mfs@edison.GE.COM (mfs @ Somewhere in the Mountains) (06/09/88)
ACK! HELP! I have a new (4 month old) Amiga 500 that has started giving me all kinds of trouble with the disks. It seems everytime I turn around, I get the infamous 'Volume xxxx has a read/write error' requester. Sometimes I can edit or download for hours before this happens and sometimes it just takes a few minutes. I have tried all kinds of disks: Sony, BASF, Memorex and Generics. They all seem to eventually go bad. The funny thing is, when I run diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors on track 40. Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this! What exactly is going on here ?! AAAARRRRGGGG! Jeeze, is AmigaDOS that fragile ? Do I have a bad drive ? A virus ? Overheating problems ? Wimpy power supply ? (I have the A501, but only one drive) Any help or recommendations would be greatly appreciated!! Thanks, Martin
grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) (06/11/88)
In article <1544@edison.GE.COM> mfs@edison.GE.COM (mfs @ Somewhere in the Mountains) writes: > > I have a new (4 month old) Amiga 500 that has started giving me all > kinds of trouble with the disks. It seems everytime I turn around, I get > the infamous 'Volume xxxx has a read/write error' requester. Sometimes > I can edit or download for hours before this happens and sometimes it > just takes a few minutes. > > I have tried all kinds of disks: Sony, BASF, Memorex and Generics. > They all seem to eventually go bad. The funny thing is, when I run > diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors > on track 40. Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester > that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this! > What exactly is going on here ?! Sounds for sure like some kind of drive alignment problem or other drive related defect... -- George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {uunet|ihnp4|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr but no way officially representing arpa: cbmvax!grr@uunet.uu.net Commodore, Engineering Department fone: 215-431-9255 (only by moonlite)
doug-merritt@cup.portal.com (06/12/88)
Martin writes: >diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors >on track 40. This is invariably a symptom of some software doing "Delay(0)" (a bug in the OS later causes track 40 problems). You're probably using some old PD software; often these bugs get fixed in later releases, so (A) try upgrading any old software, and (B) try and pin down which s/w you ran just prior to finding the problem. >Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester >that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this! The name "Lazarus" is a joke. You know, like Heinlein's character Lazarus Long, who lived forever? But your disk didn't. Hey, it's not *my* joke. "Lazarus" may originally have been a biblical name (cohort of Methusaleh?). There's a small amount of extra information about this situation that I can't recall; I know I'm forgetting something... A recommendation: never, never, never use diskdoctor. It's just not very good. Instead use the freeware program Disksalv (from an early fish disk). It does a good job of recovering the damaged disk to a new disk. Doug -- Doug Merritt ucbvax!sun.com!cup.portal.com!doug-merritt or ucbvax!eris!doug (doug@eris.berkeley.edu) or ucbvax!unisoft!certes!doug
phils@tekigm2.TEK.COM (Philip E Staub) (06/12/88)
In article <4005@cbmvax.UUCP> grr@cbmvax.UUCP (George Robbins) writes: <In article <1544@edison.GE.COM> mfs@edison.GE.COM (mfs @ Somewhere in the Mountains) writes: <> <> I have a new (4 month old) Amiga 500 that has started giving me all <> kinds of trouble with the disks. It seems everytime I turn around, I get <> the infamous 'Volume xxxx has a read/write error' requester. Sometimes <> I can edit or download for hours before this happens and sometimes it <> just takes a few minutes. <> <> I have tried all kinds of disks: Sony, BASF, Memorex and Generics. <> They all seem to eventually go bad. The funny thing is, when I run <> diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors <> on track 40. Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester <> that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this! <> What exactly is going on here ?! < <Sounds for sure like some kind of drive alignment problem or other <drive related defect... < <-- <George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {uunet|ihnp4|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr <but no way officially representing arpa: cbmvax!grr@uunet.uu.net <Commodore, Engineering Department fone: 215-431-9255 (only by moonlite) Sounds more to me like the infamous Delay(0) bug. By any chance are you using an older version of Steve Drew's shell? (like about 2.4, I think). There was one of those versions which I had regular problems similar to what you describe. The shell had a certain configuration in which it could call Delay() with a parameter of '0' and somehow (I've never bothered to investigate either the source in the Shell or the cause of the problem in Delay, but I seem to remember Neil Katin posting something a while back indicating that the bug is indeed in Delay and would be fixed... sooner or later) To check this: don't use the shell. To fix: get a newer version. Also, Lazarus is the name which DiskDoctor gives any disk which it has "resurrected". Phil -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Phil Staub Tektronix, Inc., Vancouver, Washington 98668 phils@tekigm2.MEN.TEK.COM
phils@tekigm2.TEK.COM (Philip E Staub) (06/12/88)
In article <3052@tekigm2.TEK.COM> phils@tekigm2.UUCP I write: ... >you describe. The shell had a certain configuration in which it could call >Delay() with a parameter of '0' and somehow (I've never bothered to >investigate either the source in the Shell or the cause of the problem in >Delay, but I seem to remember Neil Katin posting something a while back >indicating that the bug is indeed in Delay and would be fixed... sooner or >later) ... Talk about a dangling run on sentence. Sorry about that. What I meant to say was that somehow the Delay(0) and the trashing of track 40 are related. Apparently, track 40 takes the hit most frequently since it is the location of the root block, and AmigaDos spends so much time there. Actually, I seem to recall reading about some other software packages which do this same thing, but the shell is the only one I've personally encountered. Phil -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Phil Staub Tektronix, Inc., Vancouver, Washington 98668 phils@tekigm2.MEN.TEK.COM
grr@cu-arpa.cs.cornell.edu (George Robbins) (06/13/88)
<In article <1544@edison.GE.COM> mfs@edison.GE.COM (mfs @ Somewhere in the
< Mountains) writes:
<>
<> [Misc failure mode stuff eaten...... along with list of disk types ]
<> They all seem to eventually go bad. The funny thing is, when I run
<> diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors
<> on track 40. Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester
^^^^^^^^^^
<> that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this!
<> What exactly is going on here ?!
<
<Sounds for sure like some kind of drive alignment problem or other
<drive related defect...
<
<--
<George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {uunet|ihnp4|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr
<but no way officially representing arpa: cbmvax!grr@uunet.uu.net
<Commodore, Engineering Department fone: 215-431-9255 (only by moonlite)
I suspect that i'm not really qualified to be commentingcu
about this but it sounds all like the infamous timer.device
bug....
(remember DELAY(0) folks?????)
TRACK 40 was what got eaten by this wasn't it?????
Jonathan Crone
1
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Jonathan P. Crone
Vice President, AURA, (Amiga Users of Regina Associated.)
(Regina, Sask. Canada ) (eh???)
CRONEJP@UREGINA1.BITNET
....rutgers!mimsy!uunet!mcl!cronejp
come on now.... does ANYONE give a damn about what i have to say?
--------------------------------------------------------------------andy@cbmvax.UUCP (Andy Finkel) (06/13/88)
In article <3052@tekigm2.TEK.COM> phils@tekigm2.UUCP (Philip E Staub) writes: >Delay, but I seem to remember Neil Katin posting something a while back >indicating that the bug is indeed in Delay and would be fixed... sooner or >later) > Timer.device ...the bug is in the timer.device. Delay calls the timer.device. -- andy finkel {ihnp4|seismo|allegra}!cbmvax!andy Commodore-Amiga, Inc. "C combines the power of assembly language with the flexibility of assembly language." Any expressed opinions are mine; but feel free to share. I disclaim all responsibilities, all shapes, all sizes, all colors.
mkd@mtunh.ATT.COM (Mark Darby) (06/14/88)
> Talk about a dangling run on sentence. Sorry about that. What I meant to say > was that somehow the Delay(0) and the trashing of track 40 are related. > Apparently, track 40 takes the hit most frequently since it is the location > of the root block, and AmigaDos spends so much time there. > > Actually, I seem to recall reading about some other software packages which > do this same thing, but the shell is the only one I've personally > encountered. > OK, here's a possible example.... I have a copy of the PROBE SEQUENCE demo disk. Just for the sake of burning in my AMIGA 500, I pop the disk in, do a bit of disk switching between the demo disk and the Workbench 1.2 disk, then I start the demo. It repeats automatically, so the machine does alot of disk I/O (I have 512K memory only). A couple of times, the demo completes with no problems. Then, occasionally, the demo stops and I get the message "Volume DDemo1 has a read/write error". Sometimes I click on "Retry", and the demo will continue. This message, when it appears, always appears at the same time (i.e. after a particular demo screen is shown). The demo uses "The Director." To see if the disk is corrupt, I made another copy of the demo disk, then used the new copy. The demo then ran uninterrupted for quite some time (more than 6 times) before I shut the machine off. Is the Delay(0) bug intermittent, thus possibly causing my intermittent demo interruption? Or am I possibly dealing with just a standard disk alignment problem? Mark K. Darby AT&T Information Systems phone: (201)957-2706 200 Laurel Ave. uucp:..!rutgers!mtune!mtunh!mkd Middletown, NJ 07748 or ..!ihnp4!attunix!mtunh!mkd
cjp@antique.UUCP (Charles Poirier) (06/14/88)
In article <6428@cup.portal.com> doug-merritt@cup.portal.com.UUCP writes: >Instead use the freeware program Disksalv (from an early fish disk). ^^^^^^^^ Shareware, I believe, unless he's changed its status. It's a great utility, and well worth sending Dave Haynie ten bucks or so. -- Charles Poirier (decvax,ucbvax,mcnc,attmail)!vax135!cjp "Docking complete... Docking complete... Docking complete..."
neil@amiga.UUCP (Neil Katin) (06/14/88)
In article <4010@cbmvax.UUCP> andy@cbmvax.UUCP (Andy Finkel) writes: >In article <3052@tekigm2.TEK.COM> phils@tekigm2.UUCP (Philip E Staub) writes: >>Delay, but I seem to remember Neil Katin posting something a while back >>indicating that the bug is indeed in Delay and would be fixed... sooner or >>later) >Timer.device ...the bug is in the timer.device. Delay calls the timer.device. Yes, It's fixed. Unfortunately, there's a very long lead time between us "fixing it in the lab" and it making it out there to the field. Sigh. Neil "waiting for 1.4" Katin
neil@amiga.UUCP (Neil Katin) (06/14/88)
In article <632@mtunh.ATT.COM> mkd@mtunh.ATT.COM (Mark Darby) writes: >Is the Delay(0) bug intermittent, thus possibly causing my intermittent demo >interruption? Or am I possibly dealing with just a standard disk alignment >problem? The Delay(0) bug is timing dependent (no surprise there...). Basically, it loses time from the previous request on the list: sometimes all of it. A continuous loop of Delay(0)'s and a continous loop of trackdisk operations will trash disks about on in 147,000 delays. This is about 3 minutes of wall clock time, when both the disk is continuously busy and there is an endless supply of Delay(0)'s. I have no doubt that some peoples systems will fail more often, but that's what my tests showed. The problem manifests itself by the trackdisk not waiting the proper amount of time while writing a track. Once again, this is fixed in 1.4. We're exploring ways to release a patch before that, but until we figure it out, the official line is "wait for 1.4". Neil Katin
bts@sas.UUCP (Brian T. Schellenberger) (06/15/88)
In article <6428@cup.portal.com> doug-merritt@cup.portal.com writes: |Martin writes: |The name "Lazarus" is a joke. You know, like Heinlein's character |Lazarus Long, who lived forever? But your disk didn't. Hey, it's not *my* joke. |"Lazarus" may originally have been a biblical name (cohort of Methusaleh?). Heavens, what are they teaching kids in school these days? Oh, sorry, ACLU took care of that. Talk about not knowing Western culture . . . Anyway, Lazarus is the first man whom Jesus Christ resurected. The Heinlein story was making a biblical allusion. Try watching "Jesus of Nazarath" next time it comes on (usually shows every Easter [that's in the spring]), on two nights). You'll probably learn a lot about your own culture. -- _______________________ __Brian___________________ |Brian T. Schellenberger| "The Earth is but one | ...!mcnc!rti!sas!bts | |104 Willoughby Lane | country, and Mankind its |work: (919) 467-8000 x7783| |Cary, NC 27513 | citizens" --Baha'u'llah |home: (919) 469-9389 |
mph@rover.UUCP (Mark Huth) (06/16/88)
In article <1544@edison.GE.COM> mfs@edison.GE.COM (mfs @ Somewhere in the Mountains) writes: >They all seem to eventually go bad. The funny thing is, when I run >diskdoctor on them, they all (with rare exceptions) have hard errors >on track 40. Also, after diskdoctor finishes, I get a requester >that says: Insert volume Lazarus. I have never had a disk named this! I suspect that the problem is the drive head. I had a drive that was very hard on disks when I got my 1000 a couple of years back. Reeally nasty, in that DF0: seemed to eat disks - like workbench and kickstart. I speculate that the head was not properly lapped and polished, and that it therefore got dirty quickly and wore out the disk at track 40 (root block and other good stuff). That was the drive that went for the 2000 upgrade trade! I have had no problems with the external drive, the other 1000, or the 2000 that I regularly abuse. Lazarus is the name given to the disk when diskdoctor resurects it from the dead! Mark Huth
doug-merritt@cup.portal.com (06/19/88)
I said: >Instead use the freeware program Disksalv (from an early fish disk). ^^^^^^^^ Charles Poirier replied: >Shareware, I believe, unless he's changed its status. Freeware means anything that is freely redistributable as opposed to commercial that you pay up front for. Freeware emphatically does not mean "public domain", but it *includes* that. It also includes things that are copyrighted but redistributable, it includes software covered by the GNU manifesto, and it includes shareware. In fact, the only reason the term exists at all is to cover several different "free" categories like that without having to name them off individually. I'm aware that some people use the term a little differently, but then again, that's true of most words, eh? Has the term made it into a late model dictionary yet? If you excluded shareware from the "freeware" category, then you'd have three categories altogether: freeware, shareware, commercial. I'd say that's a less useful kind of usage than simply "freeware vs. commercial". Doug -- Doug Merritt ucbvax!sun.com!cup.portal.com!doug-merritt or ucbvax!eris!doug (doug@eris.berkeley.edu) or ucbvax!unisoft!certes!doug
doug-merritt@cup.portal.com (06/22/88)
I wrote: >"Lazarus" may originally have been a biblical name (cohort of Methusaleh?). Brian Schellenberger wrote: >Heavens, what are they teaching kids in school these days? Oh, sorry, >ACLU took care of that. Talk about not knowing Western culture . . . I beg your pardon. That's rude and uncalled for. >Try watching "Jesus of Nazarath" [...] You'll probably learn a lot about >your own culture. Several people have informed me of who Lazarus was; you're the only one to do it in a self righteous and insulting way. Just for your information, for a non-Christian I'm actually quite well educated about Christian mythology. Compared with Christian scholars, I know nothing at all. But since you're such a hot shot, how would you like to chat with my friend Stan Kelly-Bootle? He's read the entire bible *in the original*. He learned Aramaic and the other dead languages of the originals just for that purpose. And has read all of the various Apocrypha and commentaries and all that stuff. ("But Stan, you're an atheist!" Reply: "Don't you think you should be well informed about what it is you disbelieve???") I'm sure you could get some cheap shots in on him with no problem. Doug P.S. The history of the Church has much to do with the roots of western culture. Knowledge of Christian mythology itself has more to do with understanding literary references than with the culture overall. Disguising religious intolerance in the form of cultural awareness is inaccurate and inadvisable. But let's trade flames via email, hmm? -- Doug Merritt ucbvax!sun.com!cup.portal.com!doug-merritt or ucbvax!eris!doug (doug@eris.berkeley.edu) or ucbvax!unisoft!certes!doug
mat@emcard.UUCP (Mat Waites) (06/24/88)
In article <6763@cup.portal.com> doug-merritt@cup.portal.com writes:
.
.Several people have informed me of who Lazarus was; you're the only
.one to do it in a self righteous and insulting way.
.
.Just for your information, for a non-Christian I'm actually quite
.well educated about Christian mythology. Compared with Christian
.scholars, I know nothing at all.
[...]
.
.Disguising religious intolerance in the form of cultural awareness
.is inaccurate and inadvisable. But let's trade flames via email, hmm?
.--
. Doug Merritt ucbvax!sun.com!cup.portal.com!doug-merritt
If you really wanted to trade by email, why didn't YOU????
More convinced of Lazurus's existence than Mr. Merritt's,
Mat
--
W Mat Waites | |
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