riddle@woton.UUCP (Prentiss Riddle) (07/22/88)
Howdy. I'm trying to educate myself enough about networking to make
some reasonable decisions regarding improving our connectivity around
this place. Networking being a pretty arcane subject, I'm sure I can't
be the only person who is confused. Since our hardware/software
environment is almost entirely AT&T, I'll display my ignorance and ask
my questions in this newsgroup.
I gathered after interrogating some of our local AT&T technical and
sales folks that the following is a chart of what's available in the
way of networks for AT&T equipment:
Starlan 3BNet TCP/IP
--------- --------- ---------
AT&T 3B15 no yes (RFS) yes (RFS)
AT&T 3B2 yes (RFS) yes (RFS) yes (RFS)
AT&T 3B1 yes (RFS) no no
AT&T 6386 yes no no
DOS clone yes no no
A hitch that you can't see in this chart is that RFS (Remote File
Sharing) can't be used between different kinds of networks. That means
that while Starlan can give you RFS between a 3B2 and a 3B1, and either
3BNet or TCP/IP can give you RFS between a 3B15 and a 3B2, there's no
way to do RFS among all three.
Questions:
(1) Is all of the above correct?
(2) I was under the impression that 3BNet was essentially UUCP on top
of TCP/IP. I gather that the TCP/IP column refers to non-AT&T TCP/IP
(Wollongong, perhaps). What is the difference between that and 3BNet?
(3) I have some experience as a user of 4.2BSD NFS, and know about
"rcp", "rsh", ".rlogin" files, etc. Does that bear any resemblance to
RFS? How can I find out what RFS looks like to the user and to the
administrator (especially security features)?
(4) How does RFS interact with my plain old System V mail software?
(5) The cells of the above chart marked "yes" without "(RFS)"
apparently refer to the ability of Starlan to let a 3B2 or a 6386 act
as a file server for DOS machines. Correct? Does this interfere with
the use of Starlan to provide RFS and other goodies among Unix
machines?
(6) Is there some basic document, article or book I should read so all
this will be clear to me and I won't have to ask silly questions?
Please send obvious answers that everyone should know to me by mail,
and I will summarize if there is interest. Long, well-written tomes
of general interest can be posted directly to this newsgroup. Thanks.
-- Prentiss Riddle ("Aprendiz de todo, maestro de nada.")
-- Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer.
-- riddle%woton.uucp@cs.utexas.edu uunet!ut-sally!cs.utexas.edu!woton!riddlerkh@mtune.ATT.COM (Robert Halloran) (07/22/88)
In article <1098@woton.UUCP> riddle@woton.UUCP (Prentiss Riddle) writes: >I gathered after interrogating some of our local AT&T technical and >sales folks that the following is a chart of what's available in the >way of networks for AT&T equipment: > > Starlan 3BNet TCP/IP > --------- --------- --------- > AT&T 3B15 no yes (RFS) yes (RFS) > AT&T 3B2 yes (RFS) yes (RFS) yes (RFS) > AT&T 3B1 yes (RFS) no no > AT&T 6386 yes no no > DOS clone yes no no > >A hitch that you can't see in this chart is that RFS (Remote File >Sharing) can't be used between different kinds of networks. That means >that while Starlan can give you RFS between a 3B2 and a 3B1, and either >3BNet or TCP/IP can give you RFS between a 3B15 and a 3B2, there's no >way to do RFS among all three. > >Questions: > >(1) Is all of the above correct? Since RFS is particular to SVr3, there is no way to run it on a 3B1 or PC/DOS system, period. There IS (was?) an ethernet/TCP-IP option for the 3B1, though no 3Bnet. Order codes are 37422 for the board, 1030-008 for the Wollongong software to drive it. This may no longer be available with the closing down of the 7300 line. I have seen ads for ethernet boards for 386 machines purporting to support RFS under 386 Unix, though I have no experience with them to be able to comment on usefulness. >(2) I was under the impression that 3BNet was essentially UUCP on top >of TCP/IP. I gather that the TCP/IP column refers to non-AT&T TCP/IP >(Wollongong, perhaps). What is the difference between that and 3BNet? 3Bnet was an AT&T proprietary protocol used over ethernet hardware. It is being phased out in favor of TCP/IP. Programs are available to allow UUCP to run over either protocol suite. >(3) I have some experience as a user of 4.2BSD NFS, and know about >"rcp", "rsh", ".rlogin" files, etc. Does that bear any resemblance to >RFS? How can I find out what RFS looks like to the user and to the >administrator (especially security features)? RFS relates to remote mounting of directories over a network. Once done, the standard cp/mv commands work just fine. This has nothing to do with remote shell access/program execution, and RFS per se does not offer these facilities. The network you use as a transport may also have applications which do, though. Most network packages support 'cu' over the given network, for example. For RFS administrative information, check out an admin's guide for SVr3. >(4) How does RFS interact with my plain old System V mail software? Has nothing directly to do with it; your $MAIL may be a remotely mounted directory, but mail/mailx/.... doesn't see any difference. >(5) The cells of the above chart marked "yes" without "(RFS)" >apparently refer to the ability of Starlan to let a 3B2 or a 6386 act >as a file server for DOS machines. Correct? Does this interfere with >the use of Starlan to provide RFS and other goodies among Unix >machines? Not to my knowledge, though bandwidth constraints may prove an issue. >(6) Is there some basic document, article or book I should read so all >this will be clear to me and I won't have to ask silly questions? > >-- Prentiss Riddle ("Aprendiz de todo, maestro de nada.") >-- Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. >-- riddle%woton.uucp@cs.utexas.edu uunet!ut-sally!cs.utexas.edu!woton!riddle Bob Halloran ========================================================================= UUCP: {att, rutgers}!mtune!rkh Internet: rkh@mtune.ATT.COM Apple ConsumerLink: RobertH107 GEnie:R.HALLORAN USPS: 19 Culver Ct, Old Bridge NJ 08857 DDD: 201-251-7514 eve ET Disclaimer: If you think AT&T would have ME as a spokesman, you're crazed. Quote: "History is made at night. Character is what you are in the Dark." - Dr. Lizardo/John Whorfin, "Buckaroo Banzai" =========================================================================
les@chinet.chi.il.us (Leslie Mikesell) (07/24/88)
In article <1098@woton.UUCP> riddle@woton.UUCP (Prentiss Riddle) writes: >(3) I have some experience as a user of 4.2BSD NFS, and know about >"rcp", "rsh", ".rlogin" files, etc. Does that bear any resemblance to >RFS? How can I find out what RFS looks like to the user and to the >administrator (especially security features)? RFS allows mounting directories from one machine into another machine. All unix semantics are preserved, except for deadlock detection when locking file regions (i.e. even devices may be accessed by a similar machine, and FIFO's will work). Security-wise, a machine password may be required for the name service, and user ID's can be mapped on a per-host basis. >(4) How does RFS interact with my plain old System V mail software? Not at all, since it is a file service, unless you happen to make /usr/mail a remote mount which would only work if the users had the same login names on all the machines involved. The same transport (starlan, tcp, or whatever) would normally allow uucp and cu connections, though. >(5) The cells of the above chart marked "yes" without "(RFS)" >apparently refer to the ability of Starlan to let a 3B2 or a 6386 act >as a file server for DOS machines. Correct? Does this interfere with >the use of Starlan to provide RFS and other goodies among Unix >machines? The DOS server function does not interfere with other functions on the same transport network other than the bandwidth taken and the machine limits on virtual circuits. In fact, a directory that is being used by the DOS server may contain (or be contained within) RFS mounts. This means the data takes 2 hops across the net to get to the DOS machine, but it allows sharing data beyond the number of PCs (about 32) allowed on a single server. >(6) Is there some basic document, article or book I should read so all >this will be clear to me and I won't have to ask silly questions? I wish.... You should be aware, though that starlan is changing its low-level protocol and old and new versions will not talk to each other. The 6386 (under unix) will only have the new version available and the 3B1 is unlikely to ever have the new version, so these machines will not talk to each other. Also the 3B1 does not have RFS since it does not have SysVr3, although DOS server software is (or was) available. Les Mikesell
rwhite@nusdhub.UUCP (Robert C. White Jr.) (07/26/88)
in article <1098@woton.UUCP>, riddle@woton.UUCP (Prentiss Riddle) says: > Net-Unemployed: "Bob" > (3) I have some experience as a user of 4.2BSD NFS, and know about > "rcp", "rsh", ".rlogin" files, etc. Does that bear any resemblance to > RFS? How can I find out what RFS looks like to the user and to the > administrator (especially security features)? RFS dosn't look like anything in particular to a user. The S.A.s of the RFS system decide what will be available over the network, and (potentially) to which systems these things will be available. Further, the SAs will decide that user 200 on system A is equavilant to user 531 on system b. Everybody not spesifically so designated will become a "guest" login and Group ID on teh shared system. The thing (directory) from system A is mounted on System B and all File permissions are evaluated like it were a local resource; give or take the abofe potential translation. > (4) How does RFS interact with my plain old System V mail software? It does not, but the network provider over which you implement will maos likely support "cu" and "uucp" throught the network. Therefore by buying the network soft/hardware you get mail, cu, uux, uucp et al. RFS simple allows Remote File Sharing (including devices, pipes, and other special files and modules.) > (5) The cells of the above chart marked "yes" without "(RFS)" > apparently refer to the ability of Starlan to let a 3B2 or a 6386 act > as a file server for DOS machines. Correct? Does this interfere with > the use of Starlan to provide RFS and other goodies among Unix > machines? NO. RFS and DOS Server are *both* seperate packages which must be purchased outside of your network service. Any network which is "TLI Conformant" (or can be made so useing Streams Modules -- an advanced topic...) Will support RFS. The DOS Server Package is only available on STARLAN Networks. > (6) Is there some basic document, article or book I should read so all > this will be clear to me and I won't have to ask silly questions? Your Talking AT&T here, there is no offical doccumenataion for AT&T products which: 1) makes things clear, 2) can be used as a difinative source, 3) accurately reflects current pricing, 4) represents current availability, or 5) provides accurate projections on possible product availability. Points 1 through 6, 6 not usually being available to the public, are offical AT&T polocy [sic] and are fully explained in item 6 ( 1/2 B-} ) Robert White.