cg@myrias.UUCP (Chris Gray) (11/03/88)
We hear stories on the net that Commodore has a 33 MHz 68030 card for the
Amiga 2000 running. We also know that Apple has a 68030 Mac-II (runs at
16 MHz I think), and the NeXt runs a 68030 at 25 MHz. Now, I don't know about
anyone else, but it seems to me that it would be a bit of a marketing coupe
to announce an Amiga 2500 (or something) based on a 33 Mhz 68030. It would
be the highest power personal computer available, bar none.
So, the questions:
Am I crazy? :-)
Is Commodore's card stable enough to become a product? Could they get
production up fast enough?
Is something along this lines the reason why they haven't released the
68020 card yet? After all, it's 14 MHz doesn't seem like a lot, especially
now that there is a public domain one (LUCAS) that's faster than that for
considerably less money.
I for one am waiting for a good 020/030 for my 2000. I'd rather not have one
that doesn't use the coprocessor slot, and I'd rather have one straight from
Commodore. If somebody else came out with a 30MHz 030 for that slot, I expect
I would quit waiting for Commodore. I want one that actually performs
better than an 020 however, else why spend the extra money? (I have no plans
to switch to UNIX, now or ever).
--
Chris Gray Myrias Research, Edmonton +1 403 428 1616
{uunet!mnetor,ubc-vision,watmath,vax135}!alberta!myrias!cgdaveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (11/04/88)
in article <645@myrias.UUCP>, cg@myrias.UUCP (Chris Gray) says: > Keywords: 68030 68020 advertising > We hear stories on the net that Commodore has a 33 MHz 68030 card for the > Amiga 2000 running. Funny, I keep hearing rumors that all the 3rd party folks are just about ready to come out with screaming fast '020 and '030 boards... > We also know that Apple has a 68030 Mac-II (runs at 16 MHz I think), Actually 15.8-something, I think. And it doesn't do burst fetches or anything else to make up for the slow memory it has to deal with. All and all, it's pretty icky. Of course, it'll also be a smashing success, since Apple's marketing it. > and the NeXt runs a 68030 at 25 MHz. Their claims would give you a better 68030 machine, though it still sounds slower than an Apollo 3500. And you could go out an buy an Apollo 3500 today if you wanted to. > Now, I don't know about anyone else, but it seems to me that it would be a bit of > a marketing coupe to announce an Amiga 2500 (or something) based on a 33 Mhz > 68030. It would be the highest power personal computer available, bar none. It would be cool. > Am I crazy? :-) Well, I've heard what happens to folks who program in Draco for too long :-) > Is Commodore's card stable enough to become a product? Could they get > production up fast enough? Commodore has yet to announce any 68030 product, so you'd have to define "fast enough". In any case, it doesn't much matter who's announced what, except as maybe a public perception thing, unless you get too out of hand like, umm, one of those "letter-A" computer companies out in Silicon Valley, and start to loose credibility. > Is something along this lines the reason why they haven't released the > 68020 card yet? The 68020 card will be released, and soon (wish I had an exact date, but I only know what they tell me). > After all, it's 14 MHz doesn't seem like a lot, especially now that there is > a public domain one (LUCAS) that's faster than that for considerably less money. LUCAS is a good idea, since it's a hacker thing, and hackers were the first folks to buy Amigas, and still some of the more dedicated Amiga folks. But it's not perfect. There's a real good chance that LUCAS will be incompatible with some expansion devices, and you're also going to pay lots of money to outfit one with 32 bit RAM. And there's no MMU. While 14.3MHz isn't blinding, it's very respectable. There a a very large number of additional problems to be solved when going from a synchronized CPU clock, like in your 14.3MHz system, to an asynchronous clock, like in the LUCAS board. I don't believe LUCAS is likely to have solved all these problems, though it's certainly solved enough to be a useful PD design. But a commercial product has to be compatible with absolutely everything out there. You may spend 80% of your work tracking down the last 20% of the problems. > I for one am waiting for a good 020/030 for my 2000. I'd rather not have one > that doesn't use the coprocessor slot, and I'd rather have one straight from > Commodore. That first decision is a sound one -- I wouldn't recommend a 32 bit card for the A2000 that doesn't use the CPU slot. Since I design 32 bit cards for Commodore, I think the second decision is a good one too. > If somebody else came out with a 30MHz 030 for that slot, I expect I would > quit waiting for Commodore. I want one that actually performs better than an > 020 however, else why spend the extra money? (I have no plans to switch to > UNIX, now or ever). It's certainly a competitive market out there, and in your position, I might make the same decisions. If you buy a product from Commodore, you know who you're dealing with, who to call for support, etc. Some folks use the same argument to buy from IBM, so it's obviously flawed, especially if you need a thing today, not tomorrow. So far, the LUCAS design is the only async design out there, and would need some work to be adapted the the A2000 environment, and the 68030. Hacking hardware gets expensive. I certainly expect that at least someone out there will have a fast '030 board in '89, based on even half of the rumors that have been floating around. > Chris Gray Myrias Research, Edmonton +1 403 428 1616 > {uunet!mnetor,ubc-vision,watmath,vax135}!alberta!myrias!cg -- Dave Haynie "The 32 Bit Guy" Commodore-Amiga "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: D-DAVE H BIX: hazy Amiga -- It's not just a job, it's an obsession