burkett@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Edward W Burkett) (06/13/90)
We just received Coherent and it is a cute little TOY but as it stands that's all it is since you are limited to 640K, most of which is used by the operating system itself. We were lead by the company to believe that it supported swapping and virtual memory. It definitely does not yet they compare it to SCO Xenix 286. The manual clearly says that it will not work in 386 protected mode, why doesn't the company? In article <3116@crash.cts.com> jca@pnet01.cts.com (John C. Archambeau) writes: > >I base my assertion of no swapping being supported on what the software >engineer at MWC told me when I called him drilling him on how close to the >current implementations of Unix are. He told me, no, it doesn't support >swapping or virtual memory. My biggest peeve against Coherent is no large >memory model support (ala SCO Xenix 286 or MicroPort Unix SysV/AT). In my >opinion, MWC had no business benching Coherent against SCO Xenix 286 since it >does support large model processes. * Bill Heiser (heiser@world.std.com) writes: * * I guess they must have put it in the manual expecting to get it to work, but * maybe ran into problems, so released the product without swapping. Apparently * they must not have the /conf stuff included for the same reason. When we called MWC they said that in about a year they would be POSSIBLY coming out with a version of Coherent for the 386 in protected mode. When asked how much it would cost .... they squirmed and repeatedly said that they did not know. * kaleb@mars.jpl.nasa.gov (Kaleb Keithley) writes: * * Coherent is a multi-tasking OS, includes a compiler that generates working * code, and no doubt a whole slew of tools that make any flavor of DOS on a PC * look like a Commodore Pet. What's the point of having a multi-tasking OS that has a whole slew of tools if you don't have any room in memory to run REAL applications. I guess if you just wanted to learn *NIX by PLAYING, it makes for a nice trainer. * Mark Williams comes along and gives you a compiler in the deal, and all you * can do is bitch! Come on .... it`s a toy. * Take your snivel rags home and give it a rest will'ya. If you don't want * it, then shut up. Keep using DOS, see if I care! OK I don't want it and as it turns out that's the only GOOD part about it .... I can send it back and get my money back. Shut-up! Hmmmm .... If we can save a lot of people the headaches that I and others went through purchasing something that doesn't do what we expected it to do I think I'll voice my opinion just like YOU did. That's the beauty of a free country :-) In Fact, someone suggested to me that this may be an advertising gimmick to introduce an *NIX OS at a low cost simply to demonstrate the potentials to users and then re-introduce the real think at a significantly greater cost. Hmmmmmm. [I take no responsiblilty for any of the above statements.] Ed Burkett
kaleb@mars.jpl.nasa.gov (Kaleb Keithley) (06/13/90)
In article <4446@uwm.edu> burkett@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Edward W Burkett) writes: > >We just received Coherent and it is a cute little TOY but as it stands >that's all it is since you are limited to 640K, most of which is used by >the operating system itself. We were lead by the company to believe that it >supported swapping and virtual memory. It definitely does not yet >they compare it to SCO Xenix 286. The manual clearly says that it will not >work in 386 protected mode, why doesn't the company? > >* I wrote: >* >* Coherent is a multi-tasking OS, includes a compiler that generates working >* code, and no doubt a whole slew of tools that make any flavor of DOS on a PC >* look like a Commodore Pet. > >What's the point of having a multi-tasking OS that has a whole slew of tools >if you don't have any room in memory to run REAL applications. I guess if >you just wanted to learn *NIX by PLAYING, it makes for a nice trainer. > Let me qualify that; (note: I have no affiliation with MWC) How much utility did M'soft provide with DOS 1.0. How much utility did IBM provide with 128K of memory. Where's the C compiler on the MS/PC DOS distribution disk. If all products were judged on the long term utility of their first release, then where would M'soft, IBM, et al. be now? Besides, if I was faced with trying to get on an overloaded university computer to write my 50 line lab assignment, I might find Coherent to be just the thing for me. As it happens, I'm not, so I probably won't. >* Mark Williams comes along and gives you a compiler in the deal, and all you >* can do is bitch! > >Come on .... it`s a toy. So was 128K IBM PC, by todays standards. The bitching that I hear relates to three things: no large memory model, no paging, and no swapping. For $99 you expected more than a toy? From what I've heard, for $99 you get quite a lot. Let's see, DOS 4.01 -- $85, Turbo/Quick C, $75-95. Windows 3.0, (for multi-tasking) I don't know what it really is, but let's say it's $75. Getting pretty close to $300. Or you could go the OS-2 route: $350 + M'soft Optimizing Compiler -- $350; over $700. How about any of the full blown system V system. My copy of ESIX cost $800. If I were to even consider Coherent (and I have considered buying it) would I expect the same level of features for $99 as I would for $800? No, I don't think so! Maybe that's why I paid $800 for ESIX? >* Take your snivel rags home and give it a rest will'ya. If you don't want >* it, then shut up. Keep using DOS, see if I care! > >Shut-up! Hmmmm .... If we can save a lot of people the headaches that I and >others went through purchasing something that doesn't do what we expected it >to do I think I'll voice my opinion just like YOU did. That's the beauty of >a free country :-) OK, I think we've communicated to the world that Coherent doesn't have a large memory model, doesn't page, and doesn't swap. I've posted news about products that I thought were a) a rip-off, and b) a poor value too. But now I'm tired of pressing 'n' on twenty or thirty articles because some other dis-satisfied customers just found out it doesn't have a large memory model. kaleb@thyme.jpl.nasa.gov Jet Propeller Labs Kaleb Keithley "So that's what an invisible barrier looks like"
farmer@boulder.Colorado.EDU (FARMER DOUGLAS ALAN) (06/14/90)
>In article 57585 of comp.sys.ibm.pc burkett@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Edward W Burkett) >writes >>We just received Coherent and it is a cute little TOY but as it stands >>that's all it is since you are limited to 640K, most of which is used by ^^^^ >This is not the case. I have 1 meg of RAM (640 base, 384 extended) in my 286 >machine. When I boot up Coherent it gives me the message 841(or thereabouts) >bytes of memory free. Since, this number is larger than 640 and less than >1024, I assume that Coherent is using _ALL_ available memory (the missing whoops, that should be 841 kbytes of memory free. sorry about that. -farmer@snoopy.colorado.edu -Unix...Live Free Or Die
mike@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan) (06/16/90)
In article <4446@uwm.edu> burkett@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Edward W Burkett) writes: > >We just received Coherent and it is a cute little TOY but as it stands >that's all it is since you are limited to 640K, most of which is used by >the operating system itself. Can you support this claim, like, with some FACTS (ie: the page of the manual which states that you can only use 640k?) I have read several accounts on this newsgroup from people who have been using Coherent on 2mb machines, and have 1855k available after boot. This would seem to invalidate your claim that it can only address 640K. Or, does this limitation exist merely because you only have 640K in your XT? Furthermore, the ads for the product stated that it had a small, 64k kernal. Are you saying that MWC lied to their customers? Nothing is worse than an inept user who mis-installs a product and then bitches about it. MD -- -- Michael P. Deignan, President -- Small Business Systems, Inc. -- ----------------------------------------- Box 17220, Esmond, RI 02917 -- -- Internet: mike@anomaly.sbs.com -- (401) 273-4669 Voice -- -- UUCP: ...!uunet!rayssd!anomaly!mike -- (401) 455-0347 Telebit --
duncan@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Shan D Duncan) (06/17/90)
From article <1753@anomaly.sbs.com>, by mike@anomaly.sbs.com (Michael P. Deignan): > In article <4446@uwm.edu> burkett@csd4.csd.uwm.edu (Edward W Burkett) writes: >> >>We just received Coherent and it is a cute little TOY but as it stands >>that's all it is since you are limited to 640K, most of which is used by >>the operating system itself. > > Can you support this claim, like, with some FACTS (ie: the page of the > manual which states that you can only use 640k?) > > I have read several accounts on this newsgroup from people who have been > using Coherent on 2mb machines, and have 1855k available after boot. This > would seem to invalidate your claim that it can only address 640K. Or, > does this limitation exist merely because you only have 640K in your XT? > > Furthermore, the ads for the product stated that it had a small, 64k > kernal. Are you saying that MWC lied to their customers? > > Nothing is worse than an inept user who mis-installs a product and then > bitches about it. > > MD > -- > -- Michael P. Deignan, President -- Small Business Systems, Inc. -- > ----------------------------------------- Box 17220, Esmond, RI 02917 -- > -- Internet: mike@anomaly.sbs.com -- (401) 273-4669 Voice -- > -- UUCP: ...!uunet!rayssd!anomaly!mike -- (401) 455-0347 Telebit -- Ed was talking about Coherent booted on a Zenith 386/33 with 2 MB on the motherboard. We talked to MWC in March about their product and they never mentioned then that it would not work with the standard Zenith 386 controller (ESDI) [we tried it anyway and it did work.] We could not edit a file as large as 45k with the editior they supplied. Taking to the support people they are the ones that said do not expect to edit data over 64k and that the enviroment was still limited by 640k. I am not sure about this information because he thought I wanted to SAVE a 64k file and I was out of hd space??? This is where Ed's assumption that most of the memory is taken up by the OS and editor. By the way the manual contradicts itself on the device drivers to access floppy drives. It took some digging to find out how to get dos text files over to coherent using their dos command. So anyone else want to try and see how large a file can be: Edited? Compiled? The ad specifically states that one has access to a GIGABYTE of UNIX software in the public domain. Just how much of this gigabyte of software would be able to run under coherent? How about a shell with job control and aliases? Just for a start...