malik@delphi.DEC (Karl Malik ZK01-1/F22 1-1440) (05/21/84)
SUBJ; John Williams Deborah L. Padgett says - > John Williams is no thief!!! Making a statement such as that shows >your ignorance of his work. He is one of a very few film composers who >can increase the cohesiveness and appeal of a movie simply by writing its >score. Me (Karl Malik) I don't remember Rich's exact words, but I didn't get the impression that he was saying that Williams was stealing unaltered sections from Holst or Stravinsky. Rather that he's a style thief. With that I fully agree and will add that he's VERY GOOD at it. His music DOES enhance the films. And technically, he's also VERY GOOD. It's just that it's not very original. >The idea that Williams "steals" parts of Holst's "Mars" and Stravinsky's >"Rite of Spring" is utterly laughable; Someone (who didn't sign their name) - >There is a place in the score of the original Star Wars that is *very* >reminiscent of "The Rite of Spring". It's near the beginning, I think >it's the scene where the two droids have just started wandering about in >the desert on Tatooine (sp?). Me - Yup. I remember smiling at how blatant the 'theft' was. It's not subtle. If you know the Rite, you where Williams' inspirations came from in a few seconds. Coincidence? Not unless you assume that Williams is stupid. I don't. Someone - >I can't think of anything in the score of Star Wars that is much like >the Mars movement from the planets, unless you count the heavy use of >brass and percussion. Personally, I think it sounds much more like >Howard Hanson. Me - Well, it sure sounds like the Holst/Mars movement to me. Most of the music associated with the space battle scenes have a repeated, unison motif, which (to my ears) is highly reminiscent of the the Mars 5/4 motif. Again, not an exact theft, but in terms of style and mood there's no mistaking it, if you know Mars. All of this does not in any way invalidate Williams' contributions as a film composer. He draws his ideas from many sources. The goal is to support the film and he does this wonderfully. Well-crafted and effective it is, original it ain't. - Karl
boyajian@akov68.DEC (Jerry Boyajian) (05/22/84)
Rich Rosen asks (perhaps rhetorically) if it wasn't John Williams who composed
the music for LOST IN SPACE. Well, yes it was (he was known as "Johnny" then),
but what has that got to do with it? I was put off by that comment/question, not
because I am a LIS fan (which I blush to admit), or because I thought that the
music for LIS was terrific stuff (it was rather pedestrian, to be honest), but
because I saw a specious chain of logic in that comment. To wit:
1. LIS is, as we all know, among the lowest of the low in the land of network
television, therefore
2. Anything having to do with LIS, including the music, is not worth taking ser-
iously.
3. John Williams did the music for LIS, therefore
4. John Williams is a hack composer, who produces nothing of worth.
Frankly, I can't see how *any* of those steps, leads into the one following it.
As far as Williams' music goes, I enjoy it, mostly, though he's certainly not
perfect (I don't care for his music for RAIDERS or ET, for example). My personal
favorite is "The Superman March", which is the only music of his that one can
truly say has "stolen" from somewhere else (though it's actually a case of hom-
mage). If you listen closely to it, you can pick out the general melody from the
SUPERMAN tv show theme.
Jerry Goldsmith, however, happens to be my *favorite* film scorist, and he has
composed what is my single favorite piece of movie music: that from the opening
"Klingon" sequence in STAR TREK --- THE MOTION SICKNESS, excuse me, PICTURE :-).
There was such a wonderful feeling of savagery and impending war in that music
that just set the mood for that scene perfectly. [Incidentally, the music, plus
the direction and photography for that scene makes it my single favorite scene
from any movie whatsoever, even if as a whole, the film had a lot to be desired]
--- jayembee (Jerry Boyajian, DEC Maynard, MA)
UUCP: {decvax|ihnp4|allegra|ucbvax|...}!decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-akov68!boyajian
ARPA: boyajian%akov68.DEC@DECWRL.ARPAgrw@fortune.UUCP (Glenn Wichman) (05/24/84)
[]
"Johnny" Williams also did the incidental music
for Gilligan's Island.
The original "No cute signoff" kinda guy,
-Glenn