boreas@bucsb.bu.edu.UUCP (The Mad Tickle Monster) (12/21/86)
In article <8612091140.aa02744@SPARK.BRL.ARPA> AFRES.940AREFG-SE@GUNTER-ADAM.ARPA writes: >In response to the message sent Sun, 07 Dec 86 09:58:15 EST from XC60039%PORTLAND.BITNET@wiscvm.wisc.edu > >I've been very happy with the Sider 10 meg hard disk from First Class >Peripherals. Purchased about 18 months ago for $695 ( as I recall), I >understand there is currently a 'Christmas Special' price available??? > >I use it mostly for CP/M and it has eaten very few files! > >Pete Brown >DDN: AFRES.940AREFG-SE@Gunter-ADAM.ARPA >------- I beg to differ. Mine was given to me as a Christmas present one year, I think Xmas 1984. It arrived in mid-January (good shipping time, I must admit), and I promptly went bonkers trying to get the thing to work. First problem -- the disks supplied with it were trashed; neither of my drives would read one of them at all. Likewise for my neighbors' drives (tried in a total of three Apples, six drives -- 2 ][+ and a //e; Rana & Apple drives). The second, I finally patched up using a disk zap, reading the "bad" sectors a few dozen times, taking the "best" reads, figuring out which matched, and copying these onto another disk. So, I decided that the disks were indeed bad (:-). Called them, and got someone who didn't know what the h*ll she was talking about AT ALL; finally got it straightened out after about an HOUR on the phone. They mailed me new disks -- WITHOUT ANY PROTECTION WHATSOEVER. One of the two was crumpled beyond hope; the other was mildly damaged, enough so I didn't want to try it. . . . I did, though, on an old, worn-out drive that wouldn't work most of the time, as this was the disk that I couldn't patch up before. Finally got the disks working, and found that the controller card they shipped with it was bad. . . . And no, it was *not* the kluge'd disks. Gave up in disgust, mailed the whole thing back to them. Cost me time, shipping money (they never reimbursed me for mailing it back, about $15), lots of annoyance. The person who gave it to me bought one later, despite all of this, and was somewhat happier. He didn't have any of these experiences, but he has never gotten it to work with AppleWriter, which is mainly what he bought it for. He talked to the company, and found that it cannot be used with AW at present, for some reason or another. . . . Ended up getting a PC-AT to use as his main computer. Anyway. Basically, beware. Get specifics on the stuff before you buy it. Find out whether you can use it for your application, especially. . . . And -- DON'T BELIEVE THE SIDER PEOPLE!!!! When I went through all this, the people they had on customer service didn't know *ANYTHING*. (Mailing disks in a manila envelope, not even a sheet of cardboard to protect them?! Customer service reps that didn't even know the difference between a 5-1/4 inch floppy and a hard disk?! I'm not kidding or exaggerating, folks!). I'm surprised they're still in business. . . . Another thing -- their hard-drive had to be partitioned into separate pseudo-disks, at least for DOS3.3 (I don't know whether this is true of other hard drives for the Apple); it was annoying to me because 1) you *had* to leave some space for each type -- CP/M, DOS, Pascal, and something else (maybe ProDOS?) -- even if you weren't going to use it. 2) the Dos3.3 part had to be sub-partitioned into separate volumes. Two sizes, one normal-floppy-sized, the other was (I think) triple-size. Figuring out how to maximize DOS3.3 was a pain. . . . Note that this is just my experience. Your mileage may vary. -- Michael Justice P.S. -- Trademarks abound throughout the above. Approximations follow; I'm not about to look them up to be sure. Sider : First Class Peripherals. Apple (][+|//e) : Apple Computer, Inc. Rana : Rana Systems (??) (I meant the disk drive company). PC-AT : International Business Machines. Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with any computer companies (yet). What I describe above has been mellowed by the mists of time. Back then, I'm sure I was even more pissed off at them than now. . . . -- +--------------------------------------------------------------+ | Michael A. Justice | | BITNet: cscj0ac@bostonu CSNET: boreas%bucsb@bu-cs | | UUCP: ....!harvard!bu-cs!bucsb!boreas (boreas@bucsb.UUCP) | | ARPA: boreas@bucsb.bu.edu | | "Space: The Final Front" -- Ronald Reagan | | (well, he COULD have said it. . . .) | | "Perhaps it was a result of anxiety." -- _Mad_Max_ | +--------------------------------------------------------------+
barry@borealis.UUCP (Kenn Barry) (01/11/87)
From: boreas@bucsb.bu.edu.UUCP (The Mad Tickle Monster): >In article <8612091140.aa02744@SPARK.BRL.ARPA> AFRES.940AREFG-SE@GUNTER-ADAM.ARPA writes: >>I've been very happy with the Sider 10 meg hard disk from First Class >>Peripherals. Purchased about 18 months ago for $695 ( as I recall), I >>understand there is currently a 'Christmas Special' price available??? >>I use it mostly for CP/M and it has eaten very few files! > >I beg to differ. Mine was given to me as a Christmas present one year, >I think Xmas 1984. It arrived in mid-January (good shipping time, I must >admit), and I promptly went bonkers trying to get the thing to work. Just want to add my experiences. I've owned my Sider for about 18 months, and use it mainly for CP/M. I have never had a hardware problem with it. I nearly lost most of the disk's contents when I attempted to install their OS upgrade by just going by their documentation :-), but ended up rescuing almost all of it after talking to their tech on the phone. Overall, I am extremely pleased with their product. >[...] Called them, and got someone who didn't >know what the h*ll she was talking about AT ALL; finally got it straightened >out after about an HOUR on the phone. I thought their phone support was better than average - they actually *did* call me back as they said they would :-). I don't think the tech I talked to was a wizard, but between us we did manage to get my questions answered, and solve my problem. >The person who gave it to me bought one later, despite all of this, and >was somewhat happier. He didn't have any of these experiences, but he has >never gotten it to work with AppleWriter, which is mainly what he bought >it for. He talked to the company, and found that it cannot be used with >AW at present, for some reason or another. . . . Ended up getting a PC-AT >to use as his main computer. This is the application program's fault. Like far too much Apple software, AppleWriter is copy-protected in a way that does not allow it to be installed on a hard disk. Unless you acquire a copy that has had the protects totally removed, you're out of luck. This problem was the biggest reason that I switched from primarily using DOS 3.3 to primarily using CP/M when I got my Sider. CP/M programs are rarely protected in such an unfriendly fashion. >Another thing -- their hard-drive had to be partitioned into separate >pseudo-disks, at least for DOS3.3 The problem is DOS 3.3, not the Sider. DOS 3.3 was written to handle Apple floppy drives, not hard drives. To rewrite it extensively enough to take best advantage of a big drive would make it too different from the real thing; applications written to run under DOS 3.3 would often break. The problem is also the application programs. Even aside from copy protection, many Apple applications contain much of their own code for talking to the disks, bypassing DOS 3.3, as a way of making disk access faster, or more flexible. Such a program, even if unprotected, may require patching in order to work with a hard drive. I have had occasion to shoehorn Apple software onto both the Sider and Corvus hard drives under DOS 3.3, and found getting them to work with a Sider, was easier. They really did do a good job with the software, given the difficulties I've mentioned. DOS 3.3 is not properly modular, was not designed with the idea of adding new drivers for other drives, and this severely limits its usefulness as an OS for a hard disk. >1) you *had* to leave some space for each type -- CP/M, DOS, Pascal, and >something else (maybe ProDOS?) -- even if you weren't going to use it. The fourth OS is, indeed, ProDOS. Yes, you have to leave a little space for each, but not much, if you aren't going to use it. No big thing. Fact is, the Sider is the only hard disk for the Apple that I know of which *allows* you to use the drive with all 4 of the common Apple OS's. This was a selling-point, for me. >Note that this is just my experience. Your mileage may vary. Sorry you had such bad luck with your Sider. My experience has been much better, and I just wanted to balance the picture. Everything I have received from them (disks and hardware) was carefully packaged, and worked fine right out of the box. BTW, my only connection with 1st Class Peripherals is that of a satisfied customer. - From the Crow's Nest - Kenn Barry NASA-Ames Research Center Moffett Field, CA ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- NEW ELECTRIC AVENUE: {hplabs,seismo,dual,ihnp4}!ames!borealis!barry