raz%kilowatt@Sun.COM (Steve -Raz- Berry) (10/23/89)
In article <4407@sugar.hackercorp.com> peter@sugar.hackercorp.com (Peter da Silva) writes: >In article <89292.135300IMS103@PSUVM.BITNET> IMS103@PSUVM.BITNET writes: >> But I have to give Psygnosis credit. They sure have improved. > >Technically, yes. They still haven't figured out the difference between a >computer game and an arcade game, though. They've already *got* your money, >so why don't they let you play long enough to enjoy it? Graphics 10, Effects >10, Difficulty 10, Playability 1. I couldn't agree more. I just got Shadow of the Beast (complete with T shirt) and the game irritates the sh*t out of me. The graphics, music and even the story line are excellent. But the thing that *really* tee's me off about this thing is that you aren't allowed to skip the tacked on little scenes at the beginning and the end of a game. When you die you are FORCED to watch this picture of your-game-self's bones while this "emotive" music plays in the background. No abort, no restart to the actual playing portion of the game. To make things even worse, they reload the demo screen after your funeral dirge, just to let you know what the name of the game you are playing is. You know, I don't think that the programmers even played their own game. If they did, they'd probably hate it. >Peter "Have you hugged your wolf today" da Silva `-_-' >...texbell!sugar!peter, or peter@sugar.hackercorp.com 'U` Anybody want to buy a copy of Shadow of the Beast? $20 sans T shirt. --- Steve -Raz- Berry Disclaimer: It wasn't me! I was volatilizing my esters. UUCP: sun!kilowatt!raz ARPA: raz%kilowatt.EBay@sun.com KILOWATT: sun!kilowatt!archive-server archive-server%kilowatt.EBay@sun.com
smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) (10/25/89)
In article <126680@sun.Eng.Sun.COM>, raz%kilowatt@Sun.COM (Steve -Raz- Berry) writes: > > I couldn't agree more. I just got Shadow of the Beast (complete with T shirt) > and the game irritates the sh*t out of me. The graphics, music and even the > story line are excellent. But the thing that *really* tee's me off about this > thing is that you aren't allowed to skip the tacked on little scenes at the > beginning and the end of a game. When you die you are FORCED to watch this > picture of your-game-self's bones while this "emotive" music plays in the > background. > Being a computer artist at a software gaming company, I give Psygnosis all the credit in the world for this type of stuff. All other gaming companies pursue the greatness of their programmers and showing it while leaving their artists' work to be casually glanced over like an old newspaper. I think it's a matter of total company pride in a product and every individual is being rewarded through that product by letting their work be shown. Psygnosis is a type of company that wants to excell in evry aspect of their product and show it! I AM IN NO WAY ASSOCIATED WITH PSYGNOSIS, but try seeing it from my point. What if I was pissed because I didn't want to play the game at all and just look at the art? Why don't they put program interrupts in their software just to see their efforts, or to see the ending screen, or hear the win music? It's just a matter of pride in one's work. And as far as I'm concerned, I think Roger Dean and the boys are doing a pretty decent job on the creative half of their software. -Steve Suhy
karl@sugar.hackercorp.com (Karl Lehenbauer) (10/25/89)
In article <20211@unix.cis.pitt.edu> smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) writes: > Being a computer artist at a software gaming company, I give Psygnosis >all the credit in the world for this type of stuff. All other gaming >companies pursue the greatness of their programmers and showing it while >leaving their artists' work to be casually glanced over like an old >newspaper. I think it's a matter of total company pride in a product and >every individual is being rewarded through that product by letting their >work be shown. As a programmer and gamer, I have to disagree with you -- I don't like being forced to sit through a bunch of stuff when I really want to get back to the game -- but as a composer and arranger, I somewhat agree. More below. >Why don't they put program interrupts in their software just to see >their efforts, or to see the ending screen, or hear the win music? Actually, I think this request is *totally reasonable.* California Games, for example, would play all the way through the song if you just sat there and didn't do anything after finishing an event and at the start and event selection screens. I like listening to the music in games, and I would like to be able to browse all the artwork in a non-frenzied manner as well. If we (Hackercorp) ever finish another game, I'll make sure we provide something like that. -- -- uunet!sugar!karl "There is hopeful symbolism in the fact that -- flags do not wave in a vacuum." -- Arthur C. Clarke -- Usenet access: (713) 438-5018
peter@sugar.hackercorp.com (Peter da Silva) (10/26/89)
In article <20211@unix.cis.pitt.edu> smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) writes: > I think Roger Dean and the boys are doing a pretty decent job on the > creative half of their software. This sentence unwittingly hits the nail on the head. The other half of the team, the software guys, need as much creativity as the artists. And that's the problem with Psygnosis... they're unbalanced. The software guys are technically good, but don't seem to have any heart. And where were you artist fellas hiding out when I was looking for graphic input? I'll be the first to admit that Tracers is shortchanged in the visual department. -- Peter "Have you hugged your wolf today" da Silva `-_-' ...texbell!sugar!peter, or peter@sugar.hackercorp.com 'U` ``Back off dude! I'm a topologist!'' -- Andrew Molitor <amolitor@eagle.wesleyan.edu>
swarren@eugene.uucp (Steve Warren) (10/26/89)
In article <20211@unix.cis.pitt.edu> smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) writes: >In article <126680@sun.Eng.Sun.COM>, raz%kilowatt@Sun.COM (Steve -Raz- Berry) writes: :: :: I couldn't agree more. I just got Shadow of the Beast (complete with T shirt) :: and the game irritates the sh*t out of me. The graphics, music and even the :: story line are excellent. But the thing that *really* tee's me off about this :: thing is that you aren't allowed to skip the tacked on little scenes at the :: beginning and the end of a game. When you die you are FORCED to watch this :: picture of your-game-self's bones while this "emotive" music plays in the :: background. :: : Being a computer artist at a software gaming company, I give Psygnosis :all the credit in the world for this type of stuff. All other gaming :companies pursue the greatness of their programmers and showing it while :leaving their artists' work to be casually glanced over like an old :newspaper. I think it's a matter of total company pride in a product and :every individual is being rewarded through that product by letting their :work be shown. Psygnosis is a type of company that wants to excell in :evry aspect of their product and show it! I AM IN NO WAY ASSOCIATED :WITH PSYGNOSIS, but try seeing it from my point. What if I was pissed [...] Pride in your work is all well and good but you seem to have forgotten two major concepts (if you ever understood them ;^). 1) What is the product? 2) Who is the customer? The product is not art. The product is a computer game. The art exists to enhance the product, and is subjugated to it. The game does not exist for the purpose of providing a showcase for art. To the extent that the art enhances the entertainment value of the product, it is a Good Thing. But when the product is made less useable because the displaying of the art interferes with the game, then it has become a Bad Thing. The customer is the individual who lays out the cash for the product. He has the priviledge of defining at which point the art crosses the line from enhancement to interference. He pays the artist's and everyone else's salary. If he is not happy with the product he will not buy it. Any company that rewards its employees by crippling the products and putting the customer last in importance or significance will die. So there ;^) --Steve ------------------------------------------------------------------------- {uunet,sun}!convex!swarren; swarren@convex.COM
raz%kilowatt@Sun.COM (Steve -Raz- Berry) (10/27/89)
In article <20211@unix.cis.pitt.edu> smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) writes: >In article <126680@sun.Eng.Sun.COM>, raz%kilowatt@Sun.COM (Steve -Raz- Berry) writes: >> >> thing is that you aren't allowed to skip the tacked on little scenes at the >> beginning and the end of a game. When you die you are FORCED to watch this >> picture of your-game-self's bones while this "emotive" music plays in the >> background. >> > Being a computer artist at a software gaming company, I give Psygnosis >all the credit in the world for this type of stuff. All other gaming >companies pursue the greatness of their programmers and showing it while >leaving their artists' work to be casually glanced over like an old >newspaper. I think it's a matter of total company pride in a product and I have no problem with the art, music, or even the way they have presented it. I *liked* these scenes the *first* time I saw them. I would have kept the game if the programmers allowed me a way to get back to the business of actually playing it. But it is extremely irritating to spend 2 minutes playing the game and 5 minutes watching : The death scene, The "this is the shadow of the beast" scene, This is a creapy place and you better be carefull or you'll die scene. with no way to stop any of this from happening. Like I said, you are forced to watch all of this when you die, and in the begining you die a lot (at least I did). There are other problems, like the game knows nothing about expanded memory and it assumes you only have one disk drive. I can live with these shortcomings, although it would be so trivial for the programmers to use expanded memory (IMHO). I am impressed with the graphics and the sound, and I commend the artists and the programmers for their obviously hard work, but when all is said and done, when I buy a game I want to play it, not look at it. >-Steve Suhy --- Steve -Raz- Berry Disclaimer: It wasn't me! I was volatilizing my esters. UUCP: sun!kilowatt!raz ARPA: raz%kilowatt.EBay@sun.com KILOWATT: sun!kilowatt!archive-server archive-server%kilowatt.EBay@sun.com
donw@zehntel.zehntel.com (Don White) (10/28/89)
In article <4435@sugar.hackercorp.com> peter@sugar.hackercorp.com (Peter da Silva) writes: >In article <20211@unix.cis.pitt.edu> smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) writes: >> I think Roger Dean and the boys are doing a pretty decent job on the >> creative half of their software. > >This sentence unwittingly hits the nail on the head. > >The other half of the team, the software guys, need as much creativity as I disagree, Psygnosis has done games with game mechanics which I didn't like (for instance Barbarian and its' clone Obliterator), but, they have done others with excellent response. 'Beast' is a GOOD game. Its' response is instantaneous and FAST. They managed to do this AND acheive one of the best uses of the amiga graphics I have seen. One question, is Psygnosis a software development house or just a publisher? If they are JUST a publisher, then I would expect the quality of their software to fluctuate (as it has). If they are a development house, then I would have to say that THEY HAVE LEARNED that customers want fast reactions in gameplay. GOOD WORK! Don White Box 271177 Concord, CA. 94527-1177 zehtel!donw
smsst5@unix.cis.pitt.edu (Steve M Suhy) (10/28/89)
In article <2435@convex.UUCP>, swarren@eugene.uucp (Steve Warren) writes: > > Pride in your work is all well and good but you seem to have forgotten > two major concepts (if you ever understood them ;^). ^^ ^^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^ If I ever understood them?! A superior rating on my commercial product from several 'major' computer magazines for graphics... I guess I don't know too much. And winning arcade game of the year in one of them? I guess the programmer held up his end as well. But, of course, I don't understand major concepts. > 1) What is the product? > 2) Who is the customer? Well, I guess a selling trend of upwards toward 100,000 units means nothing to you. But, of course, I don't understand major concepts. > > The product is not art. The product is a computer game. The art exists > to enhance the product, and is subjugated to it. The game does not exist > for the purpose of providing a showcase for art. To the extent that the > art enhances the entertainment value of the product, it is a Good Thing. > But when the product is made less useable because the displaying of the > art interferes with the game, then it has become a Bad Thing. Anyone care for a casual game of Atari Pong? > > The customer is the individual who lays out the cash for the product. He > has the priviledge of defining at which point the art crosses the line from > enhancement to interference. He pays the artist's and everyone else's > salary. If he is not happy with the product he will not buy it. Any > company that rewards its employees by crippling the products and putting > the customer last in importance or significance will die. > > So there ;^) > > --Steve So there? Where's your software paycheck or royalties? The Amiga has been hailed a the new 'creative' computer. I'm not saying limit it to only displaying pictures and forgetting about play. Of course a product would die that way. But in the process, use your tools to their full advantage and not to what is limited by only mediocre conversions. What would you want on the Amiga? A graphic conversion of IBM screen colors? I don't think so, but of course, if you're into blandness or lack of visual excitement, which I think you are, there's hope for you yet. IFF's convert straight over! You need no work on your part! Isn't that wonderful. So why did you buy your Amiga anyway? -Steve Suhy > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > {uunet,sun}!convex!swarren; swarren@convex.COM
akcs.dfrancis@tronsbox.UUCP (Dennis Francis Heffernan) (12/08/89)
I understand also that Psygnosis plans to leave the computer market in favor of the Nintendo market due to (you guessed it) piracy. Which makes it rather academic as to whether or not their next game will let you abort the animations...
jcfst@unix.cis.pitt.edu (John C. Fossum) (12/09/89)
In article <[257f4123:1871.38]comp.sys.amiga;1@tronsbox.UUCP>, akcs.dfrancis@tronsbox.UUCP (Dennis Francis Heffernan) writes: > > I understand also that Psygnosis plans to leave the computer market in > favor of the Nintendo market due to (you guessed it) piracy. Which makes it > rather academic as to whether or not their next game will let you abort the > animations... I really don't think they're leaving the computer market since they are planiing to release...are you sitting down...13 titles for 1990, Amiga format. I think you read and misunderstood the credits on your manual for Beast by the '2' programmers saying they may give-up due to piracy. Incidently, they , these 2, are working on one of the future releases of Psygnosis. This does by no way mean the company is deteriorating. Companies that have fallen to buyout though are: Mindscape...to some unknown CinemaWare...to EA Oh well, life goes on. -Steve