tope@enea.se (Tommy Petersson) (10/12/88)
In article <72318@sun.uucp> cmcmanis@sun.UUCP (Chuck McManis) writes: -In article <5380001@otter.hple.hp.com> (Lee Carter) writes: -> Okay, okay, I give up! Does anyone have any information on when (if -> ever) the video toaster is going to be released. I saw blurb about this -> device almost a year ago and thought "Great!! sounds just what I need!" -> So, can anybody help with the latest rumours about price, release date, -> etc. - -Next year maybe. NewTek made mistake #7 in the computer industry. For those -of you who are would-be entrepreneurs note this lesson now and don't make -yourself a victim of it. - -Simply stated, mistake #7 is : "Setting price and/or price-expectations -before a product is in production." A lot of small companies are anxious -to get a product out the door as soon as possible. They are also eager -to build up "presales" publicity to ensure both acceptance and quantiy -buying of their product. The mistake they make is when the product is -*almost* done, by saying something like "It will cost less than `n' dollars!" -or "For about the price of a <insert well known thing> you will be able -to buy this.", or the sin of all sins "It will cost $n." What happens to -these companies is that they get to the production stage and find that -if they sell their new product at the "promised" price they are either -not going to make any money or even lose money. So now they are in a -double bind, they can either a) Not release the product and eat their -losses now, or b) Release the product at the higher price and make a lot -of people mad because they feel mislead. Or in the case of NewTek who -is suffering from the cost of DRAMs, delay the product and hope that the -price of RAM will come down to the levels they were when they announced -the price. - -It isn't a nice situation for anyone to be in. But now that you know -the risks, maybe you can keep it from happening to you. - ---Chuck McManis -uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis BIX: cmcmanis ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com -These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you. Can't they just sell the product for the original announced prize ($600?) without the RAM's? Nothing in the first announcment I read said anything about including RAM :-) Perhaps it's not so interesting in the current situation, but was a PAL version planned ?
tope@enea.se (Tommy Petersson) (10/20/88)
In article <1370@neoucom.UUCP> wtm@neoucom.UUCP (Bill Mayhew) writes:
< lots deleted >
:The video toaster looks neat enough, that I'd probably still buy
:one, even if it cost twice the original estimate. It would still
:be a good value for the features it is supposed to have.
:
:--Bill
It's just that we don't know the price yet. The "even if it cost
twice" may nut be sufficient. It was $600 to begin with, the
recent posting with info from Newtek said it would have cost
$2,500 if they had sold it now.
I wonder if they have developed a PAL version ?pa1590@sdcc15.UUCP (pa1590) (10/21/88)
In article <3991@enea.se> tope@enea.se (Tommy Petersson) writes: >In article <72318@sun.uucp> cmcmanis@sun.UUCP (Chuck McManis) writes: >-In article <5380001@otter.hple.hp.com> (Lee Carter) writes: >-> Okay, okay, I give up! Does anyone have any information on when (if >-> ever) the video toaster is going to be released. >- >Can't they just sell the product for the original announced prize ($600?) >without the RAM's? Nothing in the first announcment I read said anything >about including RAM :-) We decided not to sell the Toaster without RAMs for several reasons. The Toaster is not being sold as a kit, but as a professional tool. Not only were RAMs expensive, but they were also hard to find at all, even for a large purchaser, never mind some Video sneeb in Des Moines. As we were telling folks at Ami-Expo L.A., prices are now starting to drop and availability is getting better. Everyone in the company is working to get Toaster out ASAP. -- Stephen Hartford shartford@ucsd SDAUG Hotline (619) 221-7168 San Diego Amiga Users Group P.O.Box 80186, San Diego, CA 92138-0186
pa1590@sdcc15.UUCP (pa1590) (10/22/88)
In article <10246@cup.portal.com> thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) writes: >Yeah (re: Video Toaster software) >New-Tek *STILL* hasn't corrected the self-modifying code bug in DigiView >version 3.0 that affects the DigiDroid (re: the DigiDroid not functioning >on a 68020 or 68030 Amiga unless the cache(s) are turned OFF) :-( There never was, nor is there now, any "self-modifying" code in DigiView. DigiDroid does not currently work on an '020 Amiga for other reasons. We apologize for this fact - we wanted to get version 3.0 out, and give people things they've been screaming for like overscan. 68020 Amigas are still a very small percentage of our customer base. All future releases of NewTek products will fully support '020 machines. >Then, after I accused Paul Montgomer of being the Bandito (in Amazing >Computing) and he called me asking me to retract that statement on the >FAUG BBS in exchange for a quick fix to make DigiDroid work on an '020 I just spoke with Paul, and he said there was no such "exchange". It seems logical to me that you should retract inaccurate, and harmful statements anyways, Thad. Paul was "very pissed off" that you would even say such things in a public forum. >Perhaps New-Tek is spending too much time doing demos and NOT doing the >real software ... NewTek is a company which does products, Thad. Innovative products. We use demos as a way of testing new technology as we develop it. Demo Reel One was written using software developed for Digi-F/X, a product which we are still working on. Demo Reel One sold more Amigas than any other such effort, and helped the Amiga community as a whole. Demo Reel Two, which we previewed at Ami Expo L.A., shows the results of ongoing work in the area of video compression. The efforts put into these demos are helping us develop products. Part of our philsophy is to sell hardware / software combinations which let users do state-of-the-art things at a reasonable price. NewTek is devoted 100% to the Amiga. We are NOT developing on other machines, and we are NOT releasing 50 products a year. From NewTek, you will only see a few products a year, but they will be ones you feel comfortable buying. We're out to do something different, and it's not easy. Nor is it quick. >Thad Floryan [thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ...!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad] P.S. Along these lines, we're also currently looking for programmers who want to help us bring our ideas to life. Moving to Kansas is NOT a requirement, as you can see from my address here in San Diego. If you're good, and you're interested, give Marla a call at NewTek (913) 354-1146. -- Stephen Hartford shartford@ucsd SDAUG Hotline (619) 221-7168 San Diego Amiga Users Group P.O.Box 80186, San Diego, CA 92138-0186
thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) (10/23/88)
Stephen Hartford (of NewTek) writes: `` There never was, nor is there now, any "self-modifying" code in DigiView. DigiDroid does not currently work on an '020 Amiga for other reasons. We apologize for this fact - we wanted to get version 3.0 out, and give people things they've been screaming for like overscan. 68020 Amigas are still a very small percentage of our customer base. All future releases of NewTek products will fully support '020 machines. '' Tim Jennison (President of NewTek) admitted the DigiDroid "bug" in public during the ((video) recorded) meeting of FAUG at which Max Toy was the featured speaker earlier this year. The bug surfaced in DigiView Version 2.0 (April 1987) though it wasn't detectable until DigiDroid shipped in January 1988. Bryan Gallivan and I independently "discovered" that DigiDroid only functions (on an '020 Amiga) when the instruction cache is flushed and turned OFF; this is prima facie evidence for self-modifying code. ==================== Continuing: `` >Then, after I accused Paul Montgomer of being the Bandito (in Amazing >Computing) and he called me asking me to retract that statement on the >FAUG BBS in exchange for a quick fix to make DigiDroid work on an '020 I just spoke with Paul, and he said there was no such "exchange". It seems logical to me that you should retract inaccurate, and harmful statements anyways, Thad. Paul was "very pissed off" that you would even say such things in a public forum. '' The very-strong flames directed at Amazing Computing on the FAUG-BBS (by MANY) followed the several months' series of articles in which the Bandito was essentially saying NewTek was good and everything else was evil. That series of articles so angered many people that Jack Palmatier (Winner's Circle, Berkeley, CA) called Don Hicks to get the story, but Don wouldn't reveal the Bandito's identity. Shortly afterwards, a new 'disclaimer' starts appearing in AC prefacing the Bandito's column. :-) I'm sorry to hear that Paul has forgotten our conversation. On that "certain" day, I first received a phone call from Mitch Lopes (chief honcho of Robo City News) alerting me to expect a call from Paul Montgomery in re: the Bandito since "someone" had informed him (Paul) of the exchanges on the FAUG-BBS. Several hours later Paul called and said he was going to contact his lawyer unless I posted something to the effect that Paul is not and was not ever the Bandito. Interesting he should call me at my office where we have this real nice voice email system. The archives of FAUG-BBS are also available should the need arise. I never (knowingly) post inaccurate and harmful material. Because the events are precisely as I related them, there is NOTHING to retract. ==================== Continuing: `` >Perhaps New-Tek is spending too much time doing demos and NOT doing the >real software ... [ and I said "This is idle speculation on my part."] NewTek is a company which does products, Thad. Innovative products. We use demos as a way of testing new technology as we develop it. [..... material deleted.....] '' Hey, I buy NewTek products! But disabling the instruction cache to use DigiDroid is unacceptable, so I have to continue using the manual color wheel. It's about 6 months now with no fix; the DigiDroid is of marginal use to me and is for sale. I'd like to end this on a POSITIVE note and offer the information (to you and others) that a LOT of so-called "power users" are operating hot-rodded Amigas with 68020 or 68030 chips under the hood, and there is a legitimate concern for software compatibility with these processors. Especially since such processors are officially supported by CBM for the Amiga and the guidelines to assure software compatibility (re: 68010, 68020 (and now 68030)) have been hammered home since the first Developers' Conference in Monterey circa May 1985. Some people using such Amigas for commercial production in the creative arts (e.g. music, graphics, animations, etc.) even have multiple systems equipped with '020 and '030. Bryan Gallivan, Paul Theodoropoulos, Ken Hodel, etc. are just a few names that come to mind (of those who publicly discuss their projects in the SF Bay Area). These are the people who buy your products the DAY they become available. It is even "rumored" that one person leaves blank checks at a local dealer to assure receipt of all the new stuff! Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ..!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad ]
thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) (10/23/88)
(Primarily) to: Stephen Hartford (of NewTek) Hmmm, looking back at this exchange, I can see where one point is unclear, and this could be the point with which (in your words) ``Paul was "very pissed off" that you would even say such things in a public forum.'' The tirade started on FAUG-BBS with one person (Jack Palmatier) discussing the articles in AC and opening speculation as to the (new) Bandito's identity. The names of John Foust, Matthew Leeds, etc. were openly bandied-about. I conjectured Paul due to a perceived similarity of writing style. Jack's discussion with Don Hicks cooled things down. Because there was NO evidence, I complied with Paul's request, and stated "It has come to my attention from a reputable source that Paul Montgomery is NOT the Bandito." (The preceding from FAUG archives). The ONLY reason this matter has resurfaced was due to Lee Carter's question about the Video Toaster whose availability has been promised for some time. Live demos of the Video Toaster have whetted our appetites for this product. My comments focussed on the promises made by Tim and Paul for the DigiDroid fix; promises that "should" have been fulfilled months ago and had to be put in the context they were given. Thad Floryan [ thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ..!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad ]