schur@venera.isi.edu (Sean Schur) (07/16/90)
I would appreciate it if someone at Commodore (or equally knowledgable) will address this issue. I have sent messages about this problem and have seen at least 4 others with the same problem. The problem is using a genlock with a 3000/1950 combination. I am having the problem with a Progen genlock, I have read inquiries here about the same problem with Supergen, Scanlock and Commodore's own 2300 (see below). With the genlock plugged into the 23 pin video out the 1950 is unviewable. This is true with the monitor plugged into either the throughput of the genlock (essentially plugging it into the 23 pin slot) or with the genlock still in the 23 pin slot and the monitor in the VGA out. The machine boots with the genlock plugged in put the monitor picture turns a dark grey and vertically flips VERY fast and is not fixable by monitor adjustments. However, in this situation the genlocked video output is fine and usable. Unfortunately for me my video system and it's monitor are across the room so it is not possible to operate the computer by watching that monitor. Now on the other hand, if I plug the genlock in AFTER booting (I know, very dangerous) the 1950 display looks mostly normal, it is readable although not completely stable it smears horizontally a bit. However at this point the genlock output is out of sync. It's picture is stable but the horizontal black bar which you shouldn't see from the top of the screen is somewhere other than where it is supposed to be, leaving the genlocked output off-center vertically. I can use the system this way because if I pause my video input (assuming I am using a VCR) I can get the bar to roll vertically and if I release the pause at just the right time I can get the bar off the top. But this is obviously a kludge at best. I did read the manual and am aware that you need to disable the VDE, so that isn't the problem. I can't vouch for people with other genlocks. But the messages I have read do describe very similar problems (see the message below about a 2300). I would appreciate it if someone could address this problem as it seems to be pretty common from what I can tell. ============================================================================== \ / \ \ / / Sean Schur \ \ / / \ \/ / USENET: schur@isi.edu \ /a\mpyr/ Compuserve: 70731,1102 \/ \ / ideo Plink: OSS259 \/ ============================================================================== In article <19027@well.sf.ca.us> sjm@well.sf.ca.us (Stephen Moehle) writes: >I have an A3000 with a 1950 monitor. I am using 2.0 (Kickstart version 36.141 >Workbench version 36.68). I also have a Commodore A2300 internal genlock >which I cannot get to work with the VDE. When I put the genlock in, the 1950 >cannot sync up to the signal coming out of the 3000. With the VDE on, the 1950 >looks like the vertical hold is off, but adjusting the vertical hold on the >monitor does not help. Turning the VDE off makes things worse. The monitor >does not display anything recognizable, but it looks just like what is coming >out of the 23 pin port. However, when I plug the monitor into the 23 pin >port on the genlock, the display is fine. Help! How can I get this to work? >Thanks. > >Stephe >sjm@well.sf.ca.us or {ucbvax,pacbell,hplabs}!well!sjm >"You heard the weirdo man. What is truth?"
seanc@pro-party.cts.com (Sean Cunningham) (07/17/90)
In-Reply-To: message from schur@venera.isi.edu I also had the same problem using a Communication Specialties, Inc. GEN/ONE (piece of crap!)... I also seem to remember the manual for the FlickerFixer stating that you need to turn your VGA/Multiscan moniter OFF while genlocking...so it appears to have the same problem, though I haven't tested it. What you may want to do, since most genlocks have an RGB pass-thru, connect this to a 1084, and use that while you're genlocking...but the problem does need to be addressed by C=, don't get me wrong. Sean //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// UUCP: ...!crash!pnet01!pro-party!seanc | ARPA: !crash!pnet01!pro-party!seanc@nosc.mil | " Fanatics have their INET: seanc@pro-party.cts.com | dreams, wherewith they | weave a paradise for RealWorld: Sean Cunningham | a sect. " Voice: (512) 994-1602 PLINK: ce3k* | -Keats | Call C.B.A.U.G. BBS (512) 883-8351 w/SkyPix | B^) VISION GRAPHICS B^) \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
hood@cbmvax.commodore.com (Scott Hood) (07/17/90)
In article <14298@venera.isi.edu> schur@venera.isi.edu (Sean Schur) writes: >I would appreciate it if someone at Commodore (or equally knowledgable) will >address this issue. I have sent messages about this problem and have seen at >least 4 others with the same problem. > >The problem is using a genlock with a 3000/1950 combination. I am having the >problem with a Progen genlock, I have read inquiries here about the same >problem with Supergen, Scanlock and Commodore's own 2300 (see below). > >With the genlock plugged into the 23 pin video out the 1950 is unviewable. This >is true with the monitor plugged into either the throughput of the genlock >(essentially plugging it into the 23 pin slot) or with the genlock still in the >23 pin slot and the monitor in the VGA out. The machine boots with the genlock >plugged in put the monitor picture turns a dark grey and vertically flips >VERY fast and is not fixable by monitor adjustments. However, in this situation >the genlocked video output is fine and usable. Unfortunately for me my video >system and it's monitor are across the room so it is not possible to operate >the computer by watching that monitor. Now on the other hand, if I plug the >genlock in AFTER booting (I know, very dangerous) the 1950 display looks >mostly normal, it is readable although not completely stable it smears >horizontally a bit. However at this point the genlock output is out of sync. >It's picture is stable but the horizontal black bar which you shouldn't see >from the top of the screen is somewhere other than where it is supposed to be, >leaving the genlocked output off-center vertically. I can use the system this >way because if I pause my video input (assuming I am using a VCR) I can get >the bar to roll vertically and if I release the pause at just the right time >I can get the bar off the top. But this is obviously a kludge at best. > >I did read the manual and am aware that you need to disable the VDE, so that >isn't the problem. > >I can't vouch for people with other genlocks. But the messages I have read >do describe very similar problems (see the message below about a 2300). >I would appreciate it if someone could address this problem as it seems to be >pretty common from what I can tell. > > >In article <19027@well.sf.ca.us> sjm@well.sf.ca.us (Stephen Moehle) writes: >>I have an A3000 with a 1950 monitor. I am using 2.0 (Kickstart version 36.141 >>Workbench version 36.68). I also have a Commodore A2300 internal genlock >>which I cannot get to work with the VDE. When I put the genlock in, the 1950 >>cannot sync up to the signal coming out of the 3000. With the VDE on, the 1950 >>looks like the vertical hold is off, but adjusting the vertical hold on the >>monitor does not help. Turning the VDE off makes things worse. The monitor >>does not display anything recognizable, but it looks just like what is coming >>out of the 23 pin port. However, when I plug the monitor into the 23 pin >>port on the genlock, the display is fine. Help! How can I get this to work? >>Thanks. >> >>Stephe >>sjm@well.sf.ca.us or {ucbvax,pacbell,hplabs}!well!sjm >>"You heard the weirdo man. What is truth?" I will try to answer some of the questions about the A3000 display enhancer and genlocks if I can. You can use the display enhancer's output from the DB15 connector (marked "31Khz") while using either an internal or external genlock if the display enhancer is enabled and the 1950 is connected to the DB15 connector. Some genlocks however do not provide the correct timing information to the Amiga and cause the display enhancer to have a bad day. In this case, the video output from the DB15 connector is not usable and the monitor should be connected to the video output provided by the genlock, NOT the 23-pin video port (marked "15Hkz"). Many genlocks do not work correctly if the user does not provide a stable video source to the genlock at ALL times i.e. the Amiga may not boot up correctly. Some genlocks will allow the Amiga to boot up correctly but without input video do not provide the Amiga and thus the display enhancer with the needed timing information. The A2300 genlock is an example of this. The A2300 genlock, as well as needing source video input at all times also needs a modification of adding a capacitor from ground to pin 6 of IC6 on the A2300. This is the Vsync reset signal from the genlock to the Amiga via the video slot. This modification can be performed by your local service center. (For PAL A2300 genlocks, an additional jumper needs to be added the genlock to generate the correct clock frequency of 28.375156Mhz.) In the case of using the 1950 with the A3000 and modified A2300 genlock the 1950 can be connected to the DB15 connector for flicker-free output of Amiga only graphics, to the A2300 genlock's 23-pin output using the supplied 23-pin to 15-pin adaptor for 15Khz output of overlayed RGB graphics or by making your own adaptor that connects the RGB signals and the Csync signal to the 1950 monitor (connect the csync signal to the 1950's hsync line (and don't connect the vsync input of the 1950 monitor to anything)) from the A3000's onboard 23-pin video port. If your genlock will not work correctly with the display enhancer output (see above and your manual) then you may still use your genlock as per the genlock's composite output. If you wish to connect the 1950 to your genlocks RGB output (pass-through or overlay RGB) then you need to make your own adaptor that connects the correct signals to the 1950 monitor (i.e. RGB, seperate Hs (or CS to Hs) and Vs)). With this setup, the 1950 will output the analog 15Khz RGB that your genlock generates. Remember that the display enhacer will only output Amiga only improved screen output and not an overlaid display. I hope that this answers your questions and if you have any more problems please email me and I will try to get them answered ASAP. Scott C your adaptor the connects the RGB signals and then connects the Csync to the 1950's Hsync line on the A3000's 23-pin video port.) C C D D D D D D D capicator (0.1uF) across the Vsync output ( vertical sync a -- -- Scott Hood, Hardware Design Engineer (A3000 Crew), Commodore-Amiga, Inc. {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!hood hood@cbmvax.cbm.commodore.com "The views expressed here are not necessarily those of my employer!"
pselver@ssi3b1.zone1.com (Peter Selverstone) (07/20/90)
In article <3569@crash.cts.com> seanc@pro-party.cts.com (Sean Cunningham) writes: >In-Reply-To: message from schur@venera.isi.edu >I also seem to remember the manual for the FlickerFixer stating that you need >to turn your VGA/Multiscan moniter OFF while genlocking...so it appears to >have the same problem, though I haven't tested it. A Genlock Compatibility Option is available for flickerFixer. List price is $50. With the option installed, the flickerFixer may be used at the same time as most external genlocks. It is compatible with the SuperGen, Amigen, Scanlock, Neriki and Omnigen. We are not able to provide compatibility with the ProGen or the GenOne. The flickerFixer display is solid with all these genlocks when they are providing internal sync with no external video source connected. When external sync is used, the display quality depends upon the design of the genlock and the nature of the sync signal but in all cases is adequate for monitoring purposes. Another way to get genlock compatibility is to use the recently introduced Denise Extender Board (DEB). This is a kit that allows the flickerFixer to be installed in a 2000 or 2500 without using the video slot. It permits simultaneous use of the flickerFixer and most internal genlocking devices. It is compatible with the SuperGen 2000S and the Commodore 2300. NewTek reports no problems using it with the Video Toaster. A flickerFixer which is installed using the DEB is also compatible with all the above-mentioned external genlocks. The Genlock Compatibility Option is not required when the DEB is used, but there is no need to remove the option if it is installed. The DEB consists of a piggyback board for the Denise chip, a connector board which attaches to the motherboard in line with the outermost PC slot, a cable which connects the two boards and a cable assembly which brings the flickerFixer output to the rear panel. The flickerFixer plugs into the connector board and no soldering or modifications to the motherboard are required. In general, if you are using a bridgeboard, you will lose one PC slot; however, some very short boards may fit. The list price of the DEB kit is $75 and the flickerFixer/DEB setup is FCC class B approved. The list price on the flickerFixer has been reduced recently to $495. Real-world pricing will, of course vary. For the adventurous, the Denise piggyback board of the DEB kit will fit in an Amiga 500. The connector board and flickerFixer can be put in a separate box or possibly squeezed into the 500's case. This is not a supported application, but it works fine and does not require any soldering to the motherboard. The DEB does not fit in the 1000 easily, but the Rejuvinator board Designed by Greg Tibbs and manufactured by Expert Services provides similar functionality. -- Peter Selverstone ...{mit-eddie,pyramid,datacube}!mirror!ssi3b1!pselver Spy Pond Systems pselver@ssi3b1.zone1.com Arlington, MA BIX:pselverstone PLINK:pselverst CIS:72527,2652
hclausen@adspdk.CBMNET (Henrik Clausen) (07/21/90)
>In article <1990Jul19.183813.14623@ssi3b1.zone1.com> pselver@ssi3b1.zone1.com (Peter Selverstone) writes: >A Genlock Compatibility Option is available for flickerFixer. Is it possible to FlickerFix the output of a Genlock? We have a project (about New Stereology), where the output of the Genlock will be watched closely for hours in a row, and we really want it totally flickerfree. -Henrik -- | Henrik Clausen, Graffiti Data (Fido: 2:230/22.33) | | ...{pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!cbmehq!adspdk!hclausen | \_______________AmigaDOS: Amiga's Divine Operating System________________/