[comp.sys.apple] Apple sues

SEWALL@UCONNVM.BITNET (03/30/88)

Steven Tessler
   <mahendo!jplgodo!wlbr!scgvaxd!ashtate!dbase!tessler@ELROY.JPL.NASA.GOV>
writes:
>The issue of "Look and Feel" being copyrightable has not been established
>concretely.  The Lotus suit against '123' clone 'VP Planner' by Paperback
>Software is still in litigation.

Actually, it's the Broderbond suit that's at issue here (the one Lotus
used as a precedent).  Little matter since it IS on appeal.

The text of Apple's filing was posted.  Perhaps it would be better to
read it before running on about Xerox's prior work etc.  Apple's
specific complaint is that Windows violates a specific agreement by
Microsoft regarding similarity of appearance with the Mac interface.

I'm not a lawyer, but I did see Print Master before the Broderbond
case was filed and my reaction at the time was "what a rip off" (even
though the resolution on Print Master's graphics was better and there
was an additional feature or two).  I really can't predict whether
the legal detail of my perception will be upheld on appeal.

With respect to Apple's suit; it seems the issue is somewhat
analogous to what my happen if you or I started a fast food
burger and fries place named McDougall's (spelled differently,
right?) with yellow (rather than "golden") arches and hired
Bozo the Clown (predates the competitor's symbol) to appear
in advertising.  How close Windows is to that situation (in the
eyes of a court) probably is more than an intuitive obvious
or frivolous question.

From what I've perused in the trade press (haven't had time to
read the details yet), the suit does threaten to cast the
Presentation Manager into legal limbo (perhap beyond the date
when Microsoft has it ready to release <unlikely as that seems
:-)>).  Was that part of Apple's intent?  Is the Pacific Ocean
wide?

---------------------
Disclaimer: I like my opinions better than my employer's anyway...
            (subject to change without notice; void where prohibited)

ARPA:   sewall%uconnvm.bitnet@mitvma.mit.edu       Murphy A. Sewall
BITNET: SEWALL@UCONNVM                          School of Business Admin.
UUCP:   ...ihnp4!psuvax1!UCONNVM.BITNET!SEWALL  University of Connecticut

SEWALL@UCONNVM.BITNET (04/01/88)

 "L. Brett Glass" <well!rogue@lll-lcc.llnl.GOV>
>Don't underestimate John Sculley. In order to rise to the top of a
>mature company such as Pepsi, one must almost certainly use unethical
>tactics. The same kind of tactics one might use to, say, depose Steve
>Jobs, bully DRI, or blackmail Microsoft.

Say what?  Were I a major Apple stockholder I'd have Sculley's head on
a platter if he DIDN'T file suit to protect the company's interest.
Whether Apple is correct or not is at least arguable and a matter for
a legal verdict.

If you think ordinary "hard-nosed" enterprise is "unethical" then
you haven't got all your oars in the water (doomed to a life of
going in circles and getting nowhere).

Depose Steve Jobs?  Wasn't he the fellow who took a microprocessor
with a 16Mbyte address space and put it into an unexpandable 512K
computer?  Once again, it would have been irresponsible not to
relieve Jobs of command.  He'd done his inspirational bit to launch
Apple, but the long run interest of the firm required a manager
(when jobs left Apple stock was down to $15 -- since then, it's
split 2 for 1 and is selling around 40 <a more than fivefold increase
in value>).

Blackmail Microsoft!!  Where were you when Microsoft threatened to
revoke Apple's license to use Applesoft?  Bill Gates isn't a wimp;
it's a fair contest.

If you think DRI had a tough time, go to the library and look up
the history of Lestoil (a little company that invented the first
liquid household cleaner, made the product category popular, and
was promptly buried and bankrupted by Proctor & Gamble).

Business is no place for the faint of heart.  Perhaps you'd rather
the Marine Corp ?-)

---------------------
Disclaimer: I like my opinions better than my employer's anyway...
            (subject to change without notice; void where prohibited)

ARPA:   sewall%uconnvm.bitnet@mitvma.mit.edu       Murphy A. Sewall
BITNET: SEWALL@UCONNVM                          School of Business Admin.
UUCP:   ...ihnp4!psuvax1!UCONNVM.BITNET!SEWALL  University of Connecticut

SEWALL@UCONNVM.BITNET (04/04/88)

Peter da Silva <tness7!tness1!nuchat!sugar!peter@bellcore.bellcore.COM> writes:
>Subject:      Re: BOYCOTT APPLE
>In article <1513@looking.UUCP>, brad@looking.UUCP (Brad Templeton) writes:
>> But look at other industries.  I can't publish a comic book about a man
>> who flies, is super strong and can see through walls.  It doesn't
>> matter what my character's origin is, or what the plots of the stories
>> are.  That same law might well apply in other cases.
>
>Sure you can. There are two major players in the comics game, plus a bunch
>of smaller companies...

 If memory serves (and I'm sure it does in this case since I date back
to the era in question), there once was a comic character named -
*SHAZAM <poof>* Captain Marvel.

Super powers (check), cape (check), whimppy alter ego (check), "Achilles
heel" (check - in his case he could be subdued when he hadn't yet
said SHAZAM and become super-duper).  He's not around anymore BECAUSE
DC Comics sued him out of existence for copyright violation.

It's a good analogy, I'd guess (not being a lawyer).  You can create all
manner of  super heroes, but you can't simply "clone" Superman with
only superficial differences (different color costume, different way
of "changing" from alter ego to super ego *I couldn't resist*.

In response to another comment on the subject of Apple's suit:

Apple's problem with New Wave is that it is, essentially - contractually
if I remember what I read in Apple's court filing - an implementation
of Windows 2.03 (which is really what Apple is suing about).  According
to the trade press, IBM's Presentation Manager (which only IBM and a few
beta testers whose "lips are sealed" have actually seen) is essentially
Windows 2.03.  I seem to recall reading that IBM told developers some
months ago to design to Windows specs (implying that resulting programs
would be compatible with Presentation Manager or easily transposable into
compatible code).  That's what makes Apple's suit so interesting, third
party developers don't know if, or how much or which way, Presentation
Manager may have to be altered to avoid copyright violation.  If
necessary IBM (and probably Microsoft) can pay for any alterations that
must be made.  It's not so clear to third party developers that they
can afford to invest in software that may have to be completely reworked
before it can be sold.  So, Apple not only slows down Presentation
Manager, but also the arrival of software designed to run in that
environment.

It appears that Apple wins even if the courts rule that Windows
doesn't "look and feel" like a Macintosh in the same sense that
Print Master looked and felt like Print Shop.  Meanwhile, IBM will
work on getting OS/2 and the Presentation Manager to fit into
less than 3 Mbytes so there'll be a market for it (if you think
it takes ProDOS 16 awhile to get ready to go, wait'll you try
Presentation Manager 1.0 on a 286 machine!!!).

---------------------
Disclaimer: I like my opinions better than my employer's anyway...
            (subject to change without notice; void where prohibited)

ARPA:   sewall%uconnvm.bitnet@mitvma.mit.edu       Murphy A. Sewall
BITNET: SEWALL@UCONNVM                          School of Business Admin.
UUCP:   ...ihnp4!psuvax1!UCONNVM.BITNET!SEWALL  University of Connecticut