C503719@UMCVMB.MISSOURI.EDU (Baird McIntosh) (01/04/91)
[Did your kill-file catch this? I hope so.]
This post is directed at Marc Barrett but may apply to others reading this
group. If not, don't worry; I've kept it quite short. Here we go:
Do most of us actually *use* the Amiga, or do we just sit around thinking
of ways that the Amiga fails to satisfy our needs? I mean, if this machine
sucks so bad, Marc et al, why use it? And if you *aren't* using the Amiga,
and *are* merely complaining about its shortcomings, couldn't you restrict
your opinions to those times when you 'shoot the sheet' with your fellows?
I read this group (some of it, anyway) to learn new uses of the Amiga, to get
tips from the pros and the average guy, and to get more out of my computer.
Like most sane people, I realize that life is too short for us to re-hash the
same old criticisms. Marc's posts only make me care less about Commodore.
Thank you for your time.
| Baird McIntosh | c503719@umcvmb.missouri.edu <-or-> c503719@umcvmb.bitnet |cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) (01/07/91)
Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's future, and is providing constructive criticism on ways that they could improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are some valid points in them. -- [] Chris Klausmeier -- cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP [][][][][][][] [] Alt.sex, talk.politics.drugs, and alt.rock-n-roll! []
ckp@grebyn.com (Checkpoint Technologies) (01/08/91)
In article <179@mixcom.UUCP> cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: >improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are >some valid points in them. It is precisely because his points are caustic that people flame him. I agree with many of his points myself. -- First comes the logo: C H E C K P O I N T T E C H N O L O G I E S / / \\ / / Then, the disclaimer: All expressed opinions are, indeed, opinions. \ / o Now for the witty part: I'm pink, therefore, I'm spam! \/
tron1@tronsbox.xei.com (Kenneth Jamieson) (01/08/91)
In article <179@mixcom.UUCP> cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: > >Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame >fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's >future, and is providing constructive criticism on ways that they could >improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are >some valid points in them. > >-- >[] Chris Klausmeier -- cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP [][][][][][][] >[] Alt.sex, talk.politics.drugs, and alt.rock-n-roll! [] Well, Marc has a few things going against him... 1) He has quite a few good points. 2) because of (1) people want to try and shut him up. 3) His posts are VERY caustic. But I suspect that in general he doesn't have a real "way with people" and that this isnt really a USENET thing. 4) He hasn't figures (2) and (3) out yet. Basically, people don't like his posts because he brings up good points about the shortcommings of OFM (our favorite machine). The response is to flame him, remember, usenet is not supposed to be a place to actually improve a computer, just a recruiting ground to get more poeple. At the end of the world, the computer with the most devoted users is declared the winner in the afterlife and ALL the major software houses will write only for it. That is what heaven really is. -- ========[ Xanadu Enterprises Inc. Amiga & Unix Software Development]======= = "I hate you, take your things and get out of this house!!!!!" = = (pause) - "Hold me!" ( same girl, elapsed time 6.5 seconds) = =========== Ken Jamieson: uunet!tronsbox.xei.com!tron1 =================== = NONE of the opinions represented here are endorsed by anybody. = === The Romantic Encounters BBS 201-759-8450(PEP) / 201-759-8568(2400) ====
dac@prolix.ccadfa.oz.au (Andrew Clayton) (01/08/91)
In article <179@mixcom.UUCP>, Chris Klausmeier writes: > Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame !*Sigh*!
bruce@zuhause.MN.ORG (Bruce Albrecht) (01/09/91)
>In article <179@mixcom.UUCP> cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: > >Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame >fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's >future, and is providing constructive criticism on ways that they could >improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are >some valid points in them. If Marc understood more about hardware, software, and Commodore's marketing goals, he'd be able to provide constructive criticism. Since he doesn't, what we get are periodic postings from him complaining that, in some ways, the Amiga is no longer better than the IBM PC clones. I'm fairly sure that Commodore has its reasons for working on the projects that their current projects, and no amount of posting from him will change Commodore's priorities. -- bruce@zuhause.mn.org
nsw@cbnewsm.att.com (Neil Weinstock) (01/10/91)
In article <179@mixcom.UUCP>, cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: > > Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame > fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's > future, and is providing constructive criticism on ways that they could > improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are > some valid points in them. You have an interesting notion of "constructive criticism". MB's postings are: 1) filled with misinformation. He has demonstrated over and over that he doesn't understand (or care) about real-world product development and corporate structure. 2) extremely presumptuous. Every MB posting can be boiled down to "*I* know exactly what's best for Commodore. All my predictions have come true. Because Commodore doesn't do everything *I* say, they're going to hell in a handbasket." Ad nauseum. Sheesh. 3) intentionally inflammatory. No explanation needed here. Basically, MB is the anti-Carnegie, and provides a vivid example of how *not* to win friends and influence people. The existence of good points in his postings is almost irrelevant. God, this is fun! Where's comp.sys.amiga.advocacy already? - Neil --==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==--==-- Neil Weinstock @ AT&T Bell Labs // What was sliced bread att!edsel!nsw or nsw@edsel.att.com \X/ the greatest thing since?
glmwc@marlin.jcu.edu.au (Matt Crowd) (01/12/91)
In article <bruce.6976@zuhause.MN.ORG> bruce@zuhause.MN.ORG (Bruce Albrecht) writes: >>In article <179@mixcom.UUCP> cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: >> >>Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame >>fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's > >If Marc understood more about hardware, software, and Commodore's marketing >goals, he'd be able to provide constructive criticism. Since he doesn't, what > >bruce@zuhause.mn.org What marketing goals ?? Matt Crowd.
limonce@pilot.njin.net (Tom Limoncelli) (01/12/91)
In article <601@tronsbox.xei.com> tron1@tronsbox.xei.com (Kenneth Jamieson) writes: > In article <179@mixcom.UUCP> cyaa01@mixcom.UUCP (Chris Klausmeier) writes: > > > >Why does everyone flame Marc Barrett? I've seen a few of these flame > >fests, and don't understand. It seems that he is concerned about Amiga's > >future, and is providing constructive criticism on ways that they could > >improve. Sure some of his posts might seem a bit caustic, but there are > >some valid points in them. > > Well, Marc has a few things going against him... > > 1) He has quite a few good points. > 2) because of (1) people want to try and shut him up. > 3) His posts are VERY caustic. But I suspect that in general > he doesn't have a real "way with people" and that this > isnt really a USENET thing. > 4) He hasn't figures (2) and (3) out yet. 5) The Amiga is a very complex machine and he isn't technical enough to understand what he's talking about. Luckily there are tons of net.idiots that are willing to listen to him. They tend to know less than him. I'm in MB and tron1's kill files. So I don't have to worry about them discovering this evil truth. Let's all agree to keep it a secret from them, huh? (giggle) > ========[ Xanadu Enterprises Inc. Amiga & Unix Software Development]======= > = "I hate you, take your things and get out of this house!!!!!" = > = (pause) - "Hold me!" ( same girl, elapsed time 6.5 seconds) = Make that, "somewhat sexist net.idiots". Tom -- tlimonce@drew.edu Tom Limoncelli "Flash! Flash! I love you! tlimonce@drew.bitnet +1 201 408 5389 ...but we only have fourteen tlimonce@drew.uucp limonce@pilot.njin.net hours to save the earth!"
tron1@tronsbox.xei.com (Kenneth Jamieson) (01/13/91)
In article <Jan.12.01.19.51.1991.16265@pilot.njin.net> limonce@pilot.njin.net (Tom Limoncelli) writes: > 5) The Amiga is a very complex machine and he isn't technical > enough to understand what he's talking about. Luckily > there are tons of net.idiots that are willing to listen to > him. They tend to know less than him. > Yeah Tom, it really takes a technical wizard to tell the world that the Amiga display hardware is falling behind. Actually, I have never seen Marc make a FACTUAL statement that was not correct. I mena, hay , I am not saying the guy is a rocket scientist, but this is the second flame that hinged on his lack of technical savvy. The truth is that he is correct on a large number of things. He doesnt have a frim grip on some of the monitary constraints that C= is working under but thats about it. So, since you are a tech wizard (not to mention a net.god and so on) .. go ahead, give me the TECHNICAL reasons for all the problems MB points out instead of just flaming him. >I'm in MB and tron1's kill files. So I don't have to worry about them >discovering this evil truth. Let's all agree to keep it a secret from >them, huh? (giggle) > >> ========[ Xanadu Enterprises Inc. Amiga & Unix Software Development]======= >> = "I hate you, take your things and get out of this house!!!!!" = >> = (pause) - "Hold me!" ( same girl, elapsed time 6.5 seconds) = > >Make that, "somewhat sexist net.idiots". > >Tom >-- >tlimonce@drew.edu Tom Limoncelli "Flash! Flash! I love you! >tlimonce@drew.bitnet +1 201 408 5389 ...but we only have fourteen >tlimonce@drew.uucp limonce@pilot.njin.net hours to save the earth!" -- ========[ Xanadu Enterprises Inc. Amiga & Unix Software Development]======= = "I hate you, take your things and get out of this house!!!!!" = = (pause) - "Hold me!" ( same girl, elapsed time 6.5 seconds) = =========== Ken Jamieson: uunet!tronsbox.xei.com!tron1 =================== = NONE of the opinions represented here are endorsed by anybody. = === The Romantic Encounters BBS 201-759-8450(PEP) / 201-759-8568(2400) ====
rjc@wookumz.ai.mit.edu (Ray Cromwell) (01/13/91)
In article <642@tronsbox.xei.com> tron1@tronsbox.xei.com (Kenneth Jamieson) writes: >In article <Jan.12.01.19.51.1991.16265@pilot.njin.net> limonce@pilot.njin.net (Tom Limoncelli) writes: >> 5) The Amiga is a very complex machine and he isn't technical >> enough to understand what he's talking about. Luckily >> there are tons of net.idiots that are willing to listen to >> him. They tend to know less than him. >> > > Yeah Tom, it really takes a technical wizard to tell the world >that the Amiga display hardware is falling behind. > > Actually, I have never seen Marc make a FACTUAL statement that >was not correct. I mena, hay , I am not saying the guy is a rocket >scientist, but this is the second flame that hinged on his lack of >technical savvy. > > The truth is that he is correct on a large number of things. >He doesnt have a frim grip on some of the monitary constraints that C= >is working under but thats about it. > > So, since you are a tech wizard (not to mention a net.god and >so on) .. go ahead, give me the TECHNICAL reasons for all the problems >MB points out instead of just flaming him. Everytime Marc talks about R&D, Custom chips and hardware he gets it wrong. His 'Commodore R&D is falling behind' post was majorly flawed. He makes outrageous claims such as the Atari Lynx having a CMOS version of the Amiga custom chips, The UNIX market and what every consumer wants, what Commodore management is thinking. He even said Copperman was head of R&D, which was false. Paraphased below: 'Under Copperman, Commodore spent more on R&D. Now Commodore will spend less on R&D. Savor these times, the Amiga is at its peak, its all downhill from here.. Blah, Blah,Blah, Drivel, Drivel, Drivel.' Lets psychologically examine Marc's posts. Marc always posts when a new computer news story hits. Why? Because he overreacts to advertising and marketing totally, then he uses what limitied information he gained from the news release to post a message to c.s.a. predicting the downfall of Amiga. Examples are: Apple releases new Macs. NeXT Releases NeXTStation. Commodore releases A3000. The A3000UX is announced. IBM/Apple introduce some new video card (and Marc calls for 24 bit gfx etc making outrageous claims how said IBM card animates 24bit images,etc.) Copperman changes position. HAM-E/DCTV Announced. Marc's arguements aren't totally wrong, but the information he uses to back them up are complete misinformation. Marc often makes statements like 'It should be easy to transfer the Custom chips to CMOS, and add 24 bit gfx.' This is why he needs a technical background because he obviously doesn't understand circuit design. Marc's solution to all problems are to pump money into them. This isn't the answer. We could pump $100 billion into R&D to develop interstellar travel and come out empty. Because it isn't economically or technically feasible at this stage. To compound problems, Commodore doesn't have the HUGE profit margins IBM, Apple, AT&T,etc have. They are almost a non-profit company. Finally, Marc keeps rehashing the same threads every month, and now he posts them to the wrong group. People try to put Marc in their kill files and he just changes acconts. If Marc dislikes his Amiga so much, SELL IT and buy a Mac or whatever other trashputer he can afford. Frankly, I'm tired of his whining, I can patiently wait for Commodore to improve itself without going bankrupt or dropping its stock prices through the floor.