sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu (scott sutherland) (11/11/89)
Okay all you video guru's, I have a neophyte question. I was just in a local video store and was shown a used 8 mm camcorder. It was a SONY (in case anyone cares) and had controls on it just like a VCR, as well as being a camera. NOW, to my question. Let's say that I want to GENLOCK my Amiga graphics with LIVE (NOT pre-recorded on tape, but LIVE) video. Normally, I would forsee the following setup. |---------| | | |Camcorder|--output->---| | or | | | Camera | | |---------| | | | |------------------| V--------->video input | |----------| | Amiga |Genlock | | |----------| | 3000 ;^) | | | | |----> video and amiga graphics out | | | |------------------| | |--------------| |-----|video in | | | | VCR for | | | |--------------| Thus, the camcorder is used for the external video, the Amiga for the graphics (e.g. titling) and the VCR is used to record the output. Now, being a college graduate student has taught me one thing: POVERTY! :) Okay, so I am exagerrating somewhat. Still, I cannot afford an Amiga, camcorder, and editing VCR. Well, I have an Amiga, but no camcorder. And you really DO need an editing VCR for any serious work. Really! (Of course, that did not sway the loan officer at the local bank into giving me that dam# loan.) So, I had an idea. Well, it was just one! Anyway, not having any experience with Genlocks or camcorders, I am not sure if it will work. For this idea, you need to think of the camcorder as 2 SEPARATE ENTITIES, a camera and a video recorder. I will draw it as such, but attached. My idea is as follows: /Genlock input |-------|---LIVE video out of camera-| / |Camera | |/ |---------------| | Part | |----V--| | | | |Genlock| | |-------|---------| Genlock |-------| Amiga | | | out------->| | | | Recorder Part | | |---------------| | of Camcorder |<-Recorder in--| |-----------------| Thus, the camera part of the camcorder is the external video, the Amiga is the graphic source (titles), and the recorder of the camcorder is used to record the sync'd output of video and graphics from the Genlock. This would be much cheaper for recording video and graphics together. I do realize that one fall back of this is that you have to know ahead of time exactly where your graphics have to go and where to put the live video so that nothing vital is hidden from view by the titles, but this is not such a terrible thing. And, since 8 mm camcorders, as well as many others, have flying erase heads, it would be possible to assemble edit inside the camcorder. Now, I'm not saying that this would be as easy as having the first set up, or even having an editing studio, with 2 professional editing decks, a controller, time-base correction, a sophisticated character generator (some camcorders have some rudimentary titling built in to them), BUT it would get the job done and is not to expensive. So, does anyone know of any reason why this wouldn't work?? I want to know because I saw a used SONY 8 mm camcorder for sale (as I mentioned above) for $600! It is in excellent shape and would not only give me basic editing features, but would allow me to experiment with genlocking and with just plain video making. Thanks, Scott Sutherland sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu
swan@jolnet.ORPK.IL.US (Joel Swan) (11/12/89)
In article <776@orange9.qtp.ufl.edu> sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu (scott sutherland) writes:
:
:
: Okay all you video guru's, I have a neophyte question. I was
:just in a local video store and was shown a used 8 mm camcorder. It
[lots of descriptive stuff cut]
:
: Let's say that I want to GENLOCK my Amiga graphics with LIVE
:(NOT pre-recorded on tape, but LIVE) video. Normally, I would forsee
:the following setup.
[diagram cut]
:Thus, the camcorder is used for the external video, the Amiga for the
:graphics (e.g. titling) and the VCR is used to record the output.
[more cut]
:local bank into giving me that dam# loan.) So, I had an idea. Well,
:it was just one! Anyway, not having any experience with Genlocks or
:camcorders, I am not sure if it will work. For this idea, you need
:to think of the camcorder as 2 SEPARATE ENTITIES, a camera and a
:video recorder. I will draw it as such, but attached. My idea is as
:follows:
:
: /Genlock input
: |-------|---LIVE video out of camera-| /
: |Camera | |/ |---------------|
: | Part | |----V--| |
: | | |Genlock| |
: |-------|---------| Genlock |-------| Amiga |
: | | out------->| | |
: | Recorder Part | | |---------------|
: | of Camcorder |<-Recorder in--|
: |-----------------|
[other stuff cut]
:Thanks,
:
:Scott Sutherland
:sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu
It would work only IF the camcorder could have the camera half turned
on and the recorder NOT recording the camera's video.
I know of no such camcorder that allows this. They all automatically
record from the camera WHENEVER the camera half is active.
Camcorders are semi-split into two entities, sort of like a boom box
with radio and tape deck. When you turn the tuner on, the tape deck
automatically records from the tuner. This makes it "idiot proof" for
the consumer who might otherwise destroy the video tape of a family
outing "because he forgot to switch the recorder's input to the camera's
output." Same goes for the camcorders. If the camera turns on, the recorder
records from it, NOT the external input.
JoelJOSEPH@kuhub.cc.ukans.edu (11/13/89)
In article <2086@jolnet.ORPK.IL.US>, swan@jolnet.ORPK.IL.US (Joel Swan) writes: > In article <776@orange9.qtp.ufl.edu> sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu (scott sutherland) writes: > : > : > : Okay all you video guru's, I have a neophyte question. I was > :just in a local video store and was shown a used 8 mm camcorder. It > [lots of descriptive stuff cut] > > : > : Let's say that I want to GENLOCK my Amiga graphics with LIVE > :(NOT pre-recorded on tape, but LIVE) video. Normally, I would forsee > :the following setup. > > [diagram cut] > > :Thus, the camcorder is used for the external video, the Amiga for the > :graphics (e.g. titling) and the VCR is used to record the output. > > [other stuff cut] > > :Thanks, > : > :Scott Sutherland > :sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu > > It would work only IF the camcorder could have the camera half turned > on and the recorder NOT recording the camera's video. > I know of no such camcorder that allows this. They all automatically stuff deleted > output." Same goes for the camcorders. If the camera turns on, the recorder > records from it, NOT the external input. > > Joel I remember reading something to the effect that the Sony CCDV110 can do this. My unit has an input and output for external processor. Since I never tried to use this, I'm not sure how it works or whether this will help in the genlock recording Scott Sutherland suggested. pl. no flames. Tomi
gutierre@nsipo.arc.nasa.gov (Robert Michael Gutierrez) (11/16/89)
swan@jolnet.UUCP (Joel Swan) writes: >sutherla@qtp.ufl.edu (scott sutherland) writes: >:.......................................... So, I had an idea. Well, >:it was just one! Anyway, not having any experience with Genlocks or >:camcorders, I am not sure if it will work. For this idea, you need >:to think of the camcorder as 2 SEPARATE ENTITIES, a camera and a >:video recorder. I will draw it as such, but attached. My idea is as >:follows: >: >: /Genlock input >: |-------|---LIVE video out of camera-| / >: |Camera | |/ |---------------| >: | Part | |----V--| | >: | | |Genlock| | >: |-------|---------| Genlock |-------| Amiga | >: | | out------->| | | >: | Recorder Part | | |---------------| >: | of Camcorder |<-Recorder in--| >: |-----------------| [...] >It would work only IF the camcorder could have the camera half turned >on and the recorder NOT recording the camera's video. >I know of no such camcorder that allows this. They all automatically ^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^ >record from the camera WHENEVER the camera half is active. ONE camcorder does! And it is an 8mm. It's the Sony Pro-8 (forgot the model number, possibly V-8???). It *DOES* have a camera-VCR loop connection. You have to buy some stupid (and expensive adapter), but the loop-thru allows you to take the camera output, process it any way you want, and return the processed video back into the VCR to be recorded. I know, I owned the model until I gave it to my father (am now using a Panasonic AG-400 camcorder). The manual says the intention of the loop-thru is to use an optional superimposer (never saw it) or effects box (saw it, real crappy...) WHILE you were shooting. Since the V-8 already has a character generator (8 line, 100x100 res), it didn't mention the use of the loop for using an external c.g. My (now) fathers camcorder died on him, and I'm putting it in the shop next week (CPU failure). I'll let you know what the connectors are labeled. They are REAL small connectors, usually called PCB (PC Board) RF connectors. There is a possibility that Sony did have this loop-thru for one other model, but I can't remember the model number of that one either. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Robert Gutierrez -- NSI Network Ops Center <gutierre@nsipo.arc.nasa.gov> | | NASA Science Internet Project, Bldg 233-8, Moffett Field, CA. 94035-5000 | |--------------------------------------------------------------------------| |"I want some......I need some......Emotion.....And More........" (a song) | ----------------------------------------------------------------------------