[comp.sys.amiga] When and when not to use BRU for backups

wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) (08/16/90)

After making a full backup using bru I found that it's not that good as I
first thought - at least for me. 
On my harddisk, every binary file bigger than 10K is crunched, giving me
about twice as much room for binary files than without crunching anything.
If you compress crunched files, inclulding archives made with zip or lharc,
they get bigger than before. Example: I have a lzh file with 850K. If I
compress it using BRU's Huffman encoding with 16 bits, it takes me
afterwards over 1000K. BRU doesn't check if the compressed file is larger
than the original and stores only the compressed version. With this
unlogical behaviour of BRU, I gain nearly no disks compared to Quarterback,
and the latter is nearly twice as fast. So - if you have lots of crunched
files, archives, pictures, anims and so on on your harddisk, don't use BRU.
It doesn't pay off. Stick with Quarterback.


--
------------------------------------
Chris Brand - wizard@sosaria.imp.com
"Justice is the possession and doing 
of what one is entitled to" - Platon
------------------------------------

bobl@pro-graphics.cts.com (Bob Lindabury) (08/18/90)

In-Reply-To: message from wizard@sosaria.imp.com

> afterwards over 1000K. BRU doesn't check if the compressed file is larger
> than the original and stores only the compressed version. With this
> unlogical behaviour of BRU, I gain nearly no disks compared to Quarterback,
> and the latter is nearly twice as fast. So - if you have lots of crunched
> files, archives, pictures, anims and so on on your harddisk, don't use BRU.
> It doesn't pay off. Stick with Quarterback.

Doesn't it make more sense just to turn OFF the compression in BRU?  Seems to
me that BRU has some features that Quarterback doesn't (SCSI Tape Support) and
it does have a Shell written for it called "BRUShell" that has a point and
click interface.

-- Bob
>From pro-graphics!bobl Fri Aug 17 20:05:27 1990 
Date: Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:05:02 EDT
Ppath: pro-exchange!pro-sol!pro-lep!syslep
From: bobl@pro-graphics.cts.com (Bob Lindabury)
Message-Id: <331.proline/net@pro-graphics>
To: syslep@pro-lep
Subject: Re: Quarterly Posting [of modification listing]

In-Reply-To: message from syslep@pro-lep.cts.com

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

Jezz..I was getting very depressed about this listing and the hours I spend
verifying modifications, repacking them into easy unparable files and even
writing manuals for some of them and then shrinking them (and soon to BINSCII
them) not to mention keeping track of revisions and the database.

Seems just a few vocal people with "Don't do this" attitudes prevail in most
cases.  I have received a few responses in favor of the quarterly "full"
listing and that has helped.  I was about this " " close to just discontinuing
the proline mods archives and saying the heck with it.  Your support has made
me feel a bit better.  Be prepared for a lengthy rebuttal from Rich (Self
Appointed Net Traffic Watcher) soon.  <grin>

-- Bob

PS: The transfer time came in at 3 minutes over AT&T.  Reachout America clocks
in at $6.70 per hour and the cost per message is $.33.  That's $1.32 for the
whole year.  I think the Modification Listing and Archives are worth $1.32 per
year..don't you?  And Morgan (who seems to be on the "other" side has
requested items from the archives himself...and it was just after I posted the
listing...hmmm.

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fnf@riscokid.UUCP (Fred Fish) (08/22/90)

In article <03880.AA03880@sosaria.imp.com> wizard@sosaria.imp.com (Chris Brand) writes:
>On my harddisk, every binary file bigger than 10K is crunched, giving me
>about twice as much room for binary files than without crunching anything.
>If you compress crunched files, inclulding archives made with zip or lharc,
>they get bigger than before. Example: I have a lzh file with 850K. If I
>compress it using BRU's Huffman encoding with 16 bits, it takes me
>afterwards over 1000K.

BRU does not use Huffman, it uses the standard LZW compression algorithm,
defaulting to 12 bits, but able to use up to 16 bits if you request it with
the -N flag.  You are correct in that most compressed files will get
bigger when compressed again.

>BRU doesn't check if the compressed file is larger
>than the original and stores only the compressed version. With this
>unlogical behaviour of BRU, I gain nearly no disks compared to Quarterback,

This is incorrect.  BRU checks that the final compressed version is no
larger than the original, and saves either the compressed version or the
original as appropriate.  When run with -vvvv it will report which files
are saved uncompressed.

The "growth factor" you are seeing is the BRU archive overhead.  A summary
of this overhead is:

	1)	12.5% for the block headers on each 2K archive block.
		The block header is 256 bytes, and contains lots of
		information bru uses to keep track of each archive
		block.

	2)	Each archived file requires one 2k file header block
		and then an arbitrary number of data blocks, each 2k.
		Thus a zero length file consumes 2k of archive space.
		A 1 byte file consumes 4k (2k header + 1 data block).

	3)	The archive has a 2k archive header block and a 2k archive
		trailer block.

Thus approximately 1000K of archive space to store a 850K file sounds
about right.  The overhead takes an even bigger bite for groups of
small files, because of the file header block.

The archive format was designed for robustness and expandability, with
compactness only a secondary concern.  In retrospect, it would probably
have been better to pay more attention to space considerations and make
the archive format a pure stream format with blocking done by the I/O
routines.  Maybe in BRU II ...

-Fred