rhunt@icard.med.unc.edu (Rick Hunt) (07/18/89)
I haven't seen any mention of this on the net and I was wondering if anyone knows (and will tell) if there will be any new ROMs needed for DOS 1.4 or will it use the 1.3 set. I haven't needed the 1.3 ROMs yet because I don't have an autobooting harddrive yet and not enough memory to set up a useful RAD: to boot from. I would hate to buy the 1.3 chip and then turn right around and have to get 1.4. Thanks, Rick
new@udel.EDU (Darren New) (07/19/89)
On a mildly different topic, is it really true that autoboot is the only difference between 1.2 and 1.3 kickstart? I find this hard to believe because dos.library would seem to need to be in ROM. If it is, how does the 1.2 DOS handle setting the archive bit? (or was this in 1.2 and I never noticed because I got 1.3 before I got my hard drive?) Also, I've noticed what seems to be a bug. I have some old games (space quest 1) wherein the executable is protected as hsap--e- or something. Note the lack of read access. In copying it with the workbench, all went well but I think the protections changed. In copying it with the copy command, all seemed to go well but I got a file of the right size filled with zeros. However, copying it with the workbench allowed me to put it on my hard drive, so it isn't really a problem for me. I was just suprised that it copied the right number of bytes but wound up as all zeros. -- Darren
new@udel.EDU (Darren New) (07/19/89)
It also seems to me that under US Copyright law as I understand it, it sould be legal to burn your own proms from the kickstart that comes with the enhancer set, thereby saving $35 (or whatever) for all the poor slobs stuck with kickstart in ROM (1/2 :-). It seems that this would be "fair use" and an "essential part of using the software on the computer." (Just thought I would start another copyright war.) -- Darren
jms@tardis.Tymnet.COM (Joe Smith) (07/19/89)
In article <469@uncmed.med.unc.edu> rhunt@uncmed.med.unc.edu (Rick Hunt) writes: >I haven't seen any mention of this on the net and I was wondering if >anyone knows (and will tell) if there will be any new ROMs needed for DOS >1.4 or will it use the 1.3 set. I haven't needed the 1.3 ROMs yet because >I don't have an autobooting harddrive yet and not enough memory to set up >a useful RAD: to boot from. I would hate to buy the 1.3 chip and then >turn right around and have to get 1.4. It has been discussed a lot on the net. You will remember that the main difference between the 1.2 ROM and the 1.3 ROM is the ability to autoboot; all the wonderfull stuff Commodore was planning has been held back for 1.4, which means there will be a lot of changes to the ROM. For instance: 1) Booting from a FFS formatted floppy. The fast file system has to be moved into ROM for this to work. 2) New graphics modes such as 640x400 noninterlaced. Requires that the graphics library (in ROM) be updated. 3) New features to WorkBench, such as multitasking (clicking on an icon while WorkBench is still looking for more icons). The portions of ROM that contain WorkBench will definitely have to change. 4) Complete re-write of the dos.library into assembler and C. Yes, there will definitely be new ROMs for 1.4. Any they promise that well-written programs will not break under the new version of AmigaDOS. There are two related questions that remain unanswered: 1) Will any of the new programs be completely unusable if you boot a 1.4 floppy on a system with the 1.2 or 1.3 ROMs? (I expect them to at least say "Sorry, you must Kickstart 1.4" and not guru.) 2) Will the ROM be in the stores at the same time as the disks? (Because of warrentee concerns, I don't expect the ROM to be in the box with the disks.) I don't expect definitive answers to those questions until the week before first customer ship. -- Joe Smith (408)922-6220 | SMTP: JMS@F74.TYMNET.COM or jms@tymix.tymnet.com McDonnell Douglas FSCO | UUCP: ...!{ames,pyramid}!oliveb!tymix!tardis!jms PO Box 49019, MS-D21 | PDP-10 support: My car's license plate is "POPJ P," San Jose, CA 95161-9019 | narrator.device: "I didn't say that, my Amiga did!"
easton@aucis.UUCP (Jeff Easton) (07/19/89)
In article <19975@louie.udel.EDU>, new@udel.EDU (Darren New) writes: > It also seems to me that under US Copyright law as I understand it, > it sould be legal to burn your own proms from the kickstart that > comes with the enhancer set, thereby saving $35 (or whatever) for > all the poor slobs stuck with kickstart in ROM (1/2 :-). It seems > that this would be "fair use" and an "essential part of using the > software on the computer." (Just thought I would start another > copyright war.) -- Darren I looked at this once (when 1.3 came out) and found it to be near impossible to do economically. First I whipped out my copy of the A500/A2000 technical reference manual and checked the schematic. Hmm 128K x 16 ROM, P/N HN62402. Sounds like a Hitachi part. A quick scan of my Hitachi data book shows no such part. OK, check the pinout with the Intel standard part. Bingo! there all WRONG! The Intel (JEDEC?) standard has all the data pins on one side and all the address pins on the other. The B2000 schematic shows all the data pins on the bottom half of the chip and all address pins on the top half. I think I even checked my mother board and it seemed to match the B2000 schematic. I posted a question about this many months ago but got no replys. So how 'bout it guys? CATS? Dave? Why the weird part? To combat theft? Or were you just to early (before the x16 standard was set)? A daughter board could be devised to remap the pinout to a standard for those inclined to mess with kickstart (noclick in ROM, etc) but just wasnt worth it to me at the time. I would build one at the drop of a hat if I could kludge in some code to get my old A2090 to autoboot. :< Jeff Easton UUCP: !mailrus!sharkey!aucis!easton Zenith Data Systems OEM Engineering.
CIS@S41.Prime.COM (07/19/89)
/* Written 8:39 am Jul 19, 1989 by jms@tardis.UUCP in S41:comp.sys.amiga */ >well-written programs will not break under the new version of AmigaDOS. >There are two related questions that remain unanswered: >1) Will any of the new programs be completely unusable if you boot a 1.4 > floppy on a system with the 1.2 or 1.3 ROMs? (I expect them to at least > say "Sorry, you must Kickstart 1.4" and not guru.) I would say that the answer to this one is a definitive YES. There is going to be a lot of stuff migrating to the ROM that is currently living on the disks. >2) Will the ROM be in the stores at the same time as the disks? (Because of > warrentee concerns, I don't expect the ROM to be in the box with the disks.) I dunno. I surely hope so, but there is no telling what is going to go on with the Amiga distribution channels. I think that they'll be just as good as the ones that they have now, which means that you'll have to wait for the kickstart ROMs for a while :-( >-- >Joe Smith (408)922-6220 | SMTP: JMS@F74.TYMNET.COM or jms@tymix.tymnet.com >McDonnell Douglas FSCO | UUCP: ...!{ames,pyramid}!oliveb!tymix!tardis!jms >PO Box 49019, MS-D21 | PDP-10 support: My car's license plate is "POPJ P," >San Jose, CA 95161-9019 | narrator.device: "I didn't say that, my Amiga did!" /* End of text from S41:comp.sys.amiga */ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Chuck Stern "Keep your feet on the ground, keep reaching for Prime Computer, Inc. the sky, pray for rain, keep the humor dry and 500 Old Connecticut Path keep eating those Powdermilk Biscuits" Framingham, MA 01701 cis@s41.Prime.COM /* Any intersection between my opinions and Prime's are purely coincidental */
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (07/20/89)
in article <460@aucis.UUCP>, easton@aucis.UUCP (Jeff Easton) says: > Summary: forget it, bizzare ROM's used > In article <19975@louie.udel.EDU>, new@udel.EDU (Darren New) writes: >> It also seems to me that under US Copyright law as I understand it, >> it sould be legal to burn your own proms from the kickstart that >> comes with the enhancer set... > I looked at this once (when 1.3 came out) and found it to be > near impossible to do economically. The only EPROMs we've used to date are EPROM towers, which hook up 4 32kx8 EPROMs (27512) to build a whole 128K x 16 equivalent. > First I whipped out my copy of the A500/A2000 technical reference > manual and checked the schematic. Hmm 128K x 16 ROM, P/N HN62402. > Sounds like a Hitachi part. A quick scan of my Hitachi data book shows > no such part. You may need a newer data book. We've bought there ROMs from several different vendors at different times, I think NEC makes 'em too, can't recall everyone but it seems to be pretty standard, at least as far as everyone in Japan is concerned. > OK, check the pinout with the Intel standard part. Bingo! there all WRONG! There was no EPROM available when these parts were specified. Methinks Intel did wrong by not following the existing standard. > The B2000 schematic shows all the data pins on the bottom half of the chip > and all address pins on the top half. The B2000 schematic is correct. > I posted a question about this many months ago but got no replys. > So how 'bout it guys? CATS? Dave? Why the weird part? To combat > theft? Or were you just to early (before the x16 standard was set)? Again, we used the only part available, which nowadays is still made and far as I know, pretty common. I tend to think the newer part is the one at fault, for not following the already established pinout. Or maybe it's just Intel thumbing its nose at Japan, Inc. Couldn't hurt to check and see if any of the other companies may a 128k x 16 EPROM; though as far as I know, they don't. > A daughter board could be devised to remap the pinout to a standard > for those inclined to mess with kickstart (noclick in ROM, etc) but > just wasnt worth it to me at the time. If there is a standard 128k x 16 EPROM, even if it needs a tower, it would sure be an easier solution than the 4-banger tower they're using now. > I would build one at the drop of a hat if I could kludge in some > code to get my old A2090 to autoboot. :< Think you'd need a 256k x 16 for that; there's no spare room in the current ROM for a hard disk driver. B2000s and A500 do support a large ROM, though hacking in a 2090 autoboot driver wouldn't be something I'd want to do without the source code... > Jeff Easton UUCP: !mailrus!sharkey!aucis!easton > Zenith Data Systems OEM Engineering. -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: D-DAVE H BIX: hazy Be careful what you wish for -- you just might get it