wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) (03/14/90)
Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp 1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple yes or no to Tad. -- ------------------------------------ Chris Brand - wizard@sosaria.imp.com "Justice is the possession and doing of what one is entitled to" - Platon ------------------------------------
stan@teroach.UUCP (Stan Fisher) (03/15/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: > >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The >fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there >are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. >Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp >1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting >such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple >yes or no to Tad. >------------------------------------ >Chris Brand - wizard@sosaria.imp.com >"Justice is the possession and doing >of what one is entitled to" - Platon >------------------------------------ As long as we're expressing our opinions..... I for one am very impressed with Tad's efforts in binaries & sources. ***Three cheers for Tad**** I say (my opinion) keep it coming! I've been quite happy to see (especially) the large postings (uucp 1.3D etc.). I realize for folks with a 12/2400 baud feed that the larger postings are tying up their lines for quite a while, BUT, I'd hate to see the traffic on bins & srcs truncated. We just got them flowing again! It's REALLY good to see the volume right about where it's at. What's killing me is the volume posted to c.s.a, c.s.a.t & c.s.a.h. It's getting REAL hard to stay current. If I don't spend a half hour to an hour reading everyday I get behind several hundred articles. The 'k' key gets used an awfull lot. Not really complaining, I'm kinda proud that we use the most popular, highest volume news groups on the whole damn net. (We Bad!) Stan Fisher - stan@teroach.phx.mcd.mot.com - asuvax!mcdphx!teroach!stan Motorola Microcomputer Division, Tempe, Arizona - Voice (602) 438-3228 Call our User Group BBS "M.E.C.C.A." running Atredes 1.1 @ (602) 893-0804
gheff@hubcap.clemson.edu (Gary R Heffelfinger) (03/16/90)
From article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com>, by wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand): > > Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via > comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Good grief. Some folks are never happy. :-) > example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The > fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there > are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. So ignore Empire (like I did) and download MSH. Easy. I like games and I like MSH. Imagine that. I can make use of both kinds of programs. I think the idea of prohibiting games is a lousy one. If that offends you, create alt.binaries.amiga.tech and post only tools. That way you won't even have to look at the nasty games. > Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp > 1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting > such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple > yes or no to Tad. Now size is a completely different ball game. Though I doubt that Tad would be thrilled about having to tally votes for each large submission he wants to post. We asked Tad to be our moderator, I think we should trust his judgement on the size of postings. If you (or anyone else) disapproves of the 15 part postings, then email to Tad to express your opinion might be appropriate. But having a referendum for each large package is just going to slow down our already harried moderator. -Gary -- Gary R Heffelfinger ------ gheff@hubcap.clemson.edu Clemson University - Info. Systems Development Eagles soar, but a weasel will never get sucked into a jet engine.
davidw@telxon.UUCP (David Wright) (03/16/90)
I disagree completely. Perhaps YOU don't want them, but I can assure you, many people do! I constantly get requests for FTP sites for Empire and CRobots, and each posting of them has generated even more thanks. If you don't have the space, and are receiving them directly on your Amiga, I am sorry, but I am sure more people would rather get them through a newsgroup instead of having to find the correct address to ask for the latest version. The net is the perfect place to keep the current versions of most PD software posted. By having it appear periodically you can be sure that most people will have a fairly current version. If you depend on people asking specifically for something, much less would appear. I am willing to bet most people would rather just grab what came by as they see it, if it interests them, than to have to send private mail to the authors of programs they like asking for the latest version. Dave -- _____________________________ Telxon: Amiga - The ONLY choice |________ | x4350 for REAL computing | | | davidw // |________| |
840445m@aucs.uucp (Alan McKay) (03/16/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: > >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The >fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there >are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. I disagree. I like games as well as other stuff to come across on the net. Sure, maybe an inquirey would be in order before large ones are posted, but other than that I think Tad should continue on as he has been doing. I might add that I think he is doing a great job, keep up the good work Tad. -- + Alan W. McKay + VOICE: (902) 542-1565 + + Acadia University + "Courage my friend, it is not yet too late + + WOLFVILLE, N.S. + to make the world a better place." + + 840445m@AcadiaU.CA + - Tommy Douglas +
cmcmanis@stpeter.Sun.COM (Chuck McManis) (03/16/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> (Chris Brand) writes: >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. I'm reminded of the phrase, "One man's meat is another man's poison." There are people who live for a new PD game to be available, whereas others could care less. Similarly with UUCP, the latest version of emacs etc etc. I presume you are complaining because you archive this stuff and are running out of space. That isn't any excuse for cutting off the rest the world now is it? Suggestion 1: Keep the "rate" of binaries at some fixed limit of megabytes per week. That way you will always know what the maximum space is to reserve per week for the binaries and you can trim your archive once a week. Suggestion 2: Do NOT "limit" the kinds of executables that can be posted because neither you nor I can make any sort of rational decision on what should and shouldn't be posted because we don't know the needs of everyone else. Note : comp.binaries.amiga are run for the benefit of the comp.sys.amiga* readership and not for the archivists. If a policy decision has to be made always hold in favor of the readership as they are your real customers. --Chuck McManis uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis BIX: cmcmanis Internet: cmcmanis@Eng.Sun.COM These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you. "If it didn't have bones in it, it wouldn't be crunchy now would it?!"
robin@sabre.austin.ibm.com (Robin D. Wilson/1000000) (03/16/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The >fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there >are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. >Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp >1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting >such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple >yes or no to Tad. I disagree entirely. I find the flow is too small for my tastes and would like to see much more. I don't mind all of the big postings either, since I would rather down load it from the net than go to a store an pay $5-10 for PD software. You can always remove the stuff you don't want from your machine, and then the rest of us don't have to suffer. (BTW, I'm assuming the complaint is generated by the fact that Chris is getting a News feed to a machine that doesn't have a great deal of space.) +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ |The views expressed herein, are the sole responsibility of the typist at hand| +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+ |USNail: UUCP: | |2323 Wells Branch Pkwy., #G107 cs.utexas.edu!romp!ibmchs!auschs\ | |Austin, TX 78728 !sabre.austin.ibm.com!robin | |Home: (512)251-6889 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<-MUST BE INCLUDED| +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
oliver@smith.cs.unc.edu (Bill Oliver) (03/16/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: > >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The >fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there >are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. >Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp >1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting >such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple >yes or no to Tad. > > I don't understand. It's a bit too much by what criteria? Too much for the storage capacity for whomever is archiving it at the ftp sites (God bless you all!!)? Too much for one individual user to keep up with? I heartily disagree that there is too much, from this simple reader/downloader's point of view. If there are archival problems at the ftp sites, then, of course, those people who are archiving will have to take some action to either limit what they archive or increase their capacity -- but that is not a reason to keep something off the net. Certainly not everyone likes games, but many people -- including me -- love them. Not everyone likes math packages, scientific programs, graphics hacks, or what have you. What would be gained by limiting access to any or all of the "genres" of PD software? Bill Oliver
stevel@tybalt.caltech.edu (Steve Ludtke) (03/16/90)
wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The >fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there >are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. Did someone change the name to comp.binaries.amiga.SERIOUS_work_only ? I, personally, might be interested in programs from just about any catagory. Games included : ) >Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp >1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting >such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple >yes or no to Tad. What IS your problem ? Are you a sysop complaining about your phone bills, or do you just HATE to have to scroll through all those listings on the screen. So what are you proposing ? "Oh, only 15% of the readers will use package x, so let's not let them have it..." If you can't deal with the phone bills, unsubscribe to the group, and phone a BBS and download only what you want. btw - If you think the things posted to comp.binaries.amiga are big, have you ever seen the ibm or unix postings in 30 or more parts. I don't think 8 or 9 parts for something useful like a spreadsheet is all that bad. I hate to flame, but ... -- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- stevel@tybalt.caltech.edu CS-> | <-Ph stevel@citiago (Bitnet) \|/ I DO ... 72335,1537 (Compuserve) ?
consp11@bingsune.cc.binghamton.edu (Brett Kessler) (03/16/90)
> Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via > comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for > example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The > fact is, games are something by far not everybody likes. I'm sure there > are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. > Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or uucp > 1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. How about an inquiry before posting > such a big package? People who mind the posting could then send a simple > yes or no to Tad. A bad idea, IMHO. I like MOST of the stuff that comes down the net, be it a game or MSH or whatever. If I don't like something, I don't have to save it into a file, I just have to click on the "read next message" button, and voila! it's gone. But limiting comp.binaries.amiga to smaller programs or utilities only is silly. I downloaded MSH and the XSize thing, but I also wanted NetHack 3.0 and Empire. If there's something you don't want, just ignore it. +------///-+------------------| BRETT KESSLER |------------------+-\\\------+ | /// | consp11@bingvaxu.cc.binghamton.edu | \\\ | | \\\/// | consp11@bingvaxa.BITNET | \\\/// | | \XX/ | (PeopleLink) B.KESSLER | \XX/ | +----------+-----------------------------------------------------+----------+
tadguy@abcfd01.larc.nasa.gov (Tad Guy) (03/17/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: > Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via > comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, > for example. This (and the other comments I've read) seems too subjective. I decided to whip up a perl script that would summarize the article history of comp.binaries.amiga (the complete data has been posted separately as "Article History of comp.{sources|binaries}.amiga" elsewhere in comp.sys.amiga). Here we see a table of postings ordered by number of complete packages by package type. Games go under the ``fun'' hierarchy, so games have been the fourth largest component in comp.binaries.amiga, or just over 9.5% of the kinds of postings... Table of Submissions types by packages to date in comp.binaries.amiga: Type of Package Packages Issues util 13 37 unix 7 28 applications 7 23 fun 4 25 devices 3 6 kernel 2 2 workbench 1 1 audio 1 2 comm 1 2 fonts 1 1 midi 1 1 (administrivia) 1 1 This table shows the same data, but odered by number of actual postings (ie, ``wordq'' was counted as one package, but as three issues since it was posted in three parts). Here we see that games have moved up to third place, or 20% of the postings. Table of Submissions types by issues to date in comp.binaries.amiga: Type of Package Packages Issues util 13 37 unix 7 28 fun 4 25 applications 7 23 devices 3 6 audio 1 2 comm 1 2 kernel 2 2 workbench 1 1 fonts 1 1 midi 1 1 (administrivia) 1 1 Either way, we see that games are not the largest component of comp.binaries.amiga. Do you still think there are too many games posted there? > What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The fact > is, games are something by far not everybody likes. That would be no different than if I decided to not post stuff that I had no interest in, and would be akin to, dare I say it, censorship... > I'm sure there are more people who can use a MSH than Empire. > Another point is the size of some programs. Analyze for example or > uucp 1.3D are a bit too big to be posted. You haven't seen anything yet (for an example, look in c.s.misc right now, and you'll see a 32 part submission). Currently the limiting factor in postings in the amiga code groups is the size of the news spool on xanth (which is very small). > How about an inquiry before posting such a big package? People who > mind the posting could then send a simple yes or no to Tad. History has shown that voting for stuff on USENET is humorous at best... ...tad
tadguy@abcfd01.larc.nasa.gov (Tad Guy) (03/17/90)
In article <132974@sun.Eng.Sun.COM> cmcmanis@stpeter.Sun.COM (Chuck McManis) writes: > Keep the "rate" of binaries at some fixed limit of megabytes per > week. That way you will always know what the maximum space is to > reserve per week for the binaries and you can trim your archive once > a week. Scary. I have been meaning to do this with my posting scripts. This has several advantages: o *huge* submissions dribble into the newsgroup slowly over time, instead of one large mass that could overflow unprotected news spools... o the amount of traffic in c.{s|b}.a would be more consistant in volume o I usually approve several submissions at a time, but only post one or two a night (with exceptions). this would allow those approved-but-not-yet-posted submissions to actually be posted without my having to do it (meaning that in the long run more stuff gets out faster). I suspect that implemening this would actually increase the traffic in c.{s|b}.amiga in the long run (not what the original poster intended). This is a good suggestion, and I'll probably do it eventually... ...tad
doug@xdos.UUCP (Doug Merritt) (03/19/90)
In article <132974@sun.Eng.Sun.COM> cmcmanis@sun.UUCP (Chuck McManis) writes: >I presume you are complaining because you archive this stuff and are >running out of space. That isn't any excuse for cutting off the rest >the world now is it? Wholeheartedly agree. I archive, and often have space problems. But I regard it as *my* problem, not the net's. >Suggestion 1: Keep the "rate" of binaries at some fixed limit of >megabytes per week. That way you will always know what the maximum >space is to reserve per week for the binaries and you can trim your >archive once a week. And in fact Tad *does* limit the size/rate of binaries per week, as did Bob before him. So this suggestion is already implemented. Also note that 99% of the time when these criticisms occur (as they regularly do in *all* of the .binaries groups, among others), the original complainer does not offer any figures to substantiate "too big" or "too much". Typically if the flames go on for too long, somebody does a little legwork, and posts figures that demonstrate that the flaming has taken up e.g. 10 times as much network Kbyte traffic as the original stuff claimed subjectively to be "too big". >Note : comp.binaries.amiga are run for the benefit of the comp.sys.amiga* >readership and not for the archivists. If a policy decision has to be made >always hold in favor of the readership as they are your real customers. Right. Also note that the net is an anarchy, not a democracy (other than the nominally democratic new group creation process, which in fact tends to be as anarchistic as it is democratic; see comp.periphs.scsi). And moderated newsgroups are dictatorships. Thank god for that...if we had to vote on what got posted (as was previously suggested), we'd generate hundreds of megs of junk arguments, and would never reach agreement, and everyone would *still* bitch. Probably even more than now, in fact. Or even worse, we'd create what is aptly called "the tyranny of the majority". I.e. there's a lot to be said for a process which at times only benefits a small minority. Over a sufficient period of time, different minorities add up to equal everyone, a point which is almost universally overlooked in our nation's politics. Doug -- Doug Merritt {pyramid,apple}!xdos!doug Member, Crusaders for a Better Tomorrow Professional Wildeyed Visionary
deven@rpi.edu (Deven T. Corzine) (03/19/90)
On 16 Mar 90 17:09:29 GMT, tadguy@abcfd01.larc.nasa.gov (Tad Guy) said: Tad> o *huge* submissions dribble into the newsgroup slowly over Tad> time, instead of one large mass that could overflow Tad> unprotected news spools... A nice idea, but I've noticed that the "dribble" approach appears more prone to losing one or a few parts of a multipart posting. I don't know if there's a good reason for this or if it is simply a skewed observation, but it is a nuisance to have 9 of 10 parts -- usually no more useful than having none. *sigh* Deven -- Deven T. Corzine Internet: deven@rpi.edu, shadow@pawl.rpi.edu Snail: 2151 12th St. Apt. 4, Troy, NY 12180 Phone: (518) 274-0327 Bitnet: deven@rpitsmts, userfxb6@rpitsmts UUCP: uunet!rpi!deven Simple things should be simple and complex things should be possible.
tadguy@abcfd01.larc.nasa.gov (Tad Guy) (03/19/90)
In article <DEVEN.90Mar19075959@netserv2.rpi.edu> deven@rpi.edu (Deven T. Corzine) writes: > A nice idea, but I've noticed that the "dribble" approach appears more > prone to losing one or a few parts of a multipart posting. I would expect more lossage from a quick series of postings than a slow series since the quick one is likely to overflow disks somewhere. Fortunately, I haven't (yet) had trouble with either. (yeah, right). > I don't know if there's a good reason for this or if it is simply a > skewed observation, but it is a nuisance to have 9 of 10 parts -- > usually no more useful than having none. *sigh* Since it's all archived on xanth.cs.odu.edu, on a separate disk than news is kept on, sites missing few parts can find them by anonymous ftp or through bitftp... ...tad
jeff@cpoint.UUCP (Jeffrey J. Griglack) (03/19/90)
In article <02362.AA02362@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes: > >Basically I like the fact that lots of software are coming via >comp.binaries.amiga. However, it's a bit too much recently. Games, for >example. What do you think of the idea not to post any more games? The I think that the people who do not want to see games, or who think that too much is coming in can simply delete the stuff that they do not want. Are you one of the people where complaining a few months ago about the lack of postings. I for one am happy to see a little traffic on comp. binaries.amiga and on .sources.amiga. You might learn to be a little picky about what you decide to unpack and keep. Jeff -- ============================================================================= Now I quess I'll have to tell 'em, that I've got no cerebellum - The Ramones Jeff Griglack {decvax, cybbax0, mirror}!frog!cpoint!jeff =============================================================================