hjj@athena.mit.edu (Hector Jimenez-Gonzalez) (11/02/90)
I am looking for a SAFE memory defragmentation utility for my hard drive. Is there an equivalent of the Norton Speed Utilities for the Amiga? I have seen programs that report memory fragmentation but none that actually fix it. Thanks, Hector Jimenez hjj@athena.mit.edu
mcc@moscom.UUCP (Mike Corbett) (11/14/90)
In article <1990Nov1.195107.26149@athena.mit.edu> hjj@athena.mit.edu (Hector Jimenez-Gonzalez) writes: > > I am looking for a SAFE memory defragmentation utility for my hard drive. >Is there an equivalent of the Norton Speed Utilities for the Amiga? >I have seen programs that report memory fragmentation but none that actually >fix it. I have recently received my copy of Quarterback Tools v1.2a from Central Coast Software and have run it on my 2 meg A1000 with the Sprit Technology HDA-506 interface. My hard drive is a 20meg Tandon 3 1/2" ST-506 MFM with ~65ms avg. seek time. I wish I could say that it works great. It works ok on my setup, but there is a problem. My hard drive has a (semi) badspot. When I run the low-level format it formats and verifies fine. It will even hi-level format ok right after a low-level. The problem is that within 1/2 hour of a low-level format that one spot will show up as bad. This means that the badspot is not recorded in the low-level. When I run the defragment utility it first scans the drive, checking the file system. When the file system checks out ok it then proceeds to defragment the disk. If it finds an unreadable sopt on the disk it tells you to run the badspot marking utility. However, the way they mark badspots is to just put a "badspot" file over the bad area. This is not adequate. When the defragment program scans the drive it sees the "badspot" file out there and refuses to proceed. At this point I have two options. I can leave my drive fragmented, but this defeats the purpose of _buying_ the package, or I can redo the low-level format, writing the badspot into the low-level. No I can't. The low-level formatting software from Spirit doesn't let me enter known badspots. My only solution (for now) is to redo the low-level format, redo the hi-level format, restore from the full system backup that I did just before I started all this, then (quickly) run the defragment program. _Whew!_ After all this, yes, I found things would load _much_ more quickly than before. No, this is not just because of the reformat, restore cycle (I have tried that before). I estimate at least a threefold improvement in opening windows, loading programs, etc.. I then ran the defragment utility on my A2000 with a Pioneer(?) SCSI interface and 40meg hd. It ran flawlessly. Now a short description of how it is used. When you first enter QB Tools you are presented with a list of available hd partitions. Click on one and you now move to the main menu. From here you can ask for technical info for that device, go to the defrag. menu, examine the partition for badspots, or other things I can't remember right now. (I am at work, after all ;-)) Within the defrag. menu you can get a report on disk fragmentation, (something else) or go ahead and start the defrag. process. Beware, if the defrag. process fails, you could loose everything on that partition, so make a backup! If it doesn't fail it _will_ take quite some time to complete. My 20meg partition took about 30 minutes using the fast option. After talking with the people at CCS I have found that my problem is caused by the combination of my ST-506 drive and the fact that the defrag. tool discards the bitmap and executes depending directly upon what it finds when it scans the disk. I was told they did it this way upon recommendation by Commodore. I am not _totally_ sure what this means, but I do know this is not how programs like Norton Speed Disk and PC Tools disk reorganize work on the (ack!) IBM. I know that this is not a complete review, but I have only had it for a few days. Anyways, I hope this helps! Mike -- /// /// "Only Amiga Makes It Possible!" moscom!mcc \\\ /// \XXX/ "On the other hand, you have different fingers..." Steven Wright
bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu (11/15/90)
In article <2375@moscom.UUCP> mcc@moscom.UUCP (Mike Corbett) writes: > >I have recently received my copy of Quarterback Tools v1.2a from Central Coast >Software and have run it on my 2 meg A1000 with the Sprit Technology HDA-506 >doesn't fail it _will_ take quite some time to complete. My 20meg partition >took about 30 minutes using the fast option. You're kidding, right? I have an H-P '286 machine at work with an 80 Meg hard drive, and using PC Tools, it takes no more than 10 minutes to optimize the whole thing (if I don't have it clear the empty blocks). In fact, it's so fast that I routinely run it once or twice a day while I stretch or walk around the room. (Yes, I know that running it often makes less work for the program and therefore makes it run faster, but it was still quick the first time I ran it.) -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sam Hill Cabal "If there's anything insidious going bwdavies@sunrise.bitnet on in the world, the media is behind bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu it!" -T.J. Teru
mcc@moscom.UUCP (Mike Corbett) (11/22/90)
In article <1990Nov14.214230.1087@rodan.acs.syr.edu> bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu writes: >In article <2375@moscom.UUCP> mcc@moscom.UUCP I write: >> >>I have recently received my copy of Quarterback Tools v1.2a from Central Coast >>Software and have run it on my 2 meg A1000 with the Sprit Technology HDA-506 >>doesn't fail it _will_ take quite some time to complete. My 20meg partition >>took about 30 minutes using the fast option. > >You're kidding, right? I have an H-P '286 machine at work with an 80 Meg >hard drive, and using PC Tools, it takes no more than 10 minutes to >optimize the whole thing (if I don't have it clear the empty blocks). > No, I'm not kidding. In all fairness my HD is a slow one (~60ms). When defrag is run on a 20meg SCSI HD it only took about 10 minutes. It is worth mentioning that the Amiga uses a substantially different file system than the IBM types do. That fact _may_ be a significant factor in the time it takes to do the defragmentation. Also the products on those (yech) machines have been around and are quite mature. This is the first attempt by Central Coast Software at this type of tool. Quarterback Tools shows the same teething pains that Norton and PCTools went through when they were new. CCS has shown that they are a good company, dedicated to supporting the Amiga and that given the chance they will fix the problems. Their upgrade policies have always been reasonable. I do plan to stay with Quarterback as my backup program and QBTools as my main disk fix-it utility. Mike -- /// /// "Only Amiga Makes It Possible!" moscom!mcc \\\ /// \XXX/ "On the other hand, you have different fingers..." Steven Wright
hamilton@intersil.uucp (11/23/90)
>In article 1990Nov14.214230.1087@rodan.acs.syr.edu bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu writes: >>In article <2375@moscom.UUCP> mcc@moscom.UUCP wrote: >>> >>>I have recently received my copy of Quarterback Tools v1.2a from Central Coas t >>>Software and have run it on my 2 meg A1000 with the Sprit Technology HDA-506 >>>doesn't fail it _will_ take quite some time to complete. My 20meg partition >>>took about 30 minutes using the fast option. >> >>You're kidding, right? I have an H-P '286 machine at work with an 80 Meg >>hard drive, and using PC Tools, it takes no more than 10 minutes to >>optimize the whole thing (if I don't have it clear the empty blocks). You're confusing de-fragmenting and re-organizing. PC Tools has a number of "ordering/sorting" options. The base mode is simply de-fragment, in which it basically re-writes any non-contiguous files in consecutive blocks, for faster loading. This mode does nothing else. Now, some of the other options will make it sort the harddisk and put all the files in order, all files in each subdirectory grouped together, etc. This is the sort-of serious re-organization (not just de-fragmentation) that QB tools does. On my 40M 286 system at work, PC tools will take hours re-organizing a perfectly organized, de-fragmented harddisk if I just add a 12 byte file named "AARDVARK", since it will now move every single block over by 1 (maybe 2?) blocks so it can put AARDVARK at the top. Similarly, if I only add a file named "ZEBRA", the re-organization is over in seconds. Bottom line: PC Tools' and Quarterback's _re-organization_ (optimizing) times are probably comparable. Here are the significant differences that I see: Quarterback will use all the ram I have available as a buffer, speeding the process and reducing hd thrashing. On my 10meg the extra 8 megs of buffer memory gives QuarterBack the edge on speed. Quarterback also seems to have a more intelligent/efficient algorythmn for re-organizing. PC Tools is more "robust"-you can stop the program while it's running and your harddisk will be intact. If there is a power interruption, there is a very good chance that nothing on your hard drive will be lost. QB tools needs to add this feature-it's not hard, but it slows things down a little. PC Tools also gives you more control over what exactly you want to do to your harddisk, although the usefulness of some of the options is questionable. It would also be nice if QB tools added a "block clear" feature also. -- Fred Hamilton Any views, comments, or ideas expressed here Harris Semiconductor are entirely my own. Even good ones. Santa Clara, CA $
bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu (11/24/90)
In article <187.274c09c6@intersil.uucp> hamilton@intersil.uucp writes: >>In article 1990Nov14.214230.1087@rodan.acs.syr.edu bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu writes: >>>In article <2375@moscom.UUCP> mcc@moscom.UUCP wrote: >>>> >>>>I have recently received my copy of Quarterback Tools v1.2a from Central Coas >t >>>>Software and have run it on my 2 meg A1000 with the Sprit Technology HDA-506 >>>>doesn't fail it _will_ take quite some time to complete. My 20meg partition >>>>took about 30 minutes using the fast option. >>> >>>You're kidding, right? I have an H-P '286 machine at work with an 80 Meg >>>hard drive, and using PC Tools, it takes no more than 10 minutes to >>>optimize the whole thing (if I don't have it clear the empty blocks). > >You're confusing de-fragmenting and re-organizing. > No, I'm not. >PC Tools has a number of "ordering/sorting" options. The base mode is simply >de-fragment, in which it basically re-writes any non-contiguous files in >consecutive blocks, for faster loading. This mode does nothing else. > >Now, some of the other options will make it sort the harddisk and put all >the files in order, all files in each subdirectory grouped together, etc. >This is the sort-of serious re-organization (not just de-fragmentation) >that QB tools does. On my 40M 286 system at work, PC tools will take hours >re-organizing a perfectly organized, de-fragmented harddisk if I just add a >12 byte file named "AARDVARK", since it will now move every single block over >by 1 (maybe 2?) blocks so it can put AARDVARK at the top. Similarly, if I only >add a file named "ZEBRA", the re-organization is over in seconds. > My machine at work is set up to alphabetize all files and sub-directories, too. I regularly add and change files beginning with all sorts of letters. It still only takes a few minutes. >Bottom line: PC Tools' and Quarterback's _re-organization_ (optimizing) times >are probably comparable. Here are the significant differences that I see: > >Quarterback will use all the ram I have available as a buffer, speeding >the process and reducing hd thrashing. On my 10meg the extra >8 megs of buffer memory gives QuarterBack the edge on speed. Quarterback >also seems to have a more intelligent/efficient algorythmn for re-organizing. > >PC Tools is more "robust"-you can stop the program while it's running and >your harddisk will be intact. If there is a power interruption, there is >a very good chance that nothing on your hard drive will be lost. QB tools >needs to add this feature-it's not hard, but it slows things down a little. >PC Tools also gives you more control over what exactly you want to do to your >harddisk, although the usefulness of some of the options is questionable. >It would also be nice if QB tools added a "block clear" feature also. Using the'block clear' function on PC Tools _does_ add to the time it takes to optimize the disk. Using this option, it does take thirty plus minutes to finish. Is this the way you have your machine set up? I'm glad that there is a program like this for the Amiga, I will most likely be buying one in the next six months (maybe waiting for an'040 option or the A3000UX), and I would consider a disk optimizer necessary equipment. -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sam Hill Cabal "If there's anything insidious going bwdavies@sunrise.bitnet on in the world, the media is behind bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu it!" -T.J. Teru
hamilton@intersil.uucp (11/24/90)
In article <1990Nov23.192455.8811@rodan.acs.syr.edu>, bwdavies@rodan.acs.syr.edu writes: > In article <187.274c09c6@intersil.uucp> hamilton@intersil.uucp writes: >> >>You're confusing de-fragmenting and re-organizing. > > No, I'm not. > > My machine at work is set up to alphabetize all files and sub-directories, too. > > I regularly add and change files beginning with all sorts of letters. It > still only takes a few minutes. > > Using the'block clear' function on PC Tools _does_ add to the time it takes > to optimize the disk. Using this option, it does take thirty plus minutes > to finish. Is this the way you have your machine set up? On PC Tools there are options for sorting (I think they are in a menu on the left hand side), and there are options for organization (or something similar), on the far-right-hand menu. I believe you are using the _first_ choice in that right-hand menu, which I think is called "standard" (forgive me for all these guesses, the program's at work). There are two menu items below the first choice. If you select the second item ("DOS?"), then PC Tools re-arranges your hard disk in order according to the sorting parameters you picked on the left- hand menu list. This takes A LONG TIME. If you select the top menu item, PC Tools is very fast, but it does not sort ANYTHING, it only de-fragments. If it takes a long time for you when you select the clear blocks option, then my guess is your hard-disk is not that full. This will obviously also speed up re-organization. I've spent a decent amount of time looking at/playing with QB Tools, BAD, and PC Tools, and I have a good idea of what's going. Play with the options on that right-hand menu and I think you'll see what I'm talking about. Oh, one other thing. Before Quarterback will organize a disk, it reads every sector of the disk to make sure there are no hard or soft errors on the disk. This does take some time, but it allows you to fix problems _before_ you start re-organizing. Both PC tools and Norton's on the PC will spend 1/2 hour re-organizing, then come across an error and just bail out. -- Fred Hamilton Any views, comments, or ideas expressed here Harris Semiconductor are entirely my own. Even good ones. Santa Clara, CA