davejag@wybbs.UUCP (Dave Jaglowski) (12/23/87)
Great! Do I really want to wait for a system incompatible with everything out,
that will probably rely heavily on IBM's Bus (SO I can pay outrageous prices),
and that is NEVER going to come out! Bah Humbug (Ohh I'm gonna get it!)
My request still stands. Anybody who know of a Multi-Tasker that will really
work (Its got to be commercial, I can't find any PD that work). This is my
current setup (I wish..... I wish.... Model 80 for free please!.....)
IBM XT Chassis.
NEC V20 a/8Mhz
640K DOS Ram
128K ram (HELP! No Expanded or Extended memory driver!)
2 5 1/4" floppies
1 20Meg Seagate
I would especially appreciate any info on DESQview. How well it works,m etc...
PS. Anybody who can reference me to a print spooler that will use the 128K. HELP
______________________________________________________________________
WYBBS: SCO XENIX Grand Rapids, Michigan Phone: (616) 457-1964
UUCP: Ihnp4!killer!Wybbs!Davejag Compu-Serve: I'm too cheap for it
- Dave Jaglowski
"After the despicable neutron bomb, which would kill people but leave
buildings standing, was stopped, plans to build the electron bomb,
which would kill people but leave them standing;the proton bomb, which
would scare people and kill trees;and the listron bomb, which would
kill the germs that can cause bad breath, were cancelled.
----------------------------------------------------------------------ccbw001@ut-emx.UUCP (Bob Gustwick) (01/04/88)
In article <234@wybbs.UUCP>, davejag@wybbs.UUCP (Dave Jaglowski) writes: > My request still stands. Anybody who know of a Multi-Tasker that will really > work (Its got to be commercial, I can't find any PD that work). This is my > current setup (I wish..... I wish.... Model 80 for free please!.....) > > IBM XT Chassis. > NEC V20 a/8Mhz > 640K DOS Ram > 128K ram (HELP! No Expanded or Extended memory driver!) > 2 5 1/4" floppies > 1 20Meg Seagate > > I would especially appreciate any info on DESQview. How well it works,m etc... > I use DESQview on an 8Mhz V20 Zenith 158 (XT clone). It is the only product I've found that seems to work. Alas, there are some problems... not with DESQview, but with the hardware required to run it. DESQview can be run on a 640K PC, but it is not really that useful. by the time you've got memory allocated for DOS, DESQview, you probably only will have about 300K left to multitask in (I'm guessing, not at home to see for sure). You really need some EMS 3.2 memory for DESQview to swap between programs well (like the Mac switcher). To multitask well under DESQview you need some AST or Quadram EEMS memory, or EMS 4.0 memory. So far, I have been unable to find an EEMS card for the PC bus that will run at 8Mhz. I have AST's Rampage PC and AST's 6-pack premium. The 6-pack premium seems to work fine for all EMS applications except DESQview at 8Mhz. The Rampage PC consistantly fails (parity errors) at 8Mhz. Both come w/ 150ns rams. I've tried 120ns rams w/ the same results. I've called Quadram, but they told me that their PC boards don't work at 8Mhz either. So far I've not seen any ads from EMS board manufacturers proclaiming *hardware* compatibility w/ EMS 4.0. So far AST & Quadram seem to be the only choices... so when I run DESQview, its at 4.77Mhz. AST has a new 80286 accellerator card (HotShot 286) out that is compatible w/ EEMS and it has been claimed to have a Norton SI rating of 10.1. Perhaps that will solve my speed problems. Why is EEMS or EMS 4.0 so necessary??? both of these expanded memory specifications allow paging of memory in the 640k conventional memory space. this means that on an XT you might have several 400K dos sessions all multitasking away at once. I have removed all memory from my CPU card in my Zenith so that all memory in my machine comes from the EEMS cards... I have done such things as have a kermit file transfer and long C compile in the background while running a flight simulator in the forground. admittedly, on a 4.77Mhz V20 too much multitasking can really slow down an already slow system. running two Norton SI's (from the advanced edition) at once under DESQview got 0.7 of an IBM XT in each DESQview window. 4.77 Mhz V20 w/o DESQview was 1.8, and 8Mhz V20 gets a 2.1 (if i remember correctly). If your programs don't go thru the standard MSDOS hooks, or can't make TopView calls, then your programs can only run in the foreground (when it has full access to such resources as the screen) but most of the stuff that i want to have run in the background does so quite nicely (compilers and communications programs). The process to inform DESQview of program characteristics is much simpler and less time consuming that Windows 1.0 (I don't have 2.0 so i have no idea if it is any nicer... 1.0 was a real dog... and although i got it for free w/ the purchase of my machine, i quickly removed it from my hard disk. i can only hope that windows 2.0 and OS/2 are much better... otherwise we are surely doomed) Also unlike windows, you can run a program under dos and DESQview assumes that that program is well behaved. You'll notice quite quickly if the program is not well behaved. But a surprising number of programs work quite well. Windows assumes that no program is well behaved and forces you to define each program w/ its own pif file or in window's config file. i use lots small programs (pkarc, picnix utilities, etc.) and would hate to have to define a pif file for each. Quarterdeck would have me believe that DESQview is even more slick on the 386. it requires no special hardware by using 386 facilities to simulate EEMS. In summary, DESQview is the most best multitasker for DOS I've used. Perhaps Windows or OS/2 works well on the 386, but not on my XT clone. The only drawback is that you really must use EMS 4.0 or EEMS hardware to take full advantage of DESQview. One program that I have not used is DoubleDos. As its name implies, it can only run 2 programs... I know of several BBS's that are running under it... It may be a solution if you don't want to buy extra hardware... ...Bob
farber@udel.EDU (Dave Farber) (01/04/88)
I have used both Desqview and Windows 386 on my 386. Tell you what I would do -- hold my breath a bit longer till you can get VPIX working under SCO Xenix 386 and save your self a lot of pain. Desqview with the EXTRA priced 386 eem works well but it is a pain to fine tune so that comm systems like UULINK work effectivly in the background. The windowing (not MS windows) protocols need a lot of care and feeding of the schedulers in tasking environments and the tuning is critical. Technically windows 386 is a much more refined product. The basic problem I have with it is that it does not allow me to determine the ticks to be given to individual tasks so it is hard to "custom" the repsonse. Again given my experience I would wait till VPIX Dave ============================================================= David J. Farber University of Delaware Dept of EE Newark De 19716 Office: 302-451-1163; Arpanet/CSNet: farber@udel.edu
sld@beach.cis.ufl.edu (Steven Louis Davis) (01/04/88)
In article <422@ut-emx.UUCP> ccbw001@ut-emx.UUCP (Bob Gustwick) writes: >In article <234@wybbs.UUCP>, davejag@wybbs.UUCP (Dave Jaglowski) writes: >> My request still stands. Anybody who know of a Multi-Tasker that will really >> ..... >> I would especially appreciate any info on DESQview. How well it works,m etc. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I am a devoted DESQview for about a 1.5 years now. It does everything it says it will(the only bug that I've found is the inability to format disks with DOS version 3.2). >I use DESQview on an 8Mhz V20 Zenith 158 (XT clone). It is the only product >I've found that seems to work. Alas, there are some problems... not with >DESQview, but with the hardware required to run it. > ..... >need some AST or Quadram EEMS memory, or EMS 4.0 memory. So far, I have been >unable to find an EEMS card for the PC bus that will run at 8Mhz. I have AST's >Rampage PC and AST's 6-pack premium. The 6-pack premium seems to work fine >for all EMS applications except DESQview at 8Mhz. The Rampage PC consistantly >fails (parity errors) at 8Mhz. Both come w/ 150ns rams. I've tried 120ns ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I had exactly the same problem with my RampageAT, but when I called AST they replaced it with a new one rated for 8Mhz. and I've had no trouble since. >number of programs work quite well. Windows assumes that no program is >well behaved and forces you to define each program w/ its own pif file or >in window's config file. i use lots small programs (pkarc, picnix utilities, >etc.) and would hate to have to define a pif file for each. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Best is to set up a BAD-DOS-window in which to run all BADly behaved programs. In fact, my configuration of DESQview only has "DOS windows", so that I appear simply to be running concurrent copies of DOS. I have three memory configurations(sizes) for foreground work and three for background as well as the couple for badly behaved programs. -- ****************************************************************************** Steven L. Davis telephone: (904) 392 0276 & (904) 371 7041 Internet: sld@beach.cis.ufl.edu uucp: ..!ihnp4!codas!ufcsv!ufcsg!sld
mvolo@ecsvax.UUCP (Michael R. Volow) (01/05/88)
(long summary of Bob Gustwick's [ccbw001@ut-emx.UUCP] experience with DESQview on an 8086 machine) Has anyone compared the performance and utility of DESQview with either DoubleDOS or Concurrent DOS in these types of modest applications? If so, what are your impressions? [D --Mike Volow, Psychiatry, Durham Veterans Administration Medical Center Durham, NC, 27712 919 286 0411 Ext 6933 mvolo@ecsvax.UUCP
hadden@ella.SRC.Honeywell.COM (George D. Hadden) (05/05/89)
hi,
i've pulled the files multask.arc and pc2time.arc over from simtel20,
and am having trouble getting them to do what i want. multask.arc
complains that i have the wrong version of dos (i'm running 2.11 on a
toshiba 1100+), while pc2time seems to start up two msdos's all right,
but gives no cpu cycles to the background task. pc2time came with no
documentation, so it's possible that there are ways to have both tasks
running at the same time by giving it the appropriate command line
args.
my questions are,
1) does anyone know how to get multask to work?
2) does anyone know a) how to get pc2time to give cycles to the
background task, or b) how to get in touch with the author, or c)
where i can find documentation.
thanks a lot,
-geo
---
George D. Hadden, Honeywell Systems and Research Center
PHONE: (612)782-7769
MAIL: 3660 Technology Drive MN65-2100, Minneapolis, MN 55418
ARPA: hadden@src.honeywell.com
UUCP: {umn-cs, ems, bthpyd}!srcsip!hadden