brianw@microsoft.UUCP (Brian Willoughby) (11/18/89)
OK,
I've got a few frightening questions about the Video Overlay Card. I
understand that the VOC plugs into a standard 8 bit slot and is
functional on the IIgs AND the //e. I also understand that it converts
the Apple II video so that it is compatible with the NTSC standard. What
I would like to know is: does this mean that the VOC will add Super HiRes
graphics to the //e?
The reason I ask is because there are no Video-specific signals on the 8
bit slot connectors (except possibly slot 7) that would allow the VOC to
communicate with the existing Apple II video circuitry. I know for a
fact that the GenLock function of the VOC requires the computer to
synchronize with the external video. For example, if a VCR is currently
scanning the lower right corner of the video screen and then starts
vertical blanking, then the Apple II must also synchronize by displaying
the same area of the screen and then entering VBlank. Well, as I see it,
there is no way for a card in a standard slot to 'reach into the Apple II
innards' and force the video to re-sync. Therefore the Video Overlay
Card must COMPLETELY DUPLICATE the Apple video modes so that total
control over synchronization is possible. I've looked at the picture of
the VOC in the Apple flyer, and there appears to be enough DRAM memory to
support SHR. Since all the video circuitry of a IIgs appears to be
duplicated, is there any way to activate SHR graphics on the //e?
P.S. Will the Video Overlay Card work in a II Plus?
I could be mistaken, but I thought that the VOC did NOT use the aux slot.
Brian Willoughby
UUCP: ...!{tikal, sun, uunet, elwood}!microsoft!brianw
InterNet: microsoft!brianw@uunet.UU.NET
or: microsoft!brianw@Sun.COM
Bitnet brianw@microsoft.UUCPmattd@Apple.COM (Matt Deatherage) (11/19/89)
brianw@microsoft.UUCP (Brian Willoughby) writes: > >I've got a few frightening questions about the Video Overlay Card. I >understand that the VOC plugs into a standard 8 bit slot and is >functional on the IIgs AND the //e. I also understand that it converts >the Apple II video so that it is compatible with the NTSC standard. What >I would like to know is: does this mean that the VOC will add Super HiRes >graphics to the //e? > [lots of boring hardware stuff deleted :)] Yes. The card, as you guess, does have its own VGC chip and can deliver Super Hi-Res graphics to a IIe. I've seen it done. It can also deliver 640 X 400 graphics on a IIgs (using bank $E0 as well as $E1, kind of like double hi-res). However, since the $E0 memory has the main handle table in the middle of it (which can't move), this is not too useful at present. >P.S. Will the Video Overlay Card work in a II Plus? >I could be mistaken, but I thought that the VOC did NOT use the aux slot. > >Brian Willoughby Dunno. The VOC is not *supported* in a II+, I know that much. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Matt Deatherage, Apple Computer, Inc. | "The opinions expressed in this tome Send PERSONAL mail ONLY (please) to: | should not be construed to imply that Amer. Online: Matt DTS | Apple Computer, Inc., or any of its ThisNet: mattd@apple.com | subsidiaries, in whole or in part, ThatNet: (stuff)!ames!apple!mattd | have any opinion on any subject." Other mail by request only, please. | "So there." -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
rnf@shumv1.uucp (Rick Fincher) (11/19/89)
In article <36617@apple.Apple.COM> mattd@Apple.COM (Matt Deatherage) writes: >Super Hi-Res graphics to a IIe. I've seen it done. It can also deliver >640 X 400 graphics on a IIgs (using bank $E0 as well as $E1, kind of like >double hi-res). However, since the $E0 memory has the main handle table >in the middle of it (which can't move), this is not too useful at present. Hmmm... Is this in interlaced mode or does the clock rate get increased? This is very interesting. Are the scan lines alternated, one from $E0, one from $E1 or are they displayed 200 from $E0, 200 from $E1? Rick Fincher rnf@shumv1.ncsu.edu
UD041948@VM1.NODAK.EDU (Joe Carlin) (11/19/89)
The VOC has 640 x 400 graphics on a IIGS? I was not aware of that. I heard of a graphic board that was supposed to be announced at the last AppleFest. Does anyone know anything about this? Joe
cbdougla@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu (Collin Broadrick Douglas) (11/19/89)
In article <36617@apple.Apple.COM> mattd@Apple.COM (Matt Deatherage) writes: >Matt Deatherage writes: >Yes. The card, as you guess, does have its own VGC chip and can deliver >Super Hi-Res graphics to a IIe. I've seen it done. It can also deliver >640 X 400 graphics on a IIgs (using bank $E0 as well as $E1, kind of like >double hi-res). However, since the $E0 memory has the main handle table >in the middle of it (which can't move), this is not too useful at present. >Send PERSONAL mail ONLY (please) to: | should not be construed to imply that >Amer. Online: Matt DTS | Apple Computer, Inc., or any of its >ThisNet: mattd@apple.com | subsidiaries, in whole or in part, >ThatNet: (stuff)!ames!apple!mattd | have any opinion on any subject." >Other mail by request only, please. | "So there." >----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Could you go into more detail about the 640 X 400 capabilities of the VOC? That is very interesting. Collin Douglas cbdougla@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu
lbotez@pnet02.gryphon.com (Lynda Botez) (11/20/89)
Matt Deatherage writes: >It can also deliver [the Apple Overlay Card] 640 X 400 graphics on a >IIgs (using bank $E0 and well as $E1, kinda like double high res). While the Apple Overlay Card is great for schools who wish to utilize its video capabilities and whatever, the card doesn't seem to be that useful for the home user. One of those things that would be nice, but not necessary (sort of like a Macintosh... heh heh). However, while I'm not engineering wiz, or even understand most of this graphics stuff, it would seem to me that this 640 x400 graphics capability is somewhat like what we've all been clamoring for as far as upgrading the Apple IIGS into a somewhat more respectable machine. I would imagine with a little Apple innovation, we could incorporate the basic idea of the 640 x 400 graphics into the current motherboard, via a card, or a motherboard upgrade. I keep hearing the word "blither"... Lynda UUCP: {ames!elroy, <routing site>}!gryphon!pnet02!lbotez INET: lbotez@pnet02.gryphon.com
mattd@Apple.COM (Matt Deatherage) (11/21/89)
In article <1989Nov19.061014.10847@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu> cbdougla@uokmax.UUCP (Collin Broadrick Douglas) writes: > > Could you go into more detail about the 640 X 400 capabilities of the VOC? > That is very interesting. > > Collin Douglas > > cbdougla@uokmax.ecn.uoknor.edu No. I don't know any more. :) I think we are going to (or at least should) make a Technical Note out of it, though. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Matt Deatherage, Apple Computer, Inc. | "The opinions expressed in this tome Send PERSONAL mail ONLY (please) to: | should not be construed to imply that Amer. Online: Matt DTS | Apple Computer, Inc., or any of its ThisNet: mattd@apple.com | subsidiaries, in whole or in part, ThatNet: (stuff)!ames!apple!mattd | have any opinion on any subject." Other mail by request only, please. | "So there." -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
pa1017@sdcc13.ucsd.edu (Nick Lenz) (11/21/89)
Actually, the video chips and MEGA II on the VOC seem to me like
they would be more at home on a GS motherboard rather than a card.
Maybe Apple is planning on using the technology from the VOC
(providing 640x400) on the next GS. Or maybe they took the
technology from some yet to be released GS and put the chips on the
VOC. Who knows... it's just a hunch. :)
Nick Lenz "How would you feel about life if Death was
your older sister?" -- _Sandman_ #11
Internet: nlenz@ucsd.edu
or
pa1017@sdcc13.ucsd.edurbannon@cosmos.acs.calpoly.edu (Roy Bannon) (11/21/89)
Okay folks, I guess I'll throw my two cents in. I have a VOC and I made the silly thing do 640x400. The bad news first. As Matt said, the odd(or is it even) scan lines are right on top of the memory managers unmovable handles. So when you make the toolcalls to enable 640x400, it displays the handles on the odd (or even) scan lines. Ok you say, replace the handles with the picture. Right you are, but then if you use any tools or gs/os with your picture there instead of the handles, yep you guessed it, system crash. So all the program I wrote did was load the picture, make the appropriate tool calls, move the pict into memory (by hand not using mem manager) wait a while, move the handles back. Since the video was interlaced, the image shook a little bit. For digitized pictures without sharp edges, this wasn't all that bad. For computer images with sharp lines, it wasn't all that great. Why they did it in the first place if it can't be used in the presence of anything that uses the memory manager. It's my understanding thats it's very easy too do in hardware, so why not. The card has to generate interlace video, so on the odd frames, why not switch banks an display new data. This gives the 400 vert lines. My idea is for apple to write a new memory manager. Does anyone except the memory manager need to know the abs location of the handels. The only ones I can think of are the utility programs that give info about all handles allocated and such. So why can't the move them somewhere else. Atleast the 400 lines could the be used a little bit. If there is any interest about the program for 400 line resolution, send me email. Roy rbannon@cosmos.acs.calpoly.edu
sb@pro-generic.cts.COM (Stephen Brown) (11/24/89)
In-Reply-To: message from mattd@apple.com Is the VGC chip on the Video Overlay card similar to the the VGC chip in the IIgs? Similar enough to give my IIgs 640x400? Also, the 640x400 that was referred to as *possible* on the Video Overlay card (but "not too useful at present")... Is this interlaced? <Doesn't it HAVE to be?> UUCP: crash!pro-generic!sb ARPA: crash!pro-generic!sb@nosc.mil INET: sb@pro-generic.cts.com
saa33413@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (11/28/89)
From mattd@Apple.COM: vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv Yes. The card, as you guess, does have its own VGC chip and can deliver Super Hi-Res graphics to a IIe. I've seen it done. It can also deliver... ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Super Hi-Res on a IIe. That's an interesting thought. Where does the memory come from? Throw in a 65816 coprocessor and a stereo board, and who needs a GS? :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ! Scott Alfter ! Go ! McCoy: ...they don't exactly like you. ! ! alftersoft@uiuc.edu ! Illini ! Kirk: I know, Bones. The feeling's mutual. ! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------