daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (01/15/88)
in article <2808@homxc.UUCP>, jonny@homxc.UUCP (J.HILL) says: > Keywords: missing disk pin, second drive > > This one should blow a few micro minds. Well, this posting did. > I followed the simple installation instructions to the letter > and powered up with a workbench disk in drive one. The disk > light came on and stayed on, but no telltale disk head noises > ensued. The the screen flashed the workbench disk request icon -- > recall that workbench was already in the disk drive. I powered > down and tried it again, with the same result. Next I tried booting > on some other disks, but got the same request for workbench. The second > drive light never came on during any of this. And by the way, > the first drive worked fine before I installed the second internal > drive. You may have had a second drive with it's jumpers incorrectly set. There are on-drive jumper blocks on every 3.5" drive, and no two manufacturers make them the same way. They're supposed to be shipped in the proper position for DF1: regardless of maker. > Can you guess what I found? There is a 34 pin ribbon cable > connector next to the power supply. Since the jumper pins you > connect to tell the system about the second internal drive are > underneath this cable, I had to lift the female socket to install > the jumper. The second time I lifted it I noticed that one of the > 34 pins coming up from the motherboard had taken a hike. Can > anyone out there guess where it went? Into the socket, of course. > Permanently. It had sheared off completely at the base. No it didn't. That's what's called a KEY. The 34 pin connector looks something like this (side view): O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O X O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O The "X" there is your missing pin. And it's supposed to be missing. And the corresponding pin on the mating connector is supposed to be filled. That's how we prevent people from accidently plugging in this connector wrong. Who would? Last week I would have asked myself who would go crazy over a keying pin... > Up to this time I assumed the pin had just been faulty and > had separated when I pulled up the socket, but when I got to Family > Computers, there was another irate costumer there for the same reason: > I mean same pin, same malfunction. Sounds like your store may have received a batch of add-on 3.5" drives that are jumpered incorrectly. If you know the manufacturer, I could find out the proper jumper arrangement with no problem. Or maybe you're just having trouble installing the things right. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THOSE A2000s, HOWEVER! > So the store manager started opening A2000 cartons. Guess what he found? > Four more brand new 2000's with the same pin severed from the motherboard. I should hope so, they're supposed to be that way. > He finally found one machine, his last, from an earlier shipment that had > all of its teeth, and both my internal drives now live happily together. The first machines out went out with non-keyed drive connectors. I've got a few early boards without the keying around here. It's a bit more dangerous (at least I though it was!) having the non-keyed connector, but no reason to hold up production. The keyed pin isn't connected to anything, so it doesn't hurt if it's actually connected to the ribbon cable. > My advice to all 2000 owners is to open your cabinets right away and > check the 3.5 inch drive ribbon cable connector next to the power supply. > ... If yours is gone too, take it back before the warranty expires, or you > might as well install a can of dog meat where the second drive should go. Hopefully they won't take that advise, it's very wrong. > Lastly, I would really like to hear from the Commodore staff who post > to this news group. Here I be. > Do you folks know about the SEVERED PIN SCANDAL yet, and how for god's sake > did this happen? Could it have been, maybe, I dunno, SATAN! Or should we talk about the FALSE ALARM SCANDAL that could be sending many A2000 owners into senseless and needless panic. If you're having problems with the second floppy drive, chances are probably better than 99.9999% that the darn thing's jumpered wrong. I don't know which vendor's drives they're using this week (could be anyone, they seem to change all the time), but I'll try and post some jumper maps for the more common drives as soon as possible. > This is one for the books. All of them. Definitely going down in mine... > Jon Hill -- Dave Haynie "The B2000 Guy" Commodore-Amiga "The Crew That Never Rests" {ihnp4|uunet|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: D-DAVE H BIX: hazy "I can't relax, 'cause I'm a Boinger!"
STEVEG@MAINE.BITNET (Steve E. Goldsmith) (01/16/88)
A dealers point of view on the A2000 disk cable 'missing pin' and life in general. We have noticed this missing pin in the drive cable on alot of our machines, it didn't come to mind that it was a cable 'keying' method. We had a customer return a 2000 because he thought that he broke the ribon connector. After seeing the cable I thought how could on *possibly* break a pin in the middle of the cable? One of the four end pins perhapps, but no one could break one in the middle. After that logic, we connected up the drive. No dice, DF0: light stayed on, odd things happened. After looking at the 2010 in DF1: we saw 4 jumper slots, which we correctly guessed were device select (0, 1, ,2 ,3 ). Interestingly tho the drive came pinned as unit 0. Kind of silly as the 2010 as df0: was not the same brand as the one purchased for df1: so why would an add on drive be pinned as df0:?? Anyway, it makes a nice story and takes up bandwith. The point I tried to make when I started this was Commodore, Dave or whoever there decides on these last minute changes, PLEASE PLEASE take an extra hour to print up an addendum to the docs so we don't have to second guess and so mass histeria does not creep in as a result?? The 2010's we were shipped in the last batch were chinnon drives, the a2000's were motherboard rev 4.3. The documentation was from another time zone, in another era. /Steve Computer Corner Robotto Electronics Maine...
rodger@hpmrtca.UUCP (01/16/88)
/ hpmrtca:comp.sys.amiga / jonny@homxc.UUCP (J.HILL) / 1:16 pm Jan 13, 1988 / >The second time I lifted it I noticed that one of the >34 pins coming up from the motherboard had taken a hike. Can >anyone out there guess where it went? Into the socket, of course. >Permanently. It had sheared off completely at the base. You aren't the first person to notice this. Someone post a simular note about someone elses 2000. Something fishy is going on here. >Four more brand new 2000's with the same pin severed from the >motherboard. You can spot the problem just by looking at the connector >without removing the socket. In other words, at least six of the >machines in his shipment came from the factory with severed disk pins. Do you spot a trend here? The same pin, on the same connector? On almost all the machines? What a coincidence! What are the odds of this happening by accident? >My advice to all 2000 owners is to open your cabinets right away and >check the 3.5 inch drive ribbon cable connector next to the power supply. >Standing in the front of the machine, it would be the second pin in from >the back, left hand row. If yours is gone too, take it back before >the warranty expires, or you might as well install a can of dog meat >where the second drive should go. When I installed my second drive, I noticed this problem too. I was also a bit worried, since I didn't want to give up my new 2000, even for a little while. So I checked the schematic in the book that came with my 2000 to see how important that pin was. Maybe I could get along without it. Guess what? That pin (pin 3, I believe) is a key. It's supposed to be missing. Commodore's only mistake is using the cut off pin to plug up the hole, instead of a more expensive plastic pin. So, I plug my cable in, put my 2000 together, and have been using it ever since, without any problems. I have three drives now, DF0, DF1, (the second internal) and DF2, my external drive from my 1000. All work fine. > > Jon Hill > Bell Laboratories > Holmdel, N. J. > Rm. 3k-324 > 201 949-0117 Rodger Anderson (hplabs!hpcea!hpmrtca!rodger) (If you reply by email, and ) (are using the news header, ) (leave out hpdml80. )
gore@nucsrl.UUCP (Jacob Gore) (01/19/88)
/ nucsrl:comp.sys.amiga / daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) / Jan 14, 1988 / >>in article <2808@homxc.UUCP>, jonny@homxc.UUCP (J.HILL) says: >> [...] The second time I lifted it I noticed that one of the >> 34 pins coming up from the motherboard had taken a hike. Can >> anyone out there guess where it went? Into the socket, of course. >> Permanently. It had sheared off completely at the base. > >No it didn't. That's what's called a KEY. The 34 pin connector looks >something like this (side view): > > O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O > O X O O O O O O O O O O O O O O O > >The "X" there is your missing pin. And it's supposed to be missing. And >the corresponding pin on the mating connector is supposed to be filled. >That's how we prevent people from accidently plugging in this connector >wrong. Who would? Last week I would have asked myself who would go crazy >over a keying pin... J.HILL's posting implies that there was something that looked like a broken-off pin in the corresponding hole in the socket. If that's the case, then his deduction was very reasonable. I have recently dealt with cables where the socket slot corresponding to the missing (keying) pin was filled with plastic. No problem, no panic. It seems to me that whoever made this connection brought this on themselves. Jacob Gore gore@EECS.NWU.Edu Northwestern Univ., EECS Dept. {gargoyle,ihnp4,chinet}!nucsrl!gore
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (01/22/88)
in article <8060001@nucsrl.UUCP>, gore@nucsrl.UUCP (Jacob Gore) says: > J.HILL's posting implies that there was something that looked like a > broken-off pin in the corresponding hole in the socket. If that's the case, > then his deduction was very reasonable. His deduction was OK, based on a sample of one. However, unless you're an expert (and even maybe if you are), such a deduction should not be treated with such alarm. And as someone else mentioned, a quick check of the INCLUDED schematics would have shown that pin to be a key. After sampling a number of A2000's, that conclusion was a bad one. Certainly not sure enough to start a panic. > I have recently dealt with cables where the socket slot corresponding to the > missing (keying) pin was filled with plastic. No problem, no panic. If, as you've say above, you've dealt with these pins, you should know very well that they don't shear off. They can bend, and even occasionally break from fatigue, but they're not brittle enough to break like that. And I can't imagine one breaking accidently while the neighbors are untouched. I've drawn enough blood on pins like there to know their characteristics. A person who doesn't know anything about them should learn more. There's a difference between drawing a conclusion and jumping to one. > It seems to me that whoever made this connection brought this on themselves. It seems to me that anyone not qualified to install floppy drive should get someone else to do it for them. > Jacob Gore gore@EECS.NWU.Edu > Northwestern Univ., EECS Dept. {gargoyle,ihnp4,chinet}!nucsrl!gore -- Dave Haynie "The B2000 Guy" Commodore-Amiga "The Crew That Never Rests" {ihnp4|uunet|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: D-DAVE H BIX: hazy "I can't relax, 'cause I'm a Boinger!"
lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) (01/22/88)
i don't know about you, but I saw the same problem when I got mine, yet when I
plugged in my 2nd drive, it worked just fine...so don't fret your tails off
about it 8^). it's somethin ya gotta live with.
also,my B2000 (what motherboard says) calls AGNES the 'FAT LADY' (don't
believe me? just check the board right behind the floppies and in front of
the power supply.
Larry Greenwald
UUCP: crash!pnet01!lgreen (Geez, I hope I got that right...)
UUCP: {cbosgd hplabs!hp-sdd sdcsvax nosc}!crash!pnet01!lgreen
ARPA: crash!pnet01!lgreen@nosc.mil
INET: lgreen@pnet01.cts.comdaveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (01/26/88)
in article <2398@crash.cts.com>, lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) says: > also,my B2000 (what motherboard says) calls AGNES the 'FAT LADY' (don't > believe me? just check the board right behind the floppies and in front of > the power supply. Yup, that's there all right. I'm not exactly sure where that came from; the chip is called Fat Agnes, even on the schematics. It was labelled FAT LADY on the PCB ever since the first board we did, and I never thought to change it. The other chips are labelled normally, except BUSTER, which isn't. > Larry Greenwald -- Dave Haynie "The B2000 Guy" Commodore-Amiga "The Crew That Never Rests" {ihnp4|uunet|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: D-DAVE H BIX: hazy "I can't relax, 'cause I'm a Boinger!"