mike@ames.arpa (Mike Smithwick) (03/26/88)
>Yes, Mr. Casey - you have hit the nail squarely on the head. >Us loyal A1000 owners, whose purchases helped to SAVE Commodore, are >now being $%#%$*@#'ed over for our troubles. I, too, will not buy another >Commodore machine. #define FLAME_ON TRUE Well, I guess you'll never buy another computer in your lifetime if you take that kind of attitude. When I bought my machine, I knew good-n-well that I was taking risks. Risk #1 : As with any first model computer of a new line, the first major inhancements would probably be go off the the upgrade path. Risk #2 : C= almost bit-the-big-one which would've really made it major-hard to upgrade our machines. >I'm not against the A2000, or A2500, or whatever. But DAMN it, they could >make sure that we can upgrade. What's wrong with using the card cage from ASDG?? With that you should be able to use most any A-2000 board with your machine. Ooops, I forgot, you're not buying Commodore anymore. >Well, Commodore, here's another customer you've just lost, and you can >be sure that I'll not recommend the Amiga to anyone I know. Now there's a logic-free argument for you. I remember hearing the same kind of whining from the first Macintosh owners because they felt that Apple owed them a thousand bucks or a free memory upgrade or something, for paying the (outragiously) high price. If they didn't want to pay that they shouldn't have bought the damn things in the first place. >}For example, how about the CEBIT announcement about enhanced graphics >}chips being available sometime (with no interlace) for the 500 and >}2000. THERE'S A NUMBER MISSING IN THERE, COMMODORE. HEAR ME??? I don't expect C= to pay my way. Nor do I expect IBM to continue supporting the original PC, or C= to upgrade my Pet-2001. >I hear and agree. Unfortunately, I am not CBM. Do they hear? >Probably. Will they do anything? Doubtful. *** mike *** -- *** mike (Cyberpunk in training) smithwick *** "After all, isn't our only real purpose in life merely to make the person next to us slightly more insane than we are?" - Me [disclaimer : nope, I don't work for NASA, I take full blame for my ideas]
arcarese@andromeda.rutgers.edu (John C Arcarese) (03/27/88)
> > >>}For example, how about the CEBIT announcement about enhanced graphics >>}chips being available sometime (with no interlace) for the 500 and >>}2000. THERE'S A NUMBER MISSING IN THERE, COMMODORE. HEAR ME??? > >I don't expect C= to pay my way. > >*** mike *** > I also don't expect Commodore to pay my way, but I do *hope* that the enhanced chipset will be made available to *ALL* Amiga owners. There may not be an official upgrade, but they may be able to be kludged onto existing 1000's. John A.
sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) (03/27/88)
In article <6494@ames.arpa> mike@ames.arc.nasa.gov.UUCP (Mike Smithwick) writes: >>Yes, Mr. Casey - you have hit the nail squarely on the head. >>Us loyal A1000 owners, whose purchases helped to SAVE Commodore, are >>now being $%#%$*@#'ed over for our troubles. I, too, will not buy another >>Commodore machine. > >#define FLAME_ON TRUE > >Well, I guess you'll never buy another computer in your lifetime if you >take that kind of attitude. [Basically describes the compaint as "whining"] It's not whining, bub. I bought my A1000 and less than 4 months later they were announcing the A2000. Well, I would have bought an A2000 if I KNEW ABOUT IT! So here I am with a computer that has been effectively abandoned hardware-wise by it's company less than 4 months after I bought it. That sucks. I will not buy another *Commodore* computer, not because I am mad (and I am), but because there's nothing to say that they won't do the same exact thing again. I will consider other brands of computers, however, especially those that demonstrate a willingness to support their customers. Sean -- *** Sean Casey sean@ms.uky.edu, sean@ukma.bitnet *** The Empire Nutcase {rutgers,uunet,cbosgd}!ukma!sean *** University of Kentucky / Lexington Kentucky / USA *** "Hmmm, I wonder what this button does..."
kenchiu@phoenix.Princeton.EDU (Kenneth Chiu) (03/28/88)
In article <8698@g.ms.uky.edu> sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) writes: >It's not whining, bub. I bought my A1000 and less than 4 months later they were >announcing the A2000. Well, I would have bought an A2000 if I KNEW ABOUT IT! Hmm...this is a little after the fact..but many dealers (including retail stores) were offering to let you upgrade to the 2000 and keep your 1000 for $1000 some dollars. If you then sold your 1000 for $400, you would have about broken even, depending on the exact prices you got. Ken Chiu
rpa@gos.ukc.ac.uk (R.P.Almeida) (03/28/88)
In article <489@galaxy> arcarese@andromeda.UUCP (John C Arcarese) writes: >I also don't expect Commodore to pay my way, but I do *hope* that the >enhanced chipset will be made available to *ALL* Amiga owners. There >may not be an official upgrade, but they may be able to be kludged onto >existing 1000's. > > John A. What about the people like me in England and the rest of Europe who have the German designed A2000, with only 512K on the main board? What do we do ? My A2000 has just come back from 4 months at Extel Systems, the people who repair machines for Commodore(UK) under warranty. Apparantly Extel were waiting for parts from Commodore(UK). IT STILL DOESNT WORK PROPERLY. Well i know what type of computer I'm not going to buy next time. (and that doesnt mean Atari :-) ) Richard.
eric@hector.UUCP (Eric Lavitsky) (03/28/88)
In article <8698@g.ms.uky.edu> sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) writes: >In article <6494@ames.arpa> mike@ames.arc.nasa.gov.UUCP (Mike Smithwick) writes: >[Basically describes the compaint as "whining"] > >It's not whining, bub. I bought my A1000 and less than 4 months later they were >announcing the A2000. Well, I would have bought an A2000 if I KNEW ABOUT IT! > >So here I am with a computer that has been effectively abandoned hardware-wise >by it's company less than 4 months after I bought it. That sucks. Give me a break asshole. You could have taken advantage of the trade in offer - your 1000 + the $1K would have ended up being around the same price as a brand new A2000 at the time. >I will not buy another *Commodore* computer, not because I am mad (and I am), >but because there's nothing to say that they won't do the same exact thing >again. Good. So sell your 1000 and get off the net. >I will consider other brands of computers, however, especially those that >demonstrate a willingness to support their customers. I suppose CATS's and the hardware folks presence on the net and Bix constitute a definite showing of "no support", eh? >Sean Eric ARPA: eric@topaz.rutgers.edu "Lithium is no longer available UUCP: ...{wherever!}ulysses!eric on credit..." ...{wherever!}rutgers!topaz!eric - from Buckaroo Banzai SNAIL: 34 Maplehurst Ln, Piscataway, NJ 08854
sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) (03/29/88)
[Sorry about this article, but Eric deemed it necessary to call me an asshole in a public group in response to my complaints directed at Commodore] In article <10187@ulysses.homer.nj.att.com> eric@hector (Eric Lavitsky) writes: >>So here I am with a computer that has been effectively abandoned hardware-wise >>by it's company less than 4 months after I bought it. That sucks. > >Give me a break asshole. You could have taken advantage of the trade in >offer - your 1000 + the $1K would have ended up being around the same >price as a brand new A2000 at the time. No bullshit, bat brain. Unfortunately, I didn't have $1000. Or was that so difficult to figure out? >>I will not buy another *Commodore* computer, not because I am mad (and I am), >>but because there's nothing to say that they won't do the same exact thing >>again. > >Good. So sell your 1000 and get off the net. What an arrogant ass you are. If you want to get personal, fine, but lets take it to email. >>I will consider other brands of computers, however, especially those that >>demonstrate a willingness to support their customers. > >I suppose CATS's and the hardware folks presence on the net and Bix constitute >a definite showing of "no support", eh? Hardware support, noodlehead, hardware support. Most specificially I was referring to the announcement of non-interlace chips for the 500 amd 2000, but not the 1000. Even with a 2000-in-1, how am I going to use these chip upgrades? Sean -- *** Sean Casey sean@ms.uky.edu, sean@ukma.bitnet *** The Empire Nutcase {rutgers,uunet,cbosgd}!ukma!sean *** University of Kentucky / Lexington Kentucky / USA *** "Hmmm, I wonder what this button does..."
eric@hector.UUCP (Eric Lavitsky) (03/30/88)
In article <8713@g.ms.uky.edu> sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) writes: >[Sorry about this article, but Eric deemed it necessary to call me an asshole >in a public group in response to my complaints directed at Commodore] > >In article <10187@ulysses.homer.nj.att.com> eric@hector (Eric Lavitsky) writes: >>>So here I am with a computer that has been effectively abandoned hardware-wise >>>by it's company less than 4 months after I bought it. That sucks. >> >>Give me a break asshole. You could have taken advantage of the trade in >>offer - your 1000 + the $1K would have ended up being around the same >>price as a brand new A2000 at the time. > >No bullshit, bat brain. Unfortunately, I didn't have $1000. Or was that so >difficult to figure out? So why the hell did you complain about how you "would have bought an A2000 if you knew it was coming", when you didn't even have the money in the first place???! >>>I will not buy another *Commodore* computer, not because I am mad (and I am), >>>but because there's nothing to say that they won't do the same exact thing >>>again. >> >>Good. So sell your 1000 and get off the net. > >What an arrogant ass you are. If you want to get personal, fine, but lets >take it to email. Hey I apologize for getting "arrogant" (I consider it more like "pissed"), but admit that your messages haven't been completely "constructive" either. In any event this is the last you'll hear from me about it. You vented some steam in public and so did I. <>>I will consider other brands of computers, however, especially those that <>>demonstrate a willingness to support their customers. <> <>I suppose CATS's and the hardware folks presence on the net and Bix constitute <>a definite showing of "no support", eh? < <Hardware support, noodlehead, hardware support. Most specificially I was <referring to the announcement of non-interlace chips for the 500 amd 2000, <but not the 1000. Even with a 2000-in-1, how am I going to use these chip <upgrades? This is oooooollld news my friend - besides, without the new monitor, you're not going to be able to take advantage of the non-interlaced stuff anyway (can you say "even more money"?). Try and be happy with what you have - it's the best you're money could have bought you at the time. Stop thinking that hardware support is equivalent to software support - it's not. <Sean Eric ARPA: eric@topaz.rutgers.edu "Lithium is no longer available UUCP: ...{wherever!}ulysses!eric on credit..." ...{wherever!}rutgers!topaz!eric - from Buckaroo Banzai SNAIL: 34 Maplehurst Ln, Piscataway, NJ 08854
dca@kesmai.COM (David C. Albrecht) (03/30/88)
In article <8713@g.ms.uky.edu>, sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) writes: > >>So here I am with a computer that has been effectively abandoned hardware-wise > >>by it's company less than 4 months after I bought it. That sucks. > > > No bullshit, bat brain. Unfortunately, I didn't have $1000. Or was that so > difficult to figure out? > > >>I will not buy another *Commodore* computer, not because I am mad (and I am), > >>but because there's nothing to say that they won't do the same exact thing > >>again. > > > Hardware support, noodlehead, hardware support. Most specificially I was > referring to the announcement of non-interlace chips for the 500 amd 2000, > but not the 1000. Even with a 2000-in-1, how am I going to use these chip > upgrades? So you should have sold your 1000 and gotten a 500. You would have had hardware support (since that is where the greater mass is going to be anyway) it shouldn't have cost you much money either. (Cost of new 500 - money received for 1000) shouldn't be more than $200 max. The fact is that the 500 is the current equivalent to the 1000, NOT the 2000. Personally, I think upgrading to the currently most popular machine for under $200 is a bargain. Pre-announcing products is a great way to go out of business, ask Mr. Morrow, it would have been terrible business practice for Commodore to pre-announce the 2000 when they are still only selling 1000s. This issue has been beaten to death in this group already. If you want chip level compatibility you should have either upgraded to the 2000 during the trade in offer or bought a 500 and sold your 1000. The 1000 is extensible to use most of the peripherals of the 2000 and is essentially software compatible with the 2000 so its still a quite useful machine (some people would say more useful than a 500). Companies that support their users to the bitter end usually do so by screwing them to the wall when they purchase their machine. The price they pay usually is quite well padded to provide for all those support services. Not to mention the price for service etc. If you want all that support maybe you should go spend 1.5 * price of a 500 to get a Mac Plus for a machine that part wise probably costs 1/2 as much to make. I seriously doubt, however, you'll be much happier with their hardware support as I haven't seen too many MAC II products that plug in the Mac Plus. David Albrecht
sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) (03/30/88)
In article <10197@ulysses.homer.nj.att.com> eric@hector (Eric Lavitsky) writes: >So why the hell did you complain about how you "would have bought an A2000 >if you knew it was coming", when you didn't even have the money in the first >place???! I had the money to buy an A2000, but not 4 months later. >Hey I apologize for getting "arrogant" (I consider it more like "pissed"), >but admit that your messages haven't been completely "constructive" either. >In any event this is the last you'll hear from me about it. You vented some >steam in public and so did I. If my messages convey my dissapointment with Commodore, then they are entirely successful. Sean -- *** Sean Casey sean@ms.uky.edu, sean@ukma.bitnet *** The Empire Nutcase {rutgers,uunet,cbosgd}!ukma!sean *** University of Kentucky / Lexington Kentucky / USA *** "Hmmm, I wonder what this button does..."
keithd@cadovax.UUCP (Keith Doyle) (03/30/88)
In article <489@galaxy> arcarese@andromeda.UUCP (John C Arcarese) writes: >I also don't expect Commodore to pay my way, but I do *hope* that the >enhanced chipset will be made available to *ALL* Amiga owners. There >may not be an official upgrade, but they may be able to be kludged onto >existing 1000's. Yes, but the real question is: How are you with a soldering iron? Keith Doyle # {ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!cadovax!keithd Contel Business Systems 213-323-8170
keithd@cadovax.UUCP (Keith Doyle) (04/01/88)
In article <8713@g.ms.uky.edu> sean@ms.uky.edu (Sean Casey) writes: >Hardware support, noodlehead, hardware support. Most specificially I was >referring to the announcement of non-interlace chips for the 500 amd 2000, >but not the 1000. Even with a 2000-in-1, how am I going to use these chip >upgrades? Well, I suppose C= could decide NOT to provide new non-interlace 1MB chip ram chips just so we can all remain fully compatible with the A1000, a machine designed before anyone thought of enhancing the chips. Is that what you consider hardware support? Keeping us all held back to no more than the A1000 can handle? Or maybe they should have had ESP and known years ago when the A1000 was designed that they might someday want to make various unspecified changes to various designs, and hooked the entire CPU bus up to all of the custom chips? I mean, I don't know what the hell you expect, them to produce a completely redesigned A1000 board and try to get all the dealers to do installations? If they did that, due to the costs and (relatively small) quantities involved, it would cost you a good $1000 anyway, so you'd have been better off trading in on a 2000. Ask a Mac owner how much the replace-the- entire-board upgrades for the Mac's have cost. And that assumes you have a decent network of dealers that like to actually DO hardware updates, which may be assuming a lot. And even then, you'll be without your machine for awhile. Keith Doyle # {ucbvax,decvax}!trwrb!cadovax!keithd Contel Business Systems 213-323-8170
mp1u+@andrew.cmu.edu (Michael Portuesi) (04/01/88)
Look.
We have already gone through the "my A1000 is obsolete because the A2000 has
been introduced" war. We are now about to start the "my A2000 is obsolete
because the A2500 has been introduced" war, along with the "my A1000 is
becoming even more obsolete because C-A has introduced now chips" war.
*****CAN WE STOP THIS NOW???????*****
It gets nobody anywhere. I am still happy with my A1000. If and when C-A
makes a sufficient improvement to justify a whole new computer system, I'll
think about spending my money on it (hopefully I'll be able to afford it then).
One piece of well-justified flame...when will the 2000-and-1 come out, or is
ASDG joining the ranks of other vaporware distributors? Would it be possible
for someone to produce a box with two Zorro II slots and a coprocessor slot for
the A1000? I think that would have been the ideal design for the 2001-and-1 in
the first place.
--M
Michael Portuesi / Carnegie Mellon University
ARPA/UUCP: mp1u+@andrew.cmu.edu BITNET: rainwalker@drycas
"Paradise is exactly like where you are right now...only much, much better"
--Laurie Anderson, "Language is a Virus"