GORRIEDE@UREGINA1.BITNET (Dennis Robert Gorrie) (09/26/89)
> > In article <8909192229.AA17973@jade.berkeley.edu> you write: > > As a rule, people with BITNET accounts cannot access FTPable accounts. > > This is because BITNET and FTP sites (located on EDU networks) are > > linked via a priority 4 connection (only suitable for MAIL transfer) > > and FTP requires a priority 3 link. > True, but not for the reason that you think. > > BitNet (and NetNorth/EARN) are networks based on a rather >specific physical layer (Bi-sync communication). FTP is a file transfer >protocol that uses TCP/IP as a transport. These are not compatible. The >only way for BitNet sites to get anonymous FTP is to be on the same piece >of internet (little I ... distinguished from the Internet which is a single >large instance of an internet network) *and* have some mechanism for speaking >TCP/IP. FTP *only* works with TCP/IP. If your machine doesn't speak it, you >can't FTP. > . . . > This priority stuff doesn't seem to be in the jargon ... > > Hope this helps clear things up. > > Fred Whiteside > McMaster NetNorth Representative and PostMaster I am on a BITNET site myself. It is NOT an internet site. However, we do have the FTP facility to access files bewteen an IBM 4381 (VM/CMS) and a VAX 6320 (VMS), both of them local BITNET sites. I assume therefore that using the FTP facility, we must then also be operating on the TCP/IP protocol. (There exists system users with thems FTPSERVE and VSM-TCPIP.) Assuming this is true, then the only other factor that remains to prevent FTP access of EDU sites (from BITNET) is the priority of the comm link. So, that is how I came to the conclusion at the top. What am I overlooking? Perhaps you would like to explain this in further detail. I'm sure there are several BITNET subscribers to this list who would also appreciate a better understanding of why they cannot access FTP sites. P.S. I suppose the TCP/IP could be on a different link, that only exists between my local machines, but I was under the impression it operated on the IBM RSCS. +------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | "Chain-Saw Tag... | | | | Try it... You'll LikE iT! | | | | DENNIS GORRIE (GORRIEDE AT UREGINA1.BITNET) | +------------------------------------------------------------------------+
cmcmanis%pepper@Sun.COM (Chuck McManis) (09/26/89)
Concerning BITNET and FTP and anonymous FTP etc.
Networks are funny things and WorldNet is funniest of all. WorldNet,
what a lot of people think of when they say "The Net" is a collection
of dissimilar networks joined by *Mail* gateways. Withing segments
of the net, such as The Internet, additional services such as FTP,
remote logins, spacewars, what have you, may be available. There are
two big "chunks" of WorldNet in the USA called "The Internet" and
"Usenet." All computers that are part of "The Internet" run TCP/IP
software and are connected to each other via NSFnet/Milnet/Arpanet.
Most of those machines are either made by DEC (Vaxen) or Sun. TCP/IP
software includes facilities for remote execution, process to process
communication, and Mail. All of the computers that are connected to
"Usenet" are running the UUCP software. (and most often some form of
"news" software.) The UUCP software provides facilities for limited
remote execution, and Mail. UUCP software runs on most anything these
days (except CP/M-80). "BITNET" is a collection of IBM machines with
facilities for some remote execution and Mail.
Some machines, such as the Mail machine at Sun or UUnet, are on two
networks "The Internet" and "Usenet". And they forward mail but not
remote execution or any other services from one side to the other. Thus,
mail can be sent from a Usenet host to an Internet host by simply
informing the mail program how to get from here to there.
Some machines such as cunyvm are on BITNET and "The Internet." and forward
mail from one to the other.
When "anonymous FTP" is mentioned in this newsgroup it refers to machines
that are on the Internet. When references are made to "LIST-SERVERS" those
machines are usually on BITNET, and when references are made to
"archive servers" they can be on any net with the right software. (File
transfer is accomplished using a protocol layered on top of the protocol
of "mail").
Hope that clears up some of the confusion. Remember, you have to have
both the write protocol software *and* be on the right network segment to
use something like FTP. To send Mail you generally just have to figure
out an address that will explain to your mailer where you want it to
go.
--Chuck McManis
uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis BIX: cmcmanis ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com
These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you.
"If I were driving a Macintosh, I'd have to stop before I could turn the wheel."jyegiguere@watcgl.waterloo.edu (Eric Giguere) (09/28/89)
Yes, even IBM mainframes running VM/CMS can now support the TCP/IP
protocols such as Telnet and FTP. Kinda scary, eh? Of course, the
relation
FTP == Unix
was never true in the first place, anyhow.
Face it, the world is becoming one big network!wjb@edsr.eds.com (Bill J Biesty) (10/05/89)
In article <11664@watcgl.waterloo.edu>, jyegiguere@watcgl.waterloo.edu (Eric Giguere) writes: > Yes, even IBM mainframes running VM/CMS can now support the TCP/IP > protocols such as Telnet and FTP. Kinda scary, eh? Of course, the Sure! But how many IBM mainframes actually run VM/CMS? Not many says the author of _The_Programmers_Survival_Guide_ whose name I can't remember. She says that even if they do run VM/CMS it's only to be able to run multiple other operating systems on top of it. It's IBM's best kept secret (they didn't want to let it out the door since you don't need *HUGE* staffs to support it) and the only OS they've got that isn't a kludged batch system. (I know this isn't really about the amiga, don't bother to complain to me.) Also, the REXX programming Language originated on VM/CMS, precursor to Arexx... Bill Biesty My opinions are only contained here and they do not represent those of Electronic Data Systems Corp. in any way shape or form.
C503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu (Baird McIntosh) (10/09/89)
In article <159@edsr.eds.com>, wjb@edsr.eds.com (Bill J. Biesty) writes: >In article <11664@watcgl.waterloo.edu>, jyegiguere@watcgl.waterloo.edu Eric > Giguere) writes: >> Yes, even IBM mainframes running VM/CMS can now support the TCP/IP >> protocols such as Telnet and FTP. Kinda scary, eh? Of course, the > >Sure! But how many IBM mainframes actually run VM/CMS? Not many >says the author of _The_Programmers_Survival_Guide_ whose name I can't >[...] Well, the IBM 4381 here runs VM/CMS. And I can tell you, it is not too impressive. I just love 8-character file names with 8-character file types and no sub-directories. This is CMS v5.0 I believe, though 6.0 is in use at more progressive universities...and 6.0 supports sub-directories. Yes, we are able to run FTP and Telnet and such, but the places I FTP *to* are running UNIX (for example, uxe.cso.uiuc.edu is a UNIX machine). Of course, the really progressive universities are running UNIX and don't have a sworn allegiance to Big Blue. Oh well, if the $deal$ is with IBM, then so be it. >Also, the REXX programming Language originated on VM/CMS, precursor to >Arexx... Yeah, there are EXEC filetypes all over this system written in REXX. Of course, there are also MODULES written in compiled C, etc...but I don't know a whole lot about it. >Bill Biesty We now return you to your regularly scheduled A m i g a discussion... # Baird McIntosh "...Why do people choose to live their lives...this way?" # # INTERNET: c503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu <-or-> BITNET: c503719@umcvmb.bitnet #
tadguy@cs.odu.edu (Tad Guy) (10/10/89)
In article <1118@nigel.udel.EDU> C503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu (Baird McIntosh) writes:
Well, the IBM 4381 here runs VM/CMS. And I can tell you, it is not too
impressive. I just love 8-character file names with 8-character file
types and no sub-directories.
If anyone's interested, I have some REXX scripts to simulate
directories under VM/CMS. Send me mail (as this really isn't apropos
for comp.sys.amiga), on bitnet I'm ``EEG100G at ODUVM''.
...tadGORRIEDE@UREGINA1.BITNET (Dennis Robert Gorrie) (10/10/89)
To Bill J Biesty:
It seems the mailer keeps barfing on all the mail I tried to send you.
Anyways, if you want more info on AREXX, you might try sending mail
to Larry Phillips, on this newsgroup. He has helped me with AREXX
information.
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