pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) (01/17/90)
I have an IBM (real) PC-XT with a Seagate ST-225 hard disk. I need
to add a second hard disk or simply replace the original 20MB with
something much larger (60MB?). Currently, I only keep the software
which I regularly use one the system and a few (<30) user files
on the system. But I have run out of room. I visited a local
computer store and I was told that I could not put more than
30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this
true? I thought that DOS 3.2 supports hard disks larger than
32MB in one partition. I would also like to find a faster hard
disk. BTW, I have an Intel 386PC turbo card in the system to
improve performance.
I would also like to add a 1.44MB floppy onto the system. Any hints
or suggestions. Which disk drive is better? Toshiba? Sony?
Thanks
eholmberg@kontu.utu.fi (01/18/90)
In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM>, pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes: > computer store and I was told that I could not put more than > 30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this > true? I thought that DOS 3.2 supports hard disks larger than > 32MB in one partition. I would also like to find a faster hard The 8-bit bus has nothing to do with the size of the hard disc. I have a XT (clone:-) equipped with ST-277R disc, which gives 63 MB formatted capacity. The disc is partitioned with Disk Manager, which works happily.. DOS 3.2 does not support over 32 MB discs, so Disk Manager was a must. DOS 3.3 can use discs over 32 MB in size, but not over 32 MB in one partition. If you wish to use bigger partitions, you need DOS 4.01. -- E. K. Holmberg, Co-Sysop of SAS-(M)BBS (+358-21-518-994,24h,V.32ECM) Also known as eholmberg@kontu.utu.fi holmberg_esa_tt@tt.elisa.fi and t6t-holm@mammutti.utu.fi
simon@hpstek.dec.com (Curiosier and curiosier...) (01/18/90)
In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM>, pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes... > I visited a local > computer store and I was told that I could not put more than > 30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this > true? Not true. I run Maxtor 2190(?) 127 Mb partitioned on my 3 year old XT clone. Actually, with a modern controller I could get 159 Mb, but my controller BIOS knows only about 1024 cylinder, while the drive has 1124 cyl. --- Leo Simon simon@hpstek.enet.dec.com --or-- ...!decwrl!hpstek.enet.dec.com!simon --or-- simon%hpstek.enet.dec@decwrl.dec.com Who is not liberal when young, doesn't have a heart. Who is not conservative when old, doesn't have a brain.
kaleb@mars.jpl.nasa.gov (Kaleb Keithley) (01/19/90)
In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM> pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes: > I have an IBM (real) PC-XT with a Seagate ST-225 hard disk. I need > I visited a local > computer store and I was told that I could not put more than > 30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this > true This is hogwash, I added a 60 meg Micropolis drive to my XT clone (which had a Western Digital eight bit controller) and it worked just fine. DOS 3.3 definitely, and 3.2 maybe, supports extended DOS partitions, which are subdivided into logical drives. DOS 3.31 (Compaq) and 4.01 allow unlimited size drives (really 16 gigabytes, but to me, that's unlimited) > I would also like to add a 1.44MB floppy onto the system. Any hints > or suggestions. Which disk drive is better? Toshiba? Sony? > Change you FD controller to one of the clone FD controllers that support these floppy drives. Under $100 I think. I can't tell you which brand is better. Chewey, get us outta here! kaleb@mars.jpl.nasa.gov (818)354-8771 Kaleb Keithley
rick@NRC.COM (Rick Wagner) (01/19/90)
In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM> pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes: > > > I have an IBM (real) PC-XT with a Seagate ST-225 hard disk. I need > to add a second hard disk or simply replace the original 20MB with > something much larger (60MB?). Currently, I only keep the software > which I regularly use one the system and a few (<30) user files > on the system. But I have run out of room. I visited a local > computer store and I was told that I could not put more than > 30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this > true? I thought that DOS 3.2 supports hard disks larger than > 32MB in one partition. I would also like to find a faster hard > disk. BTW, I have an Intel 386PC turbo card in the system to > improve performance. A few months back, I was doing development for the Segate St01/st02 controller. I had this card, and an st296N (80 Mb) drive installed in my XT clone. It worked fine. You'll need DOS 3.3 or 4.0. DOS 3.2 only allowed one partition, upto 32Mb, per drive. DOS 3.3 allows multiple 32 MB partitions (logical drives) per hard drive. I used DOS 3.3 on my XT, and had 3 partitions (C:, D: = 32Mb, E: = ~10Mb). Worked fine. I only had the setup for a limited time, so others can comment on the long term reliability of these drives. I am not recommending them (or un-recommending), just making the point that it can be done. These drives/controllers were discussed (alot!) a few months ago, so if you want to check into them, someone might have the discussions archived. > > I would also like to add a 1.44MB floppy onto the system. Any hints > or suggestions. Which disk drive is better? Toshiba? Sony? I beleave the ST02 can handle these drives. > > Thanks --rick -- =============================================================================== Rick Wagner Network Research Corp. rick@nrc.com 2380 North Rose Ave. (805) 485-2700 FAX: (805) 485-8204 Oxnard, CA 93030 Don't hate yourself in the morning; sleep til noon.
bb16@prism.gatech.EDU (Scott Bostater) (01/19/90)
In article <456@nrcvax.NRC.COM> rick@nrcvax.UUCP (Rick Wagner) writes: >In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM> pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes: >> >> [ discussion about the need for a hard disk >30MB ] >> BTW, I have an Intel 386PC turbo card in the system to >> improve performance. > >A few months back, I was doing development for the Segate St01/st02 >controller. I had this card, and an st296N (80 Mb) drive installed in >my XT clone. It worked fine. You'll need DOS 3.3 or 4.0. DOS 3.2 > [discussion of disk partitioning deleted] Better watch yourself on the SCSI drives with your 386PC card. I tried putting an ST296N/ST01 combination in an original IBM PC with a Quadram 386XT turbo board. It didn't work because the SCSI cotroller board's BIOS conflicted with the 386XT's BIOS. I talked with Quadram about the problem and their response was "tough luck" (well, maybe not their exact words :-). I don't know if the Intel board has the same problem or not. As far as the ST296N is concerned. I still have it (I ended up upgrading to a 25MHz 386 mother board) and I hate it. There's been a lot of talk about the ST296N a couple months ago in this group. The major downfall of the drive is that Seagate slowed it down to work better with Macs. This means you have to format the drive at a 2:1 interleave, severely crippling the speed of the drive. (i.e. 1/2 max transfer rate). Seagate will change the ROMs on the drive so you can format at 1:1, but it takes two weeks and you don't get the same drive back. -- Scott Bostater GTRI/RAIL/RAD (Ga. Tech) "My soul finds rest in God alone; my salvation comes from Him" -Ps 62.1 uucp: ...!{allegra,amd,hplabs,ut-ngp}!gatech!prism!bb16 Internet: bb16@prism.gatech.edu
bcw@rti.UUCP (Bruce Wright) (01/20/90)
In article <2590@jato.Jpl.Nasa.Gov>, kaleb@mars.jpl.nasa.gov (Kaleb Keithley) writes: > In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM> pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes: > > I have an IBM (real) PC-XT with a Seagate ST-225 hard disk. I need > > I visited a local > > computer store and I was told that I could not put more than > > 30MB on my system since it is an XT with an 8-bit bus. Is this > > true > > This is hogwash, I added a 60 meg Micropolis drive to my XT clone (which > had a Western Digital eight bit controller) and it worked just fine. Quite true - the XT bus can certainly handle disks of essentially _any_ size: it isn't the bus that is the problem. It's hard to believe that someone at a computer store would make such a mistake, but I suppose it can happen. The problem, as Kaleb implies but does not explicitly state, is that many older XT disk _controllers_ can't handle very many disk sizes, and many of them assume that for relatively low-end machines you wouldn't _want_ very big disks anyway, so the controller doesn't have the support for big disks. If you give it even a minimal amount of thought, the absurdity of the idea of the XT's bus not being able to handle big disk drives is obvious - the only time the disk size makes any difference is in specifying the disk address (cyl, track, sector) which is usually done in I/O space, not in memory space; the memory addressing limitations of the XT don't even enter into the picture. There _are_ some problems taking advantage of _high performance_ disk drives on the XT, where the width/speed of the bus would be a handicap to using the drive as effectively as one would like (you may not be able to use that nice fast drive with a 1:1 inter- leave factor, you might have to settle for 1:3 or 1:5 which for a fast drive might not be great but which would still not be all that bad), but the drive would still _work_ if you got a controller to support it. Bruce C. Wright
keithe@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Keith Ericson) (01/20/90)
In article <7565@shlump.nac.dec.com> simon@hpstek.dec.com (Curiosier and curiosier...) writes: > >In article <1400021@hp-ptp.HP.COM>, pault@hp-ptp.HP.COM (Paul_Taira) writes... > >...I run Maxtor 2190(?) 127 Mb partitioned on my 3 year old XT >clone. Actually, with a modern controller I could get 159 Mb, but my >controller BIOS knows only about 1024 cylinder, while the drive has 1124 >cyl. If that "modern controller" were an Adaptec 2372B (or C I think they're up to now?) you could get 1224 x 15 x 26 x 512 = 244+ Megabytes of FORMATTED capacity ^\ ^\ ^\ ^\ | | | | | | | +-- bytes/sector | | | | | +--RLL sectors/track | | | +-- heads (or tracks/cylinder) | +-- cylinders (sector translation allows DOS to access more than it's 10-bit = 1024 cylinder limit) Other manufacturer's controllers may also have the sector translation capability: my experience is limited - due to good results: why fix what ain't broken - to Adaptec. The MAXTOR drives, while not specified to accommodate RLL, are high quality products and exceed the manufacturer's specifications in this regard. We regularly use Maxtor XT-1085's as "standard issue" in this same configuration and also have many XT-2190's so used. kEITHe
simon@hpstek.dec.com (Curiosier and curiosier...) (01/20/90)
In article <6706@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM>, keithe@tekgvs.LABS.TEK.COM (Keith Ericson) writes... >The MAXTOR drives, while not specified to accommodate RLL, are high quality >products and exceed the manufacturer's specifications in this regard. We >regularly use Maxtor XT-1085's as "standard issue" in this same configuration >and also have many XT-2190's so used. 127 Mb that I get from an MFM controller is more then enough for home use. I tend to agree with a view that if a drive is not specified as RLL, I better leave it as MFM. --- Leo Simon simon@hpstek.enet.dec.com --or-- ...!decwrl!hpstek.enet.dec.com!simon --or-- simon%hpstek.enet.dec@decwrl.dec.com Who is not liberal when young, doesn't have a heart. Who is not conservative when old, doesn't have a brain.