SEWALL@UCONNVM.BITNET (Murph Sewall) (07/07/89)
>For your information, AppleWorks has, in the past, been the number one >selling program for the Apple computer. That must say something about >the program... Actually, it says a great deal more about the breadth of knowledge of Apple dealers. The primary reason for the phenomenal sales rate of AppleWorks has been that it's been sold with practically every new //e and //c (and I suppose IIgs) system since it first came out. The vast majority of Apple Computer store sales personnel aren't familiar with ANY alternative software (someone on one of Compu$erve's forums told John Sculley that Apple dealers seemed to be "former shoe salesmen," and in many instances, that's not far from the truth). >Another thing: Since Appleworks has been around for 5 years, wordperfect >has had nothing to do but sit around and learn from Appleworks mistakes AppleWorks has had the same opportunity (notice that the soon to be replaced version is number TWO). I don't use either AppleWorks or WordPerfect; my impression is that AppleWorks (especially with the addition of the various Beagle Brothers' TimeOut add-ons) is a pretty good general purpose (word processor, spreadsheet-calculator, filer) program. A better word processor (Word Perfect?), plus a better Spreadsheet (SuperCalc?), plus a better database manager (DB Master) would cost a BUNCH more in total. Arguing over software features seems to me a bit like arguing over whether a C-64 is a better buy than an Apple //e or is an Amiga a better buy than a IIgs -- that is, a futile exercise. If you gotta make the case for your favorite program, please try to stick with features (price IS a feature :-) rather than irrelevancy, such as "millions of copies sold" or "the best software ever for something you'll probably never do <write a 640 page manuscript that you'll want to spell check in one pass>." Murph Sewall Vaporware? ---> [Gary Larson returns 1/1/90] Prof. of Marketing Sewall@UConnVM.BITNET Business School sewall%uconnvm.bitnet@mitvma.mit.edu [INTERNET] U of Connecticut {psuvax1 or mcvax }!UCONNVM.BITNET!SEWALL [UUCP] (203) 486-5246 [FAX] (203) 486-2489 [PHONE] 41 49N 72 15W [ICBM] -+- I don't speak for my employer, though I frequently wish that I could (subject to change without notice; void where prohibited)
lbotez@pro-sol.cts.com (Lynda Botez) (07/09/89)
Network Comment: to #8663 by pnet01!crash!cunyvm.cuny.edu!SEWALL%UCONNVM.BITNET >... someone on one of Compuserve's forums told John Sculley that Apple >dealers seemed to be "former shoe salesmen"... Great line! Well, not really true; but I often wonder if the customers know more than the sales staff of some of these computer stores. The trouble is, most of the salesmen know very little about computers, since the majority aren't Users... And it is a very complicated industry. When I bought my Apple II GS, the salesman tried to convince me that I should buy Appleworks, since it was the program that everyone used. I couldn't quite figure out why I needed to use spreadsheets and data bases at home... so I decided against purchasing it and went for something more in the data oops word processing area and bought Roger Wagner's Mousewrite. While I am sure that Appleworks is a worthy program, especially if you're a small business owner who wants to incorporate all the features of Appleworks, it's great. However, for the average home user, I doubt it does much except for the word processing feature. I am sure half of the those "millions sold" (kind of reminiscent of a certain burger chain with golden arches) are sitting collecting dust. When you don't know much about software or computers, it's relatively easy for a saleman to convince you that it's a "must have". Sometimes when I read A+ or some of the other Apple magazines, I get the feeling that all those articles on Appleworks are written for people who are just trying to get some use out of that $250 they spent on the program in the first place! -:) Lynda
lhaider@pro-sol.cts.com (Lawrence Haider) (07/11/89)
Network Comment: to #8710 by pnet01!crash!pro-sol.cts.com!lbotez
Lynda, you seem so negative about AppleWorks! No it is not the do all, end
all program; but, it is a very nice, slightly overpriced, product (what did ya
expect when it was originally marketed by Apple?). If you can get a copy to
try for a few days (especially with TimeOut enhancements) I think you might
find yourself likeing it (no I don't condone pirating, but trying it is how I
decided to purchase AppleWorks). What makes the program very nice to have is
that it is very widely supported; by user groups, companies (like Beagle
Bros.), and those 1 million users. If you can get it at the special offer
price of $99 (I think), then _I_ feel its worth it. To quote a cliche...
"Don't knock it 'till you try it"
Laermmunz@pro-sol.cts.com (Mark Munz) (07/11/89)
Network Comment: to #8710 by pnet01!crash!pro-sol.cts.com!lbotez There are all kinds of uses for the database & spreadsheet module. One nice one is being able to make up a table to put in your document. Just set it up in the Spreadsheet and then print it to the clipboard. With the new AW3.0, the integration is even tighter.. people always claim they have no use for a particular program / module until they have it available to them. Then it's Mail Merging, Table making, and more..
mmunz@pro-sol.cts.com (Mark Munz) (07/12/89)
Network Comment: to #8745 by pnet01!crash!pro-sol.cts.com!lhaider > Lynda, you seem so negative about AppleWorks! No it is not the do all, end > all program; but, it is a very nice, slightly overpriced, product (what > did ya expect when it was originally marketed by Apple?). If you can > get a copy to try for a few days (especially with TimeOut enhancements) > I think you might find yourself likeing it (no I don't condone pirating, > but trying it is how I decided to purchase AppleWorks). What makes the > program very nice to have is that it is very widely supported; by user > groups, companies (like Beagle Bros.), and those 1 million users. If > you can get it at the special offer price of $99 (I think), then _I_ > > feel its worth it. To quote a cliche... > "Don't knock it 'till you try it" Since Claris is not raising the price of AW3.0, I think folks will finally be getting their money's worth out of a plain jane AppleWorks. And 3rd party support (TimeOut) is important because it means you can add to AppleWorks, but only with the pieces you need. Of course, working for Beagle Bros may make the above a slightly biased comment, but I was told yesterday that it would be really neat if there was 3rd party support for MicroSoft Works on the Mac and IBM...
prl3546@tahoma.UUCP (Philip R. Lindberg) (07/13/89)
From article <8907090416.AA19639@crash.cts.com>, by lbotez@pro-sol.cts.com (Lynda Botez): > > When I bought my Apple II GS, the salesman tried to convince me that I should > buy Appleworks, since it was the program that everyone used. I couldn't quite > figure out why I needed to use spreadsheets and data bases at home... so I > decided against purchasing it and went for something more in the data > oops word processing area and bought Roger Wagner's Mousewrite. > When I bought my first Apple I opted against AppleWorks. I figured I "didn't need" it, so I got BankStreet Writer. After struggling along for months I was at a friend's house and watched him breeze through a letter with AppleWorks (and Pinpoint). I went out and bought it the next day. Since then I have put all my addresses and Compact Disks into the database, I do all our church's financial statements in the spreadsheet and am continually finding more ways to use it. Without ingenuity, AppleWorks is nothing but a word processor. > > Sometimes when I read A+ or some of the other Apple magazines, I get the > feeling that all those articles on Appleworks are written for people who are > just trying to get some use out of that $250 they spent on the program in the > first place! -:) > > Lynda I have a 8 1/2" by 11" catalog 3/4in. thick which lists nothing by templates for the database and spreadsheet programs in AppleWorks. Its really amazing what you can do with AppleWorks is you think about it. 8-) Phil +---------------------------------------------------------+ | The Apple //'s will live forever!! | | Phil Lindberg snail mail: 13845 S.E. 131 ST | | INET: prl3546@tahoma.UUCP Renton, WA 98056 | | UUCP: ..!uw-beaver!ssc-vax!shuksan!tahoma!prl3546 | +---------------------------------------------------------+
SEWALL@UCONNVM.BITNET (Murph Sewall) (07/16/89)
>most of the salesmen know very little about computers, since the majority >aren't Users... And it is a very complicated industry. Quite a few customers DO know a lot more about what they're buying than the salesperson does, but MOST do not (otherwise MANY of those copies of AppleWorks wouldn't have been sold at the same time as the computer). Most of the Apple sales people I've met DO use the computers, for correspondence, customer record keeping, and the like. They seem to be pretty typical of many household users, *but* they are not very sophisticated users (they usually haven't given any thought to producing a manuscript with footnotes, for instance). In my experience few computer store sales personnel have ever used a modem (they barely have an idea what a modem is for). When I firt bought a //c it took me nearly a month to get a cable to connect the //c to a Hayes Smartmodem. Even though the dealership had a Robotics in inventory, they didn't seem to understand that the cable for an Apple Personal modem wasn't universally applicable (I finally got the cable from a retailer specializing in printers). >When I bought my Apple II GS, the salesman tried to convince me that I should >buy Appleworks, since it was the program that everyone used. I couldn't quite Circular logic :-) Everyone used it because it was the only program most salesmen knew how to sell! While there may be some value to the idea that so many people wouldn't use it if it didn't have some value, it's outright lazy of salespeople to assume that everyone's needs are so similar that they can be satisfied with the same software. >figure out why I needed to use spreadsheets and data bases at home... so I Some pretty reasonable uses for both occur at income tax time :-). I use a simple flat filer to keep track of a number of tax deductible items during the year, so when I start doing my taxes I'm not confronted with a mound of odd sizes of scraps of paper and reciepts to try and categorize and summarize. I've been keeping my auto maintenance records with a flat filer for some years. It's very helpful being able to quickly tell how long it's been since I had the oil changed or how many miles I (really) got on the last set of tires (do I want to buy the same brand again? My conclusion, by the way, is that Michelins *really* are worth the premium price and all the rest are 'hokem'). Murph Sewall Vaporware? ---> [Gary Larson returns 1/1/90] Prof. of Marketing Sewall@UConnVM.BITNET Business School sewall%uconnvm.bitnet@mitvma.mit.edu [INTERNET] U of Connecticut {psuvax1 or mcvax }!UCONNVM.BITNET!SEWALL [UUCP] (203) 486-5246 [FAX] (203) 486-2489 [PHONE] 41 49N 72 15W [ICBM] -+- I don't speak for my employer, though I frequently wish that I could (subject to change without notice; void where prohibited)