wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) (12/11/88)
<On how to rig daughterboard for 3b1.> I second Thad's proposal, assuming that there's really enough space for the hole and board. I'm not keen on removing the second fan in order to poke kludgey connectors through the grate. Also, I intend to keep my current disk where it is; I'd really like to minimize the amount of mucking about I have to do to get a second disk on this machine. I also agree with whoever said that the important thing is the second disk; if watchdog timers and whatnot make the board too big to fit someplace reasonable, leave them out. (In fact, leave them out regardless. I don't need the extra expense.) Bob Wilber wilber@research.att.com
ccs@lazlo.UUCP (Clifford C. Skolnick) (12/12/88)
In article <8516@alice.UUCP> wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) writes: >... I'm not keen on removing the second fan in >order to poke kludgey connectors through the grate... Ok, how else can you get a cable to the second disk drive? It's is going to have to look ugly. The watchdog timer is a small circuit as I understand it. It's not going to increase the size of the daughter board, which will be inside the computer. I can't belive people are complaining about this. CLIFF -- Clifford C. Skolnick | "You told me time makes it easy, then you never told Phone: (716) 427-8046 | me time stands still" - Gary Neuman TCP/IP: 44.68.0.195 | ...!rutgers!rochester!ritcv!ritcsh!sabin! lazlo!ccs ccs@lazlo.n1dph.ampr.org| \!kodak!pcid!gizzmo!/
dave@arnold.UUCP (Dave Arnold) (12/12/88)
In article <97@lazlo.UUCP>, ccs@lazlo.UUCP (Clifford C. Skolnick) writes: > In article <8516@alice.UUCP> wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) writes: > >... I'm not keen on removing the second fan in > >order to poke kludgey connectors through the grate... > > Ok, how else can you get a cable to the second disk drive? It's > is going to have to look ugly. Not necessarily. There are other places to run cables besides through a fan grate. For instance, I have seen ribbon cable running through the cracks in the back. I vote for a good DB-3x connector. We have some old Convergent disk servers at work that have an old full height St-506 and 8" floppy backup with a DB-3x(something) connector between the workstation and the disk server. I would like to see something like this. The connector could be installed between the fans. I would like to put the daughter board where the internal drive is, and put both hard drives in there own cabinet with there own power supply. -- Dave Arnold dave@arnold.UUCP Volt Delta Resources Phone: (714) 921-7635
wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) (12/12/88)
Clifford C. Skolnick writes: >Ok, how else can you get a cable to the second disk drive? It's >is going to have to look ugly. I hate it when people respond to posts they haven't really read. I was agreeing with the proposal that Thad Floryan had made, which was to mount the board at the back and to cut a hole next to the fan to bring the cable through. With a metal plate screwed in around the hole it should be possible to do this in a reasonably neat fashion. Bob Wilber
gws@n8emr.UUCP (Gary Sanders ) (12/13/88)
>In article <8516@alice.UUCP> wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) writes: >>... I'm not keen on removing the second fan in >>order to poke kludgey connectors through the grate... > No one is forcing you do anything, with the daughter board. Whenever you get the board put the dam thing where you want it. If you dont want to mount the board where it works best and can find someplace to mount it inside "go for it.." I can tell you that with a 1/2HT disk in the 7300 the machine has very little room inside the system to mount anything else. On the dual disk upgade I have, I run all of the cables out the grate of 1 fan and it works fine. I suspect that johns daughter board will have enough cable to be put in the fan area, if you want it someplace else legnthen the cables.. -- Gary W. Sanders (osu-cis!n8emr!gws, gws@osu-cis) (cis) 72277,1325 (packet) N8EMR @ W8CQK (ip addr) 44.70.0.1 HAM/SWL/SCANNER BBS (1200/2400/19.2-PEP) 614-457-4227
thad@cup.portal.com (Thad P Floryan) (12/13/88)
Clifford Skolnick muses: "how else to run a cable to the second disk drive?" Simple (and I've done it (run a cable out)): assuming a vacant expansion slot, remove its cover, from one edge (using a nibbling tool) cut out an opening for a connector, mount said connector (IDC, with ribbon cable), re-affix the expansion slot cover (with attached connector), and run the ribbon cable to the 2 motherboard connectors. The above will ONLY be practical IF one has an unused expansion slot. I prefer the hole-with-plate-in-back-of-the-case scheme I diagrammed last week. Thad Floryan [thad@cup.portal.com (OR) ..!sun!portal!cup.portal.com!thad]
wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) (12/14/88)
Gary W. Sanders (osu-cis!n8emr!gws) writes: }No one is forcing you do anything, with the daughter board. Whenever }you get the board put the dam thing where you want it. If you dont want }to mount the board where it works best and can find someplace to }mount it inside "go for it.." I can tell you that with a 1/2HT disk in }the 7300 the machine has very little room inside the system to mount }anything else. The particular scheme that Thad Floryan suggested and which I was advocating requires that the connector be mounted perpendicular to the board (rather than, say, parallel to the board at an edge) and that places be provided on the board for screwing in standoff pegs -- i.e., the board must be designed with the method of mounting the connector in mind. This still seems to me to be the cleanest method for installing the board. You are right that there is very little room in the box, but if I recall correctly from the last time I looked inside there ought to be just enough space to mount the board against the back "wall" as Thad suggested. I'm not certain of this -- the metal "fingers" that ground the back of the disk drive enclosure might get in the way. (This space is the same on both 3b1's and 7300's.) It can get pretty hot where I keep my 3b1 and I am loath to remove the second fan. Bob Wilber
dave@arnold.UUCP (Dave Arnold) (12/15/88)
(Thad P Floryan) writes: > I prefer the hole-with-plate-in-back-of-the-case scheme I diagrammed last > week. Me too. Hello? John? Do you hear us? -- Dave Arnold dave@arnold.UUCP Volt Delta Resources Phone: (714) 921-7635
root1@booth.UUCP (Root) (12/19/88)
In article <8532@alice.UUCP> wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) writes: > >You are right that there is very little room in the box, but if I recall >correctly from the last time I looked inside there ought to be just enough >space to mount the board against the back "wall" as Thad suggested. I'm not >certain of this -- the metal "fingers" that ground the back of the disk drive >enclosure might get in the way. (This space is the same on both 3b1's and >7300's.) It can get pretty hot where I keep my 3b1 and I am loath to remove >the second fan. > >Bob Wilber Well, it seems to me that what we are taking about is the addition of a second hard disk drive to the unit. Obviously the internal power supply is going to be VERY taxed if you attempt to use that to supply the second drives power, so... It seems to me that an external power supply/case is going to be necessary for another drive, so why not mount BOTH drives externally, this will free up plenty of space and also remove quite a bit of load ftom the internal power supply. At the same time, (this ocours to me as I have both 96tpi and 48tpi floppies mounted externally, as well as the hard drive) you might consider mounting the floppy externally also. I have my hard drive external, and the floppies are mounted right next to the unit. I use an external supply for the hard drive, but rigged a MS-DOS disk power supply "y" cable for two drives on the internal supply for the (formerly) single floppy. This also frees up more space and allows a rather simple route of the cable(s) through the flexable case side... - Roger
wilber@alice.UUCP (Bob Wilber) (12/20/88)
root1@booth.UUCP (Root) writes: >Well, it seems to me that what we are taking about is the addition of a >second hard disk drive to the unit. Obviously the internal power supply is >going to be VERY taxed if you attempt to use that to supply the second >drives power, so... It seems to me that an external power supply/case is >going to be necessary for another drive, so why not mount BOTH drives >externally, this will free up plenty of space and also remove quite a >bit of load ftom the internal power supply. At the same time, (this >ocours to me as I have both 96tpi and 48tpi floppies mounted externally, >as well as the hard drive) you might consider mounting the floppy externally >also. I have my hard drive external, and the floppies are mounted right >next to the unit. I use an external supply for the hard drive, but rigged >a MS-DOS disk power supply "y" cable for two drives on the internal >supply for the (formerly) single floppy. This also frees up more space and >allows a rather simple route of the cable(s) through the flexable case >side... > > - Roger There was never any debate about the fact that a second disk would require an external power supply. Putting both disks in an external case isn't too unreasonable, although that means the case is at least 50% bigger than it would otherwise have to be (on my *very* crowded desk). What I find interesting is that so far all the responses have pointed out that it is possible to rig up a disk by some means other than what Thad Floryan suggested, (which was never in doubt) but none have pointed out anything wrong with his proposal. Those who want to mount both disks externally (so as to reduce the load on the internal power supply) will be able to do so no matter how the board for the second disk is mounted and the connections are made. There ought to be an option for those of us who want to do the minimal amount of surgery and have the smallest possible amount of external gear (and without the final result looking too sloppy). Bob Wilber