave the questionable blocks off the free list - giving you a clean file system? Or is this just so that all remaining files are readable so you can grab what's left. I suspect it removes more files than it needs to. I think it trims an entire cylinders worth, rather than pinning it down the the specific bad block on that cylinder. Still, better than nothing, and good for the short term. If you've got an intelligent backup program that won't choke on bad blocks (MRbackup 1.3 fails here) you're better off. >3. Why does the format retry so much? It seems to be wasting its time > going for fifteen minutes on the same cylinder. And, why does it > quit instead of going to the next cylinder? I think this is all due to the 50Mb limit. Not a particularly graceful or informative error message :-|. -- Once in a while you get shown the light UUCP Address: in the strangest of places ...!{ihnp4,seismo,ucbcad,gatech}!masscomp!rad if you look at it right! -GD
kaz@cadovax.UUCP (11/24/87)
In article <2605@masscomp.UUCP> rad@masscomp.UUCP (Bob Doolittle) writes: >In article <1884@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: > >I have heard from my local service rep that you can't tell the 2090 >about a disk with greater than 50Mb capacity :-(. > Is this TRUE??? There is no documented limitation of 50Mb I have heard or read about. Could someone at Commodore please confirm or deny this? > >>3. Why does the format retry so much? It seems to be wasting its time >> going for fifteen minutes on the same cylinder. And, why does it >> quit instead of going to the next cylinder? >I think this is all due to the 50Mb limit. Not a particularly graceful >or informative error message :-|. > I don't think if there is such a limit, that that is my problem. Cylindar 205 is only about 18Mb into the drive. There are a total of 754 cylindars with 11 heads each on this drive, so I am nowhere near 50Mb when format starts having trouble. Thanks for your response, Bob, but I hope more answers to the original posting are forthcomming. Kerry Zimmerman # {ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!cadovax!kaz Contel Business Systems 213-323-8170 A difference between an amateur and a professional, is that a professional has the right tools.
grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) (11/25/87)
In article <1888@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: > In article <2605@masscomp.UUCP> rad@masscomp.UUCP (Bob Doolittle) writes: > >In article <1884@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: > > > >I have heard from my local service rep that you can't tell the 2090 > >about a disk with greater than 50Mb capacity :-(. > > > > Is this TRUE??? There is no documented limitation of 50Mb I have heard > or read about. Could someone at Commodore please confirm or deny this? The current filesystem limitations are 56 MB per >>>> PARTITION <<<< and the A2090 controller supports drives with up to 8 heads. The first item establishs an implicit limitation of file size, the second excludes some of the previouly exotic 16-head drives that are finally showing up in retail/surplus channels. You should still be able to use them with in SCSI flavor or with a SCSI adaptor. -- George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {uunet|ihnp4|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr but no way officially representing arpa: cbmvax!grr@uunet.uu.net Commodore, Engineering Department fone: 215-431-9255 (only by moonlite)
andy@cbmvax.UUCP (Andy Finkel) (11/25/87)
In article <1888@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: >In article <2605@masscomp.UUCP> rad@masscomp.UUCP (Bob Doolittle) writes: >>In article <1884@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: >> >>I have heard from my local service rep that you can't tell the 2090 >>about a disk with greater than 50Mb capacity :-(. Actually, the current file system limits you to 54meg per partition, not per disk. You can have multiple partitions on a disk. And, especially as DiskDoctor currently needs 2 meg of ram per 20 meg of partition to work, there are additional uses of smaller partitions. >> > >Is this TRUE??? There is no documented limitation of 50Mb I have heard >or read about. Could someone at Commodore please confirm or deny this? > >> >>>3. Why does the format retry so much? It seems to be wasting its time >>> going for fifteen minutes on the same cylinder. And, why does it >>> quit instead of going to the next cylinder? The hard disk device tries a block 50 (or so) times (write/read/verify) before deciding its useless and adding it to the bad block table. It shouldn't quit, unless its filled up the first 2 cylinders with bad blocks. Probably something else is wrong; >>I think this is all due to the 50Mb limit. Not a particularly graceful >>or informative error message :-|. >> > >I don't think if there is such a limit, that that is my problem. Cylindar >205 is only about 18Mb into the drive. There are a total of 754 cylindars >with 11 heads each on this drive, so I am nowhere near 50Mb when format >starts having trouble. Ah...the controller card supports drives of up to 8 heads. 11 is right out. -- andy finkel {ihnp4|seismo|allegra}!cbmvax!andy Commodore-Amiga, Inc. "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo." Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share. I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
steve@etn-rad.UUCP (Steve Childress) (11/28/87)
In article <1888@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: >In article <2605@masscomp.UUCP> rad@masscomp.UUCP (Bob Doolittle) writes: >>In article <1884@cadovax.UUCP> kaz@cadovax.UUCP (Kerry Zimmerman) writes: >> >>I have heard from my local service rep that you can't tell the 2090 >>about a disk with greater than 50Mb capacity :-(. >> > > >I don't think if there is such a limit, that that is my problem. Cylindar >205 is only about 18Mb into the drive. There are a total of 754 cylindars >with 11 heads each on this drive, so I am nowhere near 50Mb when format >starts having trouble. > Don't know if this'll help, but: I wrote a device driver, from scratch (whew!) to interface a Western Digital disk controller to which there are attached (1) a Syquest cartridge winchester and (2) an Atasi 40MB drive. Now in the Western Digital (WD) controllers, there can be at most 8 heads, but the cylinder numbers can extend to 2**16 because there are two, 8-bit registers. In the systems we're discussing, someone could, perhaps, truncate the high 8 bits of the cylinder no. in the driver. As far as I know, AmigaDOS can support a disk with 2**32 bytes of storage, per partition. Using MOUNTLIST, you can establish several physical partitions on the single physical drive, thus accomodating a drive with more than 2**32 bytes. steve childress ...wlbr!etn-rad!steve 818/706-5247
farren@gethen.UUCP (Michael J. Farren) (11/29/87)
In article <310@etn-rad.UUCP> steve@etn-rad.UUCP (Steve Childress) writes: >Now in the Western Digital (WD) controllers, there can be at most 8 >heads, but the cylinder numbers can extend to 2**16 because there are >two, 8-bit registers. I have been lead to believe (through discussions on comp.sys.att), that there is a new WD controller, for the most part pin-compatible with the existing chip, which will allow 9 head operation. Several people have reported using this to allow their AT&T 7300's, which are normally limited to 67Meg formatted capacity disks, to fully utilize a 130Meg disk. It might be an interesting exercise to see if the 2090 could be adapted to use one of these new chips. -- ---------------- Michael J. Farren "... if the church put in half the time on covetousness unisoft!gethen!farren that it does on lust, this would be a better world ..." gethen!farren@lll-winken.arpa Garrison Keillor, "Lake Wobegon Days"
sns@acp.UUCP (12/03/87)
In article <2859@cbmvax.UUCP>, grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) writes: > > The current filesystem limitations are 56 MB per >>>> PARTITION <<<< Actually, the maximum partition size is :- 26 bitmap block ptrs * 127 long-words per bitmap block * 32 bits per bitmap block ------ 105664 blocks/partition = about 52Mb (51.6Mb) My company has developed a hard disk subsystem for the Amiga using SCSI. The driver scans the SCSI bus to look for active hard disks. It then constructs device tables for each hard disk, and for large drives (e.g. over 52Mb) it breaks the drive down into a number of logic partitions. The nice thing about doing it this way is the end-user can ignore the whole problem of device & partition sizes. For example, if a 100Mb drive and a 20Mb drive is connected (as on my work Amiga-2000), then three logical partitions are created. This seems to be a workable solution to the partition & mountlist problems. sssss n n sssss Stuart Nixon (Australian Computer Products) s nn n s Phone: +61 9 322 6497 sssss n n n sssss Usenet: ...{decvax,hplabs}!munnari!acp.oz!sns s n nn s ARPAnet: sns%acp.oz@seismo.css.gov sssss n n sssss ACSnet: sns@acp.oz