bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) (11/17/89)
Hang on to your hats... I saw some amazing things today. Today, I met with the owner and designer of Digital Animation Productions. The future of graphics workstations is here. And it works. A few days ago, I posted a paraphrased version of the full-page AmigaWorld ad. One response complained of a lack of pictures. No picture can do justice. The 19 year-old inventor has built and has in production an Inmos T800 transputer based graphics workstation. The system consists of several parts. First is the transputer graphics board. This board contains a T800, 2 Meg of video ram, and 2 Meg of system ram. The board connects to an external multisync monitor. The board renders in 800x600 in an incredible 16 million colors (24 bit planes). The board also renders in 1280x1024 in 16 million colors. But that's not the limit. The system can also be configured to MUCH higher resolutions on the order of 8000x8000 pixels. How? The monitor acts as a window much like a super bitmap. The second part (or parts) is a T800 processor board with 1 Meg ram. This is actually a module which can be added on. In other words, you can plug multiple processor boards to increase processing capability. The third module is an interface card that links all processor boards and the graphics board. The interface card plugs into an Zorro II slot of a 2000. The other cards all plug into the PC slots. The cards do not communicate via the PC slots. They just use them for power. The cards all connect to the interface card. A standard 2000 can hold 17 Transputers and the graphics card. More can be added to an external PC backplane chassis. The boards are built individually because at this stage the cost to keep stock is to great. Now for the good part. The first demo was a ray-traced picture of a Roman column structure. The program is called QRT and is in the public domain. The columns were rendered in marble. The marbling is a fractal. The sand-dunes are a wave construct. The clouds are fractals. When rendered on a 68030 with an '882 math chip, the image took 46 hours and 23 minutes. Using a five transputer system, the image was rendered in 2 minutes and 13 seconds. Yes, you read that right. 2 minutes 13 seconds. In 16 million colors. Yes, ALL 16 million colors. This brings up an interesting and useful feature of the system. The system can be used in two ways. One is to combine all transputers in the system into one big and powerful transputer. This is how the Connection Machine works. The other way is to assign each transputer in the system to a specific task. One could be assigned to computing the marble fractal. Another can be assigned to computing the sand waves. Another can be assigned to computing the cloud fractal, while another can be assigned to performing the ray-tracing. In this configuration, one processor is used as a master. This one dictates what tasks the slaves will perform. The second demo was actually rendered before my very eyes. The scene contained 200 glass spheres with 60 light sources each being gel-ed. The rendering took 1 minute and 10 seconds. Now, if this had been attempted with the '030 configuration, I could have come back in two days and it still wouldn't be finished. The throughput of the 5 transputer system is around 140 MIPS. Yeah, 140. But the beauty of the system is that you can keep adding processors to increase throughput. The third demo was some Mandelbrot sets. This stuff was being rendered in a matter of minutes. This system is making the computer world sit up and take notice. The boards will run on PC and Amigas as well as some high-end workstations. But the designer has no intention to build one for the Mac. Apple has offered to buy him out/in to develop the system for the Mac only. They offered a cool million plus. He said no. Yippee! Yes the system works on other buses, but he prefers the Amiga because of the multitasking. The trnasputer system is totally separate to the Amiga. The means that you can be rendering a complex image while doing some word processing or desktop publishing and there's no worry of the system crashing. If the Ami crashes, the transputer keeps crunching away. This won't work on a PC. First of all, the PC can't multitask and second, if the PC crashes, you have to start over again. Impulse is working on a port of Turbo Silver and Microillusions is porting Photon Paint. And, get a load of this one, the guy who wrote Jet for Sublogic is developing something on the system. Unfortunately, this demo is being held up by a bad modem link. So, now that I've got you drooling on your terminal, you'll probably want to know what this feat of engineering costs. Well, it ain't cheap. The Graphics board is $6000. Individual processor boards are $2000. Buy four of them and the cost is $7000. There have been about 500 sold already. Yes this is a real system. No jumpers or other nasty things. This is not for the average home user unless you intend to put off buying that new car. SLAC is buying one to render their experiments. Production houses can use them with a SCSI film recorder to make commercials in much less time and much less cost than buying time on a Cray or other system. So, what about the future? As if the system as it is wasn't enough, the designer will release next year processor boards each capable of sustained performance of 100 MIPS and a burst performance of 200 MIPS. And, the company plans to develop a DSP system with phenomenal capabilities like being able to copy, yes copy, a CD onto a writeable CD. Record companies will pay hefty sums to keep this product off the market. But the designer intends it for use in the music industry to enable more musicians to produce their own CDs. The demo tape will be replaced by the demo CD. And that's all, folks. He's 19. He's a politcal science major at Boston University. And he runs this company. The address given in AmigaWorld is incorrect. The real address is 10 Thacher St. Suite 16 Boston, MA 02113 (617)-720-2355 I'm working on getting him access to the Usenet so he can personally answer your questions.
srp@modcomp.UUCP (Steve Pietrowicz) (11/18/89)
in article <42803@bu-cs.BU.EDU>, bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) says: > have to start over again. Impulse is working on a port of Turbo Silver and > Microillusions is porting Photon Paint. And, get a load of this one, the I remember Digital saying that at AmiExpo in Chicago. In their latest newsletter, Impulse said they looked at the board, but decided not to port to it at the current time. I just got off the phone with them, and they said that if the board gets "better" they'll consider doing it. They haven't completely given up on the board, but they're not doing much with it right now. -- SR Pietrowicz UUCP: ...!uunet!modcomp!srp CIS: 73047,2313
cmcmanis%pepper@Sun.COM (Chuck McManis) (11/18/89)
In article <42803@bu-cs.BU.EDU> bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) writes: >Record companies will pay hefty sums to keep this product off the market. Record companies never pay to keep things off the market, they send letters to powerful politicians to so completely confuse them that the politicians keep things off the market, but they never pay any money. Sounds like a whizzy box. Now if he would do the same with intel 860/960 combos not only would he have a whizzy box but an architecture that was better supported by the manufacturer. Don't misunderstand, the transputer is a whizzy product and it does neat things, but between the Inmos lies and the inability to price them reasonably it has never lived up to its potential. You will remember that the reason it was called a TRANSputer from the start and not a COMputer was because they were supposed to be as cheap and plentiful as TRANSistors. Argh, verry little signal. Ok, how about a question. Has this person looked at the Renderman spec? --Chuck McManis uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis BIX: cmcmanis ARPAnet: cmcmanis@Eng.Sun.COM These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you. "If it didn't have bones in it, it wouldn't be crunchy now would it?!"
Doug_B_Erdely@cup.portal.com (11/18/89)
Just to clear things up a bit. According to info only a week or so old from Impulse... they will NOT be doing a port of Turbo Silver to the Transputers. At least at this time. So why does everyone else keep saying they are? And don't hold your breath for Sculpt. They (in my opinion) are too stupid to do much of anything right! :) I mean, they don't have texture mapping yet! - Doug - Doug_B_Erdely@Cup.Portal.Com
lphillips@lpami.wimsey.bc.ca (Larry Phillips) (11/20/89)
In <842@thor.wright.EDU>, amercer@thor.wright.edu (Art Mercer) writes: >From article <102@amix.commodore.com>, by ag@amix.commodore.com (Keith Gabryelski): >> In article <23824@cup.portal.com> Classic_-_Concepts@cup.portal.com writes: >> [...] >>> We are expecting to release all of System V Release 4.0. > >My wife was fortunate to see the AMIX demonstration at EDUCOM, don't >know if it was Sys V v4.x or not, but she said it seem rather quick. > >The real questions on our minds is the user interface. Is it CBM's >own? Is it based on , or compatible with, X windowing? > >Also, will ethernet and TCP/IP, subnetting, NFS, etc be available from >CBM? > >And lastly, will the Bridge board be supported from the AMIX side of >thing? > >So far the Amiga (3 A2500's & 1 A2000) have worked well for my consulting >staff in our somewhat convoluted environment, but the inclusion on the >items in the query above would make life even easier. Here is the text of a sheet handed out at the Pacific Rim Computer Show in early November. I quote it verbatim. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Amiga 2500UX - AMIX Preliminary Specification May 1989 The Amiga 2500UX computer is a UNIX (R) compatible desktop workstation from Commodore Business Machines Limited. The 2500UX runs the AMIX (R) operating system. AMIX was developed for the 2500UX by Commodore and is based on AT&T Systen V (tm). In addition to all the standard features and utilities that are are included with System V, AMIX provides the user with a rapid window interface optimized to take advantage of custom graphics hardware found in the Amiga, useful Berkely utilities such as the CSH shell and S-Mail, TCP/IP support, and X/Windows. AMIX Windoews provides a multitasking user interface that allows you to view several applications on a screen concurrently. By taking advantage of the built-in blitter graphics hardware of the Amiga, AMIX Windows has been optimized for fast text and graphics screen activity with minimal impact on CPU performance. Multiple screens may be invoked to support a variety of user interfaces. Presently in a development phase, the A2500UX is expected to be ready for release by 1990. Development systems are available now for qualified vendors. Operating System: AMIIX (UNIX for the Commodore Amiga compatible with AT&T System V release 3.2) Processors: M68030 CPU (25 MHz) M68881 FPU (25 MHz) AGNUS, PAULA, DENISE custom application coprocessors (7 MHz) RAM: 5 MB (configured as 4 MB 32 bit access, 1 MB 16 bit access) AUTOCONFIG expandable to 9 MB (with AUTOCONFIG) Hard Disk: 100 MB SCSI internal (19 ms average seek) Archive Backup: 150 MB SCSI internal cartridge tape Video: support for resolutions up to 1008 x 800 (4 shade monochrome) or 640 x 400 (4096 colour palette) AMIX, Amiga are trademarks of Commodore Business machines Limited. UNIX, System V are registered trademarks of AT&T. Please note specifications are preliminary and subject to change. -------------- end quoted sheet --------------------- As for my own observations.... Each screen may have a separate login, and thus a different user interface. The AMIX Windows system is... different. It is unlike any window interface I have seen before. Text is blindingly fast. It's real, true UNIX. -larry -- My name is OS/2, Mandius, Kludge of Kludges. Look upon my works, ye CS majors, and gag. +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | // Larry Phillips | | \X/ lphillips@lpami.wimsey.bc.ca -or- uunet!van-bc!lpami!lphillips | | COMPUSERVE: 76703,4322 -or- 76703.4322@compuserve.com | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
C503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu (Baird McIntosh) (11/20/89)
In article <42803@bu-cs.bu.edu>, bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) writes: >Hang onto your hats... Whoops...there it goes! :-) > [lots of stuff about D.A.P. and their graphics/transputer boards that makes > heads spin, mouths water, and ears ring...or mouths spin, ears water and > heads ring...whatever! :-) 16 million color 800x600 complex raytraces > requiring 46:23 hours:minutes on an '030 '882 Amiga done on a 5-transputer > system in 00:2:13 hours:minutes:seconds; drool, drool, gawk, drool.. :-) ] Pleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease say that this is all true. Tell me that this guy is producing the board for the Amiga and that people have it already and that products like Photon Paint are really being converted to work with it. Also tell me that it will be used by real people as a real alternative to other more expensive systems. In other words, all that info sounds incredibly good. Does Commodore have any intention of helping the owner/designer of D.A.P. in getting the boards marketted and/or funded? > ...boards will run on PC and Amigas as well as some high-end workstations. > But the designer has no intention to build one for the Mac. Apple has > offered to buy him out/in to develop the system for the Mac only. They > offered a cool million plus. He said no. Yippee! [...] Is this guy rich? How'd he get the resources to develop and produce these boards? AND he refuses $1,000,000.00+ ? (I know it's Apple, but that is still a lot of $$CASH$$. If he refused that offer, he's got something!) > And that's all, folks. He's 19. He's a political science major at > Boston University. And he runs this company. The address given in > AmigaWorld [December] is incorrect. The real address is > > 10 Thacher St. Suite 16 > Boston, MA 02113 > (617)-720-2355 > > I'm working on getting him access to the Usenet so he can personally answer > your questions. > He's 19?? *I'm* 19! Jeesh! And he's a poli.sci. major? How'd he design the boards? How many people are in the company helping him? If I could only see one of these...guaranteed response: "Oh, *WOW*!" # Baird McIntosh "...Can you hear me running; can you hear me calling you?" # # INTERNET: c503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu <-or-> BITNET: c503719@umcvmb.bitnet #
vinsci@ra.abo.fi (Leonard Norrgard) (11/21/89)
You people don't know of Sang Computer systems? They have a whole range of Transputer boards for the Amiga, including graphics. And, they have the software too. Well, not things like transputer versions of the commercial raytracers but things like Helios, compilers and more. Plugs into Amigas, PC:s and Ataris, but no Macs :-). Want more info? I have Sangs brochures at home, with lots of technical details. -- Leonard Norrgard, vinsci@ra.abo.fi, vinsci@finabo.bitnet, +358-21-6375762, EET.
esker@abaa.uucp (Lawrence Esker) (11/21/89)
In article <4461@nigel.udel.EDU> C503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu (Baird McIntosh) writes: >In article <42803@bu-cs.bu.edu>, bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) writes: >> ...boards will run on PC and Amigas as well as some high-end workstations. >> But the designer has no intention to build one for the Mac. Apple has >> offered to buy him out/in to develop the system for the Mac only. They >> offered a cool million plus. He said no. Yippee! [...] > >Is this guy rich? How'd he get the resources to develop and produce these >boards? AND he refuses $1,000,000.00+ ? (I know it's Apple, but that is >still a lot of $$CASH$$. If he refused that offer, he's got something!) Come on, use a little math. The original article said he sold 500 units to date at about $6,000. Lets say half included the 4 processor boards at $7,000. Then his income has been $4.75 million. A startup venture on low volume products needs a 400 % markup over cost to stay alive, so 80 % of that is income of $3.8 million already earned. Hell, Apple's $1 million is a petty cash offer. Not knowing his expences to date, or his incremental cost, I can only guess, but I would say the company has already cleared $1 million profit. Thank goodness he is business minded. I can imagine selling out to Apple and us hearing more junk about Apples multi-media superiority because of this product. Apple doesn't come close to the Amiga today, lets hope it never does. -- ---------- Lawrence W. Esker ---------- Modern Amish: Thou shalt not need any computer that is not IBM compatible. UseNet Path: __!mailrus!sharkey!itivax!abaa!esker == esker@abaa.UUCP
baer@qiclab.UUCP (Ken Baer) (11/22/89)
In article <24178@cup.portal.com> Doug_B_Erdely@cup.portal.com writes: >Just to clear things up a bit. According to info only a week or so old from >Impulse... they will NOT be doing a port of Turbo Silver to the Transputers. >At least at this time. So why does everyone else keep saying they are? Because the Digital Animation Production folx are telling everyone that Impulse is still doing it. >And don't hold your breath for Sculpt. They (in my opinion) are too stupid >to do much of anything right! :) Byte-by-Byte doesn't support the Amiga versions of Sculpt3/4D(et. al.) anymore, haven't you heard? So, don't hold your breath for any Amiga updates of Sculpt. We would probably support the Transputer board if they sent us one (which they have promised many times). It's difficult to support something you can't get your hands on. >Doug_B_Erdely@Cup.Portal.Com -- // -Ken Baer. Programmer/Animator, Hash Enterprises. \X/ Usenet: baer@qiclab.UUCP or PLink: KEN BAER "I want to be an ..... ARCH VILLIAN!!!" -- Petey Pate.
koren@hpfelg.HP.COM (Steve Koren) (11/22/89)
> Now for the good part. The first demo was a ray-traced picture of >a Roman column structure. The program is called QRT and is in the public >domain. The columns were rendered in marble. The marbling is a fractal. >The sand-dunes are a wave construct. The clouds are fractals. When Is this true? Using QRT, I mean? The image you describe would be much easier to generate with DBW. (I happen to know exactly what is and is not easy to do in QRT, since the author of QRT and I are one and the same person). Also, for the record, QRT is not public domain. It is freely distributable freely modifyable software which is copyrighted to me. Close to the same thing, but that way I can keep others from selling it. Anyhow, best of luck to this guy. I'd be amazed if he can pull it off for his advertized price; that board, plus a couple of transputers and a 2000 would be less bucks that decently equipped Mac II. - steve
Doug_B_Erdely@cup.portal.com (11/23/89)
Ken wrote that Byte by Byte does not support the Amiga Sculpt 4D... You are kidding right? I knew they were talking about such stupid things, but I never imagined that even they would be stupid enough to actually do] it... Wait till I tell the local company here using Sculpt... they just purchased it, they won't be to happy! FLAME ON! If Byte by Byte is going to sell a product, they damn well better support it! This proves my point that it was a basement co. that never grew up managment wise. They never did support the Amiga version well to begin with, how the hell do the expect to get anywhere in the Mac market? you can be sure I will pass the word to my Mac friends about Byte by Bytes support, or more like lack of support. Good bye I say... Turbo Silver is a better and FAR less expensive product. And it HAS texture mapping. Something Mr. Peterson kept avoiding whenever you would ask questions! FLAME OFF! Sorry... but I feel a bit better. If they are not going to support their own damn product. Don't sell the thing. - Doug - Doug_B_Erdely@Cup.Portal.Com
visinfo@ethz.UUCP (VISINFO Moderators) (11/23/89)
In article <42803@bu-cs.BU.EDU> bear@bu-pub.bu.edu (Blair M. Burtan) writes: >I saw some amazing things today. Today, I met with the owner and designer >of Digital Animation Productions. The future of graphics workstations is >here. And it works. A few days ago, I posted a paraphrased version of the >full-page AmigaWorld ad. One response complained of a lack of pictures. >No picture can do justice. The 19 year-old inventor has built and has in >production an Inmos T800 transputer based graphics workstation. > This system is making the computer world sit up and take notice. >The boards will run on PC and Amigas as well as some high-end workstations. >But the designer has no intention to build one for the Mac. Apple has >offered to buy him out/in to develop the system for the Mac only. They >offered a cool million plus. He said no. Yippee! Yes the system works on >other buses, but he prefers the Amiga because of the multitasking. Great that finally someone makes a really professional graphics/transputer board and prefers the Amiga. This could put the Amiga into a better position in the eyes of professional users. I saw this system at the AmiEXPO Cologne and was really impressed. Now the Amiga is a graphics workstation with no limitations. >Impulse is working on a port of Turbo Silver and >Microillusions is porting Photon Paint. And, get a load of this one, the >guy who wrote Jet for Sublogic is developing something on the system. As far as I know Turbo Silver and Photon Paint is only available on the Amiga now and not on the PC. Is this meaning that Impuls and Microillusion make only software for the Transputer board with the Amiga as host computer? This would be very easy, because they could leave the user interface on the Amiga and implement only the rendering part on the T800. If not they must completely rewrite the whole user interface either on the PC or on the Transputer (which will be difficult because there is no standard Operating System on the Transputer right now; they told me that Helios crashes very often and they don't need a OS for raytracing when there is a host system like the Amiga). If the Software is only running together with an Amiga and not with the PC a lot companies will buy Amigas as host computers for their Transputer boards. They want basically the Transputer system and so it is probably not so important for them which computer is the host. This could be a chance for the Amiga to be considered as a professional computer. The software companies that now program for the Amiga can determine this by adapting their software for the Transputer board while using the Amiga as the user interface. A Transputer board really needs a multitasking system as host. /* -------------------------- SG (Simeon Graphics) ---------------------- */ /* Peter Simeon, UUCP: | // // */ /* visinfo@bernina.ethz.ch | // Long live the AMIGA! // */ /* BIX: hardwiz | \X/ \X/ */ /* ---------------------------------------------------------------------- */
glenng@analogy.UUCP (Glenn Graham) (11/24/89)
>Byte-by-Byte doesn't support the Amiga versions of Sculpt3/4D(et. al.) >anymore, haven't you heard? So, don't hold your breath for any Amiga >updates of Sculpt. Common Ken, Thats not true. Byte-By-Byte is putting alot of resources into a Mac version of Sculpt but that does not mean they have dropped the Amiga version (though I don't think they have any plans to support the transputer either). The expanded user base will make for a stronger company. I don't hear anybody giving Electronic Arts a bad time for releasing versions of Deluxe Paint for other machines... Also, I think you need to add a disclaimer if you are going to take shots at a company that competes with your employer :) Disclaimer of my own: I do testing of Sculpt for BBB in my spare time and have produced 3D objects for them. All opinions are my own. _ _ / ) Glenn Graham, Analogy Inc. / \ / / Simulation, 3D Modeling & Animation, Electronic Design (_/\V / Proud Member Of: "The Graphics Group From Hell" (oo) UUCP: sun!nosun!analogy!glenng ( *) -
plouff@levers.enet.dec.com (11/26/89)
While users group meetings are not normally announced on the net, I thought the following might lead to some answers regarding the DAP boards and software. On Monday, December 4, DAP will appear at the Boston Computer Society Amiga Tech Group meeting. It's at 7:30 PM; location is Department of Transportation Bldg., 55 Broadway (Kendall Sq.), Cambridge. Local contact is Bob Ryan, (617) 848-3490. Admission free. From the announcement... "Daniel Ten Ton, of Digital Animation Productions, demonstrates transputer-based video graphics and processor boards for the Commodore Amiga 2000... Ton addresses some of the issues involved in programming for parallel computing, and discusses some of the programming languages and tools available for his systems." -- Wes Plouff, Digital Equipment Corp, Littleton, Mass. plouff%levers.enet.dec@decwrl.dec.com Networking bibliography: _Islands in the Net_, by Bruce Sterling _The Matrix_, by John S. Quarterman
baer@qiclab.UUCP (Ken Baer) (12/01/89)
In article <598@illini.analogy.UUCP> glenng@illini.UUCP (Glenn Graham) writes: > >>Byte-by-Byte doesn't support the Amiga versions of Sculpt3/4D(et. al.) >>anymore, haven't you heard? So, don't hold your breath for any Amiga >>updates of Sculpt. > >Common Ken, Thats not true. Byte-By-Byte is putting alot of resources into >a Mac version of Sculpt but that does not mean they have dropped the Amiga >version. Byte-by-Byte DID sell all of their Amiga versions of Sculpt to Centaur Software (which is owned by Creative Computers). I had heard that they also dropped plans for upgrading, since they were moving their developers over onto the Mac. It does sound like they are still doing phone support for Amiga customers, which is good. > The expanded user base will make for a stronger company. I don't >hear anybody giving Electronic Arts a bad time for releasing versions of >Deluxe Paint for other machines... If they really wanted to expand their use base, they should have ported to the IBM, it's a MUCH bigger market than the MacII. It may not be the most appealing thought to us, but that's where the real money is. Is the Mac Sculpt out yet? It'll be interesting to see how well it does. It may serve as a guide to the rest of us who are considering porting to the Mac (we gotta eat, you know). >Also, I think you need to add a disclaimer if you are going to take shots >at a company that competes with your employer :) I don't consider my statement as a "shot" at them. I was just trying to state a fact (BbB selling Amiga products to someone else). I still think Sculpt4D is a great product, but it isn't the only show in town either. Disclaimer: I don't have time to bash our "competitors", I'd rather write software and make animation (it's more fun anyway!). My opinions are mine, and you can't have them! :-) > _ / ) Glenn Graham, Analogy Inc. > / \ / / Simulation, 3D Modeling & Animation, Electronic Design > (_/\V / Proud Member Of: "The Graphics Group From Hell" > (oo) UUCP: sun!nosun!analogy!glenng > ( *) > - -- // -Ken Baer. Programmer/Animator, Hash Enterprises. \X/ Usenet: baer@qiclab.UUCP or PLink: KEN BAER "I want to be an ..... ARCH VILLIAN!!!" -- Petey Pate.
pete@i-core.UUCP (Pete Ashdown) (12/15/89)
In article <3329@qiclab.UUCP>, baer@qiclab.UUCP (Ken Baer) writes: >If they really wanted to expand their use base, they should have ported to >the IBM, it's a MUCH bigger market than the MacII. It may not be the >most appealing thought to us, but that's where the real money is. Is >the Mac Sculpt out yet? It'll be interesting to see how well it does. >It may serve as a guide to the rest of us who are considering porting >to the Mac (we gotta eat, you know). Sculpt has been out for the Mac II for a while now. The only animation I've seen that was done with it was coincidentally Kahnakas (with a cute little Apple reflecting off the balls). It wasn't much more spectacular. As a matter of fact, it was looking very 320x200ish on that 640x480 screen. HAM definitely does a better job. One of my friends works in a store that sells Macs. He is an Amiga owner as well. He called me one day and was laughing into the phone about how they had just gotten Sculpt in for the Mac II. I believe the price was around $800 (ooofff). I think it is quite rotten of Eric Graham to abandon the Amiga. Especially considering all the free publicity (cover of Amiga World) and support that the users have given him.