acliu@skat.usc.edu (Alex C. Liu) (03/12/90)
I think the main advantage for Self Extracting Files go for people who only have one drive and/or no Hard Disk. In that case one has to flip to several disks to find the appropiate archiver and then have to flip disks and so on. The problem with Self Extracting files though (Besides the one alredy mentioned) is that you need to use the SAME computer that the file was archived for. For example if I get a ZOO file, I can always dearchive it using an Amiga or a Unix Box or a MSDOS box. But if I get a Self Extracting file, I would need a MS-DOS box or an Amiga. (Portability problems...) ______________________________________________________________________ Alex C. Liu | INTERNET: acliu%skat@usc.edu Voice: (213) 749-2730 | BITNET: acliu%skat@gamera Q-Link: Alejandro | UUCP: ...!usc!edu
md3b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Matthew Donald Drown) (03/12/90)
After scanning through all the messages about how people will never ever download something unless it has the source, or unless they know the author, etc, I can understand why people are so afraid of viruses, and the like. Believe or not people not everyone in the Amiga world is working on ways to erase your harddrive and kill your dog. I can't possibly believe you people who run string comparision tests on all their archives, and never run anything that resembles something bad. Hell, turn the machine on, boot the damn thing, if it doesn't do what you want, turn the machine off, go get a drink, come back and delete the archive. It sounds like many users, or maybe just the over anxious to post users, have no trust in anything. Learn to trust somethings, it's a computer, you have control over it, not vice-versa. Personally I don't mind self extracting archives, but they aren't needed on the amiga that much. On the commodore 64 where memory was very important, the self dissolving arc programs were nice, you didn't have to spend 10 minutes loading a stupid little program to dissolve your program. Just my personal opinion. -Matt Drown (md3b@andrew.cmu.edu) -/ I even Download things without the source, and then run them /-
rogers@iris.ucdavis.edu (Brewski Rogers) (03/12/90)
I think the main reason no self-extracting archiver ever caught on is that you don't need to get the program to de-archive your file, and so when it comes time to archive a file, you find you don't have the self-extracting archiver, and just use ZOO instead. ... ------------------------------------------------------ Quantum _\/_ 2727 Eel Bruce (6502 RULES!) Rogers |\ Duck ( 0 0) Davis, Ca 95616 Quantum Duck Software, |\ \______/ / \\\ 916-756-2684 rogers@iris.ucdavis.edu |\ < < | \/ "My brain is on fire!" \________/ Quark!
consp11@bingsunm.cc.binghamton.edu (Brett Kessler) (03/13/90)
> I think the main advantage for Self Extracting Files go for people who > only have one drive and/or no Hard Disk. I have to differ. I think the main advantage for Self Extracting Files would have to be their extension. Imagine all of those .SEX files that are able to take care of themselves! ;-) +-------///--------------------| BRETT KESSLER |--------------------\\\-------+ | /// E-Mail to: consp11@bingvaxu.cc.binghamton.edu \\\ | | /// or try: consp11@bingsuns.pod.binghamton.edu \\\ | | \\\/// and to: consp11@bingvaxa.BITNET \\\/// | | \XX/ or on PeopleLink: B.KESSLER \XX/ | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
sparks@corpane.UUCP (John Sparks) (03/13/90)
md3b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Matthew Donald Drown) writes: > I can't possibly believe you people who run string comparision >tests on all their archives, and never run anything that resembles >something bad. Hell, turn the machine on, boot the damn thing, >if it doesn't do what you want, turn the machine off, go get a drink, >come back and delete the archive. Matt, What you say makes sense for those of us running off of floppy systems. But I think most of the 'paranoia' about viruses comes from those with hard drives. Unless you want to risk infecting your hard drive, you either have to be very careful with what you run on your machine, or disconnect your hard drive everytime you want to try some unknown software. You can't write protect a hard drive like you can a floppy. So you have to be extra paranoid about what you run. -- John Sparks | D.I.S.K. 24hrs 1200bps. Accessable via Starlink (Louisville KY) sparks@corpane.UUCP <><><><><><><><><><><> D.I.S.K. ph:502/968-5401 thru -5406 A virtuous life is its own punishment.
maniac@howlin.cs.unlv.edu (Eric J. Schwertfeger) (03/14/90)
I'm glad that self-extracting archivers never caught on, but for a different reason. The problem lies in the difference between transmitting an executable via modem, or a data file via modem. I once spent several hours tring to unarchive a .PAK (the self-extracting kind) file, with no success because the uploader had managed to get the file incorrectly padded. So, the file lengths wouldn't match, and AmiDos wouldn't execute the file. I tried padding the file more, chopping off some, but never could get the file to execute. Since PAK doesn't have a non-self extracting option, I was stuck. The way I finally got around it was to download the archiver, and add a 1K dummy file (shorter files didn't help) to the archive. Appearantly, this straightened out the problem. Actually, I have seen ONE good use for self-extracting archivers on a local BBS. The sysop keeps Zoo, ARC, LHArc, and Zippy in .PAK format so that you can download them and use them even if you don't have any unarchivers. Eric Schwertfeger, maniac@jimi.CS.UNLV.EDU
bobl@pro-graphics.cts.com (Bob Lindabury) (03/14/90)
In-Reply-To: message from md3b+@andrew.cmu.edu > Personally I don't mind self extracting archives, but they aren't > needed on the amiga that much. On the commodore 64 where > memory was very important, the self dissolving arc programs were > nice, you didn't have to spend 10 minutes loading a stupid little > program to dissolve your program. > Just my personal opinion. > > -Matt Drown (md3b@andrew.cmu.edu) Also, an application for self extracting files (I've seen Zsoft use this for MSDOS) is to pack your programs into self extracting files on disks and then use a batch program to do an automatic installation for you. In fact, Zsoft does this to it's newer PCPaintbrush programs allowing for all the drivers etc to be on less disks. It's also a good way to do demo's and such that have to be installed on a hard drive to run because of space limitations. This way the batch file can just run the self extracting file and extract it to the device specified in the batch file variables by the user when he picks items from a menu. This works well for reputable software companies and I don't see a problem with it. -- Bob _______________________ Pro-Graphics BBS 201/469-0049 ________________________ InterNet: bobl@pro-graphics.cts.com | ProLine: bobl@pro-graphics UUCP: ..crash!pro-graphics!bobl | CServe: 70347,2344 ARPA/DDN: ..crash!pro-graphics!bobl@nosc.mil | Amer. Online: Graphics3D ___________ ____________ Raven Enterprises - 25 Raven Ave. Piscataway, NJ 08854