papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) (11/21/89)
Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: New Amiga Peripherals: --------------------- * Commodore Amiga 2630 A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, 25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of 32-bit memory (expandable to 4MB) Price: $2,195 * Commodore Amiga 2091 and 2091-40 The A2091 is a high-performance autobooting HD controller. It can be fitted with 2MB of memory and provides space for mounting a 3.5-inch Hard Disk. Price: $399 The A2091-40 is an autobooting 40MB SCSI hard disk and controller incorporated with the A2000HD and sold separately as a peripheral. It features sockets for up to 2MB of 16-bit fast RAM, and can boot directly from the Amiga FFS. Price: $899 * Commodore Amiga 2232 A multiserial card that provides seven (7) addistional rs232 ports. Each port operates independently with speeds up to 19.2 Kbps. Price: $399 * Commmodore Amiga 2500/30 Same as the 2500/20 except that it includes the 2630 card instead of the 2620 card. Price: $4,699 AMIGA 2000 series Price Adjustments ----------------------------------- ADJUSTED FROM TO Amiga 2000 $2,195 $1,899 Amiga 200HD $2,999 $2,699 Amiga 2500/20 $4,699 $3,999 2620 Card $1,995 $1,495 The new pricing schedule means that TODAY you can get a '30-based Amiga for YESTERDAY's price of an '20-based Amiga. Not a bad deal. Enjoy. -- Marco Papa 'Doc' -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= uucp:...!pollux!papa BIX:papa ARPAnet:pollux!papa@oberon.usc.edu "There's Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Diga and Caligari!" -- Rick Unland -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
perley@trub (Donald P Perley) (11/21/89)
In article <21334@usc.edu>, papa@pollux (Marco Papa) writes: >Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. >The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: >* Commodore Amiga 2232 >A multiserial card that provides seven (7) addistional rs232 ports. >Each port operates independently with speeds up to 19.2 Kbps. >Price: $399 I wonder how this compares with the ASDG board. Yes... I know... more ports. What I meant was how much of the grunt work is done by the CPU vs circuitry on the the board itself. >AMIGA 2000 series Price Adjustments > ADJUSTED FROM TO >Amiga 200HD $2,999 $2,699 According to an article in our user group newsletter, the 2000HD at $2699 now includes an xt bridgeboard. ($2399 locally) -don perley perley@trub.crd.ge.com
sjm@sun.acs.udel.edu (Steve Morris) (11/22/89)
>>AMIGA 2000 series Price Adjustments >> ADJUSTED FROM TO >>Amiga 200HD $2,999 $2,699 >According to an article in our user group newsletter, the 2000HD at $2699 >now includes an xt bridgeboard. ($2399 locally) > This is a special limited time offer, while supplies last. I do not remember the details of why they are doing this. I don't believe that it is because the xt bridgeboard is being discontinued. -Steve
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (11/23/89)
in article <10220@vdsvax.crd.ge.com>, perley@trub (Donald P Perley) says: > In-reply-to: papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) >>* Commodore Amiga 2232 >>A multiserial card that provides seven (7) addistional rs232 ports. >>Each port operates independently with speeds up to 19.2 Kbps. >>Price: $399 > I wonder how this compares with the ASDG board. Yes... I know... more ports. > What I meant was how much of the grunt work is done by the CPU vs circuitry > on the the board itself. The A2232 has a 3.56 MHz 4502 (enhanced 65C02 compatible CPU) on board. This CPU handles all interrupts from the serial chips and manages RAM buffers for each chip. It drastically cuts down on the main Amiga CPU overhead for serial ports. The one advantage of the ASDG board is that it's capable of MIDI speeds, while the Commodore board tops out at 19.2k Baud (with one weird high speed mode at around 100k Baud). > -don perley -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
johnl@tw-rnd.SanDiego.NCR.COM (John Lindwall) (11/28/89)
In article <21334@usc.edu> papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: >Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. >* Commodore Amiga 2630 >A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, >25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of ^^^^^^^^^ | Doesn't the 68030 have its own MMU? Perhaps the poster (or C=?) has made a boo-boo? Please enlighten me. (Educational discount for students ...... A GREAT IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) -- John Lindwall | "Not my employer opinions; mine" johnl@tw-rnd.SanDiego.NCR.COM | a man, a plan, a beer, reeban alpa nama ----------------------------------+--------------------------------------------
lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) (11/29/89)
papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: >Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. >The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: > >New Amiga Peripherals: >--------------------- > >* Commodore Amiga 2630 > >A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, >25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of >32-bit memory (expandable to 4MB) >Price: $2,195 > Hey Marco, is this one verbatim from a Commodore handout? Cause if it is, someone's brain ain't in gear! 68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! > >-- Marco Papa 'Doc' >-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >uucp:...!pollux!papa BIX:papa ARPAnet:pollux!papa@oberon.usc.edu >"There's Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Diga and Caligari!" -- Rick Unland >-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Larry Greenwald UUCP: {hplabs!hp-sdd sdcsvax nosc}!crash!pnet01!lgreen ARPA: crash!pnet01!lgreen@nosc.mil INET: lgreen@pnet01.cts.com SNAIL:4545 Collwood Blvd, #52 San Diego, CA 92115 "I'm looking over a three-leaf clover that I overlooked be-three!" -Bugs Bunny
papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) (11/29/89)
In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: |papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: ||Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. ||The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: ||* Commodore Amiga 2630 || ||A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, ||25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of ||32-bit memory (expandable to 4MB) ||Price: $2,195 || |Hey Marco, is this one verbatim from a Commodore handout? Cause if it is, |someone's brain ain't in gear! |68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! |Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! Yep. that's what BOTH press releases on the A2630 and A2500/30 state. Since I haven't seen such a beast, I have no idea whether the above is actually true or not. The press releases seem to be authored by Jim Dondero at Fleishman-Hillard, Inc., the current Commodore ad agency. Marketroids do not "know computers" (Yes, of course, "Bo knows computers":^) -- Marco Papa 'Doc' -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= uucp:...!pollux!papa BIX:papa ARPAnet:pollux!papa@oberon.usc.edu "There's Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Diga and Caligari!" -- Rick Unland -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (11/30/89)
in article <21450@usc.edu>, papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) says: > In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: > |papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: > ||Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. > ||The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: > ||* Commodore Amiga 2630 > ||A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, > ||25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > |Hey Marco, is this one verbatim from a Commodore handout? > Yep. that's what BOTH press releases on the A2630 and A2500/30 state. Someone's obviously confused; of course there's no 68851 MMU on the A2630. The 68030 doesn't even generate the coprocessor address for the MMU, so even if you hooked one up, it wouldn't do anything more than eat up a few watts of power and get in the way. While it's not common knowledge, the 68851 is EVIL. It sits there and does it's MMUing, which is fine though a bit weird to hook up (if you though the normal 3-wire bus arbitration practiced by most Motorola things was weird, take a look at the 5-wire bus arbitration this MMU uses). But not only does it add a wait state, it extends things just a bit more, so now signals that used to be well behaved, changing within a given clock pulse, become wicked and can hang over clock edges. So if you really want your system to work, the 68851 can end up adding even more delay. And complexity. Which is why A2620s go at 14.3MHz and A2630s go at 25MHz... > -- Marco Papa 'Doc' -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
aleneis@jarthur.Claremont.EDU (Tony Leneis) (11/30/89)
In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: >68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! > >Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! If I remember correctly, the 68030 has an on-board MMU, but it isn't as powerful as a full 68851 (doesn't support disk swapping for instance.) Tony Leneis aleneis@jarthur.claremont.edu aleneis@hmcvax.bitnet
jdm@gryphon.COM (John Mesiavech) (11/30/89)
Regarding the extra MMU on the CBM A2630 board...... Had read on a technical board that the reason for the extra MMU is that the one that's built into the 68030 is a SUBSET of the 68851 MMU. So, CBM put the full MMU on the board for better UNIX performance. John -- 0-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-0 | There once was a signature here, but I dunno where it went. | | ------------------------------------------------ | | jdm@gryphon.COM -- or-- <anywhere>!hplabs!gryphon!jdm | 0-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-0
840445m@aucs.uucp (Alan McKay) (12/01/89)
In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: >papa@pollux.usc.edu (Marco Papa) writes: >>Last week at COMDEX Commodore announced new products and price reductions. >>The following excerpts are taken from the press releases: >> >>New Amiga Peripherals: >>--------------------- >> >>* Commodore Amiga 2630 >> >>A Motorola 68030-based accelerator, 25MHz MC68030, >>25MHz MC68882 math co-processor, 68851 MMU, 2MB of >>32-bit memory (expandable to 4MB) >>Price: $2,195 >> >Hey Marco, is this one verbatim from a Commodore handout? Cause if it is, >someone's brain ain't in gear! > >68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! > >Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! > I'm afraid that you are the brain-dead one Larry 68030 = 68020 + SPEED + A SUBSET OF THE 68851 MMU ^^^^^^ -- + Alan W. McKay + VOICE: (902) 542-1565 + + Acadia University + "Courage my friend, it is not yet too late + + WOLFVILLE, N.S. + to make the world a better place." + + 840445m@AcadiaU.CA + - Tommy Douglas +
ckp@grebyn.com (Checkpoint Technologies) (12/01/89)
In article <1989Nov30.172032.23894@aucs.uucp> 840445m@aucs.UUCP (Alan McKay) writes: >In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: >>68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! >> >>Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! >> > >68030 = 68020 + SPEED + A SUBSET OF THE 68851 MMU > ^^^^^^ > Don't worry, there's nothing the 68030 is lacking that's worth it. The 68851 contains a *lot* of features for an MMU. There's nothing of real importance missing from the 68030. Just the breakpoint registers (not nearly as useful as you might think), and the 7 level memory protection scheme that's only useful when you're using the CALLM and RETM instructions. And in fact, CALLM and RETM aren't that useful either. So guess what - the 68030 left them out.
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (12/02/89)
in article <3316@jarthur.Claremont.EDU>, aleneis@jarthur.Claremont.EDU (Tony Leneis) says: > In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: >>68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! >>Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! > If I remember correctly, the 68030 has an on-board MMU, but it isn't > as powerful as a full 68851 (doesn't support disk swapping for instance.) Of course it supports swapping to disk. The main differences are that they cut out some of addressing modes for various instructions, and a few other things. In general, the differences don't matter -- things like UNIX, or SetCPU, just use the common subset of features. The '030 actually adds a couple of things too. > Tony Leneis > aleneis@jarthur.claremont.edu > aleneis@hmcvax.bitnet -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
daveh@cbmvax.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (12/06/89)
in article <22891@gryphon.COM>, jdm@gryphon.COM (John Mesiavech) says: > Regarding the extra MMU on the CBM A2630 board...... There ain't one... > Had read on a technical board that the reason for the extra MMU > is that the one that's built into the 68030 is a SUBSET of the > 68851 MMU. So, CBM put the full MMU on the board for better UNIX > performance. The performance under UNIX isn't noticably lessened by the difference in MMUs; perhaps a little, due to the smaller ATC in the '030, but then again, the '030 has some advantages the '851 doesn't. In any case, there's not enough of an advantage to the '851 over the '030 MMU to justify the $100 or more those '851s cost. Even if the '851 could be used as an external MMU to the 68030, which it can't. The MMU coprocessor address isn't passed by the 68030, so a 68851 just sits there eating power and adding a wait state or so if it's put into a 68030 system. > John -- Dave Haynie Commodore-Amiga (Systems Engineering) "The Crew That Never Rests" {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!daveh PLINK: hazy BIX: hazy Too much of everything is just enough
aleneis%jarthur.claremont.edu@cunyvm.cuny.edu (12/06/89)
In article <787@crash.cts.com> lgreen@pnet01.cts.com (Lawrence Greenwald) writes: >68030 = 68020 CPU + BUILTIN 68851 MMU!!! > >Adding another '851 is a waste of silicon and board space!! If I remember correctly, the 68030 has an on-board MMU, but it isn't as powerful as a full 68851 (doesn't support disk swapping for instance.) Tony Leneis aleneis@jarthur.claremont.edu aleneis@hmcvax.bitnet
jdm%gryphon.com@cunyvm.cuny.edu (12/07/89)
Regarding the extra MMU on the CBM A2630 board...... Had read on a technical board that the reason for the extra MMU is that the one that's built into the 68030 is a SUBSET of the 68851 MMU. So, CBM put the full MMU on the board for better UNIX performance. John -- 0-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-0 | There once was a signature here, but I dunno where it went. | | ------------------------------------------------ | | jdm@gryphon.COM -- or-- <anywhere>!hplabs!gryphon!jdm | 0-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-0