bright@Data-IO.COM (Walter Bright) (05/07/88)
My beef about MSC51 setup is that it crashes my IBM AT. That's right, merely type SETUP and then you have to go for the Big Red Switch. It turns out that the problem is that SETUP won't work with the Quadram EGA. I run lots of ega text and graphics programs on my EGA, and the only ones that have failed are Codeview (unless you use the -p switch) and SETUP. Why does a simple file-copying program require register-level EGA compatibility? I wonder how this will sell in the Japanese market, where the machines are not even BIOS compatible. Interestingly, OS/2 does work with my crusty old QuadEGA+. I guess my main beef is trying to figure out how to create the combined libraries without SETUP. The manual should contain instructions for doing a by-hand installation. MOPAR rules.
is813cs@pyr.gatech.EDU (Cris Simpson) (05/28/88)
In article <33336@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com> tat00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com (Tom Thackrey) writes: >My own frustration with distribution disks are these brain-dead setup >programs which 1) don't tell you what they're doing, 2) do non-obvious >things, like modify config.sys, 3) force you to completely re-install >the product to change the configuration, and 4) aren't as smart enough >to replace the previous version of their product without leaving a lot >of unused files around. >I realize that the vendors are trying to make their products installable >by neophytes, but, I'd rather deal with a complex procedure than a setup >program where I can't see what is going on inside. For a pleasant contrast, consider the SETUP program for BRIEF, the Basic Reconfigurable Interactive Editing Facility (My vote for best programmer's editor ever!). You can run setup anytime and just change what you want. If what you change requires changes to config.sys or autoexec.bat, it prompts you to decide what to do: Update the file, Show the changes, Write to another file, or abort the changes. It even asks you what to do with the respective .bak files! I wish more SW publishers would use setup programs like this. But then, I wish more SW publishers turned out SW like BRIEF. Cris -- ||...despair! Despair I can handle, it's the hope... J.Cleese,Clockwise || Cris Simpson is813cs@pyr.gatech.edu GA Tech Atlanta,GA ...!{akgua,allegra,amd,hplabs,ihnp4,seismo,ut-ngp}!gatech!gitpyr!is813cs
james@bigtex.uucp (James Van Artsdalen) (05/30/88)
IN article <5854@pyr.gatech.EDU>, is813cs@pyr.UUCP (Cris Simpson) wrote: [ extolling the virtues of the Brief setup program ] > You can run setup anytime and just change what you want. > If what you change requires changes to config.sys or autoexec.bat, > it prompts you to decide what to do: Update the file, Show the changes, > Write to another file, or abort the changes. It even asks you what > to do with the respective .bak files! The thing I like about their setup program is that it looks in the environment, autoexec.bat, config.sys and INITIALS.m (personalized macros file) and parses each of them for your current configuration. At the end of the setup sequence when it writes the files, it modifies *only* the thing necessary, and leaves everything else alone. When installing a new version of Brief, you don't have to tell it where anything is (except which hard disk to install on) or what any current configuration is: it figures that out for itself. It takes some work to parse the different file formats, but it's well worth it! -- James R. Van Artsdalen ...!ut-sally!utastro!bigtex!james "Live Free or Die" Home: 512-346-2444 Work: 328-0282; 110 Wild Basin Rd. Ste #230, Austin TX 78746
tat00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com (Tom Thackrey) (06/02/88)
In article <2245@bigtex.uucp> james@bigtex.UUCP (James Van Artsdalen) writes: >IN article <5854@pyr.gatech.EDU>, is813cs@pyr.UUCP (Cris Simpson) wrote: >>[ extolling the virtues of the Brief setup program ] > >The thing I like about their setup program is that it looks in the >environment, autoexec.bat, config.sys and INITIALS.m (personalized macros >file) and parses each of them for your current configuration. ... >..., you don't have to tell it where >anything is (except which hard disk to install on) or what any current >configuration is: it figures that out for itself. ... Sounds great, maybe the writers of Brief have anticipated all possible configurations. My experience is that setup programs assume too much. Like -only 1 hard disk, -only 1 copy of the software (I almost always have a test and production version), -only 1 autoexec.bat or config.sys etc, -specific directory names for some things, -only 1 monitor, -only 1 printer, and so on. IF the program tells me what it's going to do and gives me the choice to abort and complete the installation manually, Ok. If it barges ahead I usually spend the next few hours restoring my disks and trying to figure out how to install the software without using the setup program. My preference would be software that installed by simply copying the distributions disks into a directory. If I have to use a setup program, I want to know exactly what it's going to do and have the option to abort before I get trash all over my disks. -- Tom Thackrey tat00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com <=> amdahl!tat00 [ My opinions are only my own. ]
james@bigtex.uucp (James Van Artsdalen) (06/06/88)
IN article <33955@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com>, tat00@amdahl.uts.amdahl.com (Tom Thackrey) wrote: > In article <2245@bigtex.uucp> james@bigtex.UUCP (James Van Artsdalen) writes: > >[ extolling the virtues of the Brief setup program ] > Sounds great, maybe the writers of Brief have anticipated all possible > configurations. My experience is that setup programs assume too much. They appear to have anticipated all common configurations. :-) It's almost like the legal question "Are there any reasonable and prudent people?", and the answer is of course, No. > Like -only 1 hard disk, It will work with more than one hard disk. > -only 1 copy of the software (I almost always have a test and production > version), By default it will replace the existing version. You would have to change several defaults to get it to install somewhere other than the current Brief. A quick glance shows four environment variables that are sensitive to where Brief is installed (where macros are located, where the help files are, where the stored "state" is, and where backups are made). > -only 1 autoexec.bat or config.sys etc, Well, since you've only *GOT* one autoexec.bat & config.sys (unless you boot from floppy?), I don't see this as a harmful assumption... But again, you get to see the changes it wants to make, and either refuse them, or write to a different file. > -specific directory names for some things, By default, it uses the directory names you used for the last install. All of those can be changed before actual installation. > -only 1 monitor, I'm not sure if Brief can internally switch between monitors on demand. I think it just uses what's currently selected. It does use an alternate screen page where possible. > -only 1 printer, Well, you can always issue a write-file to lpt2... > and so on. IF the program tells me what it's going to do and gives me > the choice to abort and complete the installation manually, Ok. Yep, it does. The only gotcha is that you have to remember to recompile your macros. I have a makefile that does this. > My preference would be software that installed by simply copying the > distributions disks into a directory. If I have to use a setup program, > I want to know exactly what it's going to do and have the option to > abort before I get trash all over my disks. You do have that option. What my original message should have stated is that Brief's setup program derives its *default* values from the environment & autoexec & config files. You get to see and change all of those values, and just abandon the project altogether if desired. -- James R. Van Artsdalen ...!ut-sally!utastro!bigtex!james "Live Free or Die" Home: 512-346-2444 Work: 328-0282; 110 Wild Basin Rd. Ste #230, Austin TX 78746