jon@cisunx.UUCP (Jon M Pearsall) (10/28/88)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------- So, whatever happened to comp.binaries.apple2? Or, for that matter, how 'bout APPLE2-L@BROWNVM? Doesn't anyone have any more public domain software? And from reading this newsgroup lately: Does anyone out there still own a //e and not a GS? Or am I all alone now? That 'u' button looks better and better every day. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Jon M. Pearsall, University of Pittsburgh =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= = UUCP: !pitt!cisunx!jon As the Zorg closes in, Spaceman = = Internet: jon@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu Spiff cooly draws his death ray = = Bitnet: JON@PITTVMS blaster. -- Calvin = =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
cuthbert@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Robert Cuthbertson) (11/01/88)
In article <13387@cisunx.UUCP> jon@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu (Jon M Pearsall) writes: >-------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >And from reading this newsgroup lately: Does anyone out there still own >a //e and not a GS? Or am I all alone now? That 'u' button looks >better and better every day. > > > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Jon M. Pearsall, University of Pittsburgh =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= I have to agree! I really would rather not miss out on the //+, //e and //c stuff, but I have no particular interest in the ins and outs of GS/OS, etc. Anyone for the creation of comp.sys.apple.gs? I sure am. --Rob Cuthbertson +----- / -----+ ! The Real Me : ..!{ncar.nbires}!boulder!tramp!cuthbert / "Did I know Jesus? ! ! (or, for you weenies) : cuthbert@tramp.Colorado.EDU / Man, I _was_ Jesus!"! +----- / -----+
rupp@cod.NOSC.MIL (William L. Rupp) (11/01/88)
In article <4388@boulder.Colorado.EDU> cuthbert@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Robert Cuthbertson) writes: >In article <13387@cisunx.UUCP> jon@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu (Jon M Pearsall) writes: >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>And from reading this newsgroup lately: Does anyone out there still own >>a //e and not a GS? Or am I all alone now? That 'u' button looks >>better and better every day. >> >> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Jon M. Pearsall, University of Pittsburgh =-=-=-=-=-=-= > >I have to agree! I really would rather not miss out on the //+, //e and //c >stuff, but I have no particular interest in the ins and outs of GS/OS, etc. > >Anyone for the creation of comp.sys.apple.gs? I sure am. > >--Rob Cuthbertson > This is interesting, and (he says without the slightest trace of humillity or shame) not at all surprising. The GS, operating in its native mode rather than as an over-priced Apple //e, is a separate, distinct computer. As one who is primarily interested in the GS side, I routinely ignore the 8-bit stuff. It boils down to this, I think; the Apple IIGS is really not an Apple II, it's just a different computer that can, for marketablility reasons, pretend its an Apple //e. The memory configuration is different, the graphics are different, the sound capability is different, and the OS is different. I suspect a separate GS newgroup would be a good idea. Bill --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ...who, as always, speaks for himself only...... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
pmwenzel@tybalt.caltech.edu (Peter M. Wenzel) (11/01/88)
In article <1287@cod.NOSC.MIL> rupp@cod.nosc.mil.UUCP (William L. Rupp) writes: > >I suspect a separate GS newgroup would be a good idea. > >Bill >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- >...who, as always, speaks for himself only...... >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- Include my vote, if anyone's keeping track. __________________________________________________________________________ ___ || __/ \ _ || Pete Wenzel / _ \_/ \__^__/\_/-\ || Mail Code 1-60 | | | ---PMWenzel----> || California Institute of Technology | |_| ==============/ || Pasadena, CA 91126 \__ / @CITRomeo.Bitnet || (818) 577-9005 \___/ @Juliet.Caltech.Edu || --------------------------------------------------------------------------
abc@BRL.MIL (Brint Cooper) (11/01/88)
Before everyone jumps on the "create a comp.sys.apple.gs" bandwagon, be advised that the Internet mailing list, info-apple@brl.mil, is an essential part of the apple information exchange and is gatewayed bidirectionally to comp.sys.apple. I am not at all interested in maintaining two Internet mailing lists. Further, it wouldn't be surprising that to see the GS survive as the only Apple II product sometime soon. _Brint
ALBRO@NIEHS.BITNET (11/02/88)
There seems to be some pressure to form separate IIgs and II<gs news groups. Since I use both a IIgs and three IIe's regularly, and since the IIgs gets used for both 8- and 16- applications, and since I doubt if I am unique here, I would much rather not see a split. However, it is sad to see users ashamed to ask IIe questions or offer IIe tips!
gallo@fstvax.dec.com (Cool for Cats) (11/02/88)
I too am a little disappointed with the newsgroup going mostly //gs.I favor a gs specific group also. Side Note: Anybody out there using Aztec C on the //? I do and would like to know who else uses it.Maybe we could share ideas and solutions for programming C on the //. Tom Gallo | (UUCP) {decvax, ucbvax, allegra}!decwrl!fstvax.dec.com!gallo | | (ARPA) gallo%fstvax.DEC@decwrl.ARPA | | (BITNET) gallo@fstvax.dec.com | |Disclaimer: *** Opinions expressed here are my own *** | | *** Not those of my employer. *** |
halp@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu ("Bruce P. Halpern") (11/02/88)
RE: SEPARATE GROUPS FOR //gs AND FOR THE //e & //c SET I vote yes. I'm part of the //e & //c components, and generally skip without reading anything that's obviously //gs. ****DISCLAMER: My comments, etc., are my own shakey opinions ******** | Bruce P. Halpern Psychology & Neurobiology & Behavior Cornell Ithaca | | INTERNET:halp@tcgould.tn.cornell.edu BITNET:D57J@CORNELLA D57J@CRNLVAX5| | UUCP:{vax135,rochester,decvax}!cornell!batcomputer!halp | | PHONE: 607-255-6433 Uris Hall, Cornell U., Ithaca, NY 14853-7601 | dp
jm7e+@ANDREW.CMU.EDU ("Jeremy G. Mereness") (11/03/88)
I believe a separate newsgroup would be a bad idea. First off, one reason people talk so much about the GS is because most of the software and the OS is so new that it has a great deal fo problems and needs discussion. 8-bit mode is nice and reliable. There is not enough emphasis on developing 8-bit mode. The GS is the supreme //e, but its 16bit OS is slow and tedious, as well as its interface. Finally, the rumors and similarities between the GS and the Mac seem to be pointing toward the "Macification" of the // line (see the Golden Gate rumors). Apple is trying to sell the GS as a Mac and make it look like a Mac. It can still be played with like our old reliable 8-bit hobby machines (which started this whole damned industry, and still have a lot to offer), but Apple doesn't recognize us as a "market." I'm afraid a gs-specific internet board may be short-lived unless Apple makes some serious policy changes. Capt. Albatross jm7e+@andrew.cmu.edu ============ Bureuacracy takes all the fun out of computing. disclaimer: The opinions expressed herein are made under duress of academic stress and is often prone to overzealous error. The author, not enjoying the prospect of remaining eternally ignorant, therefore welcomes any replies that would further that end.
c60c-3aw@web-2c.berkeley.edu (Andy McFadden) (11/03/88)
It would be neat if there were some quick & easy way to screen out GS articles for those who don't want them (e.g. "GS" in the title). Since most GS owners are probably interested in the //ec+ discussions, the creation of a new group would be primarily for the covnenience of //ec+ owners. I find it interesting that 90% of the non-GS articles the past two days are from people wanting to split into two groups... there really hasn't been that much traffic for standard IIs. If the //gs weren't so painful to use in native mode, the traffic for //ec+ would probably be close to zero. APDA is dead!?! The first time I wrote to Apple for technical info (a while back...) it took them two months to figure out what I wanted, and they didn't get it quite right. The next time was a little better, but they were still a bit confused... This was 2-3 years ago, so hopefully they've improved some. Sometimes the //gs reminds me of the PC Jr. Less powerful than a Mac, but still trying to be one. There were rumors that the "chicklet" keyboard was an attempt to keep the lower-priced Jr. out of the office; it wound up hurting it badly. 65816 anyone? :-) -- fadden@zen.berkeley.edu [crashed] c60c-3aw@widow.berkeley.edu (Andy McFadden) "Yes, those are my opinions. Believe it or not."
rupp@cod.NOSC.MIL (William L. Rupp) (11/04/88)
In article <EXPnWcy00V48M6m2Fn@andrew.cmu.edu> jm7e+@ANDREW.CMU.EDU ("Jeremy G. Mereness") writes: >There is not enough emphasis on developing 8-bit mode. The GS is the supreme ====================== >//e, but its ..... === Wrong. The GS is no more a //e than a //e. It puzzles me why some people have trouble understanding that. The Apple IIGS is a distinct machine, more like the Macintosh than the //e, but with the capability of running //e software for marketing reasons. The GS has its strengths and weaknesses, as have been pointed out in this newgroup by a number of posters. But an Apple II it is not, any more than a Commodore 128 is a Commodore 64 just because it can run C-64 software. I guess my reasoning amounts to a case in favor of creating a separate IIGS newsgroup. //e, //c and ][+ owners have little to learn from discussions of hardware and software (e.g., GS/OS) that their machines don't support. Any more than a //e owner can learn from a discussion of MS-DOS or UNIX, which is not much unless the //e owner also uses a clone or a UNIX box. On the other hand, IIGS users can read the comp.sys.apple group if they want to keep up on what is going on in the 8-bit field. Actually, I am emotionally neutral of this issue of unified vs. separate newgroups. But based on its relation to the traditonal Apple II line (minimal and reluctant), the IIGS merits it's own group. Speaking of the Apple II line, I guess what I am saying is that the IIGS marks the end of that line, since its enchancements were not added onto the //e capabilities but appeared instead in the form of a different system. It's the first Apple II that does not run earlier Apple II software in its native (i.e., 16 bit) mode. Bill ------------------------------------------------------------------ As usual, these thoughts represent my opinion only. ------------------------------------------------------------------
HEACOCK@KUHUB.CC.UKANS.EDU (Doug Heacock) (11/04/88)
I am a //e owner with no plans to upgrade to a //GS (I've got my sights set on a Mac)--I like the idea of a separate GS group. Will the non-GS users among us be able to keep the old group going? Doug Heacock : Bitnet: HEACOCK@UKANVAX Academic Computing Services : Internet: HEACOCK@KUHUB.CC.UKANS.EDU The University of Kansas : Lawrence, Kansas :
daveharv@pro-novapple.UUCP (Dave Harvey) (11/05/88)
Although I'm an Apple IIGS owner and have been for a while, I myself wouldn't like the idea of a seperate newsgroup just for GS stuff. There are still lots of subjects that apply to both computers and it would really be a pain to have to now check two newsgroups to find out the latest info. Many add-ons to both computers are the same, such as hard disks, monitors, disk drives, etc. Besides, most discussions on software for the Apple II also apply to the GS. As someone recently commented, there's not too much GS specific software around. You can count them on your fingers and toes. proline: pro-novapple!daveharv uucp: crash!pro-novapple!daveharv arpa: crash!pro-novapple!daveharv@nosc.mil Internet: daveharv@pro-novapple.cts.com Northern Virginia Apple Users Group >pro-novapple< 703-671-0416/300-2400 baud
jon@cisunx.UUCP (Jon M Pearsall) (11/08/88)
In article <8811020503.aa13715@SMOKE.BRL.MIL> ALBRO@NIEHS.BITNET writes: >There seems to be some pressure to form separate IIgs and II<gs news >groups...... > ......I would much rather not see a split. However, it >is sad to see users ashamed to ask IIe questions or offer IIe tips! ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Yes! That's the problem! =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Jon M. Pearsall, University of Pittsburgh =-=-=-=-=-=-=-= = UUCP: !pitt!cisunx!jon As the Zorg closes in, Spaceman = = Internet: jon@unix.cis.pittsburgh.edu Spiff cooly draws his death ray = = Bitnet: JON@PITTVMS blaster. -- Calvin = =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
ulmo@ssyx.ucsc.edu (scritzifchisted ulmo qzutvchsxik) (11/08/88)
In article <4388@boulder.Colorado.EDU> cuthbert@tramp.Colorado.EDU (Robert Cuthbertson) writes: >I have to agree! I really would rather not miss out on the //+, //e and //c >stuff, but I have no particular interest in the ins and outs of GS/OS, etc. > >Anyone for the creation of comp.sys.apple.gs? I sure am. Me! Me! (After one month of using rn, today I just decided to learn how to use Kill ... and I'm pissed. I >still< saw a GS subject after deleting the first line and re-entering!) (i have no affiliation, so ignore any implied organization.)
meb4074@cec1.wustl.edu (Mark Edward Bradley) (02/06/90)
In article <1500@husc6.harvard.edu> ehsu@husc7.UUCP (Eric Hsu) writes: >but let's not get so uppity. Some twenty-year-olds (me !) like games too. >In fact a fair number of CS majors (I'm not one) that I know grew up on IIs. >They first played games on the Apple II and then began hacking out programs >on the II, then emerging into full CS-dom in college. I wonder if the same >sort of cycle is happening on the Amiga machines? I dunno. > Now that I've digressed, I'm remembering a little of the fun and >comraderie of me and my friends programming little Applesoft games, trying >to top each other. To me, that's what personal computing's all about. I kind >of miss that now. Maybe it's because I'm at college now, but I don't see much >of that any more. Does it still happen? That is, are there any non-serious >programmers out there? > > Nostalgically, > > Eric Hsu > ehsu@husc4.UUCP > ehsu@husc4.Bitnet >Eric Hsu ehsu@husc4.Bitnet, ehsu@husc4.UUCP I'm a twenty-year-old that followed exactly that path into the world of computers (God, I sound like a Nintendo commercial) My first computer was a ][+ when I was in 7th grade. Before a year had passed, I had filled up about a hundred disks with Applesoft programs, most of them games. When my games got too complex for Applesoft (which wasn't too high a degree of complexity), I learned 6502 assembly. Ah, good old 16 bit addressing and 1 MHz speed!! So here I am in college, a CS major, with my ][ and my program collection in my room. It doesn't get much use now, my girlfriend will play Shanghai on it or I will use this Applesoft compiler I found recently to speed up some of my more cumbersome old games and laugh at the results. But I couldn't bear to part with it, (snif) because sometimes I'll pull out Castle Wolfenstein or Ultima and relive those days of yore.... -- Mark Bradley "Don't cry for lost souls -- you might drown." meb4074@cec2.wustl.edu
dtroup@carroll1.cc.edu (David C. Troup) (02/07/90)
In article <1990Feb6.120746.22035@cec1.wustl.edu> meb4074@cec2.UUCP (Mark Edward Bradley) writes: >I am in college, a CS major, with my ][ and my program collection in my room. >It doesn't get much use now, my girlfriend will play Shanghai on it or I will >use this Applesoft compiler I found recently to speed up some of my more >cumbersome old games and laugh at the results. But I couldn't bear to part with >it, (snif) because sometimes I'll pull out Castle Wolfenstein or Ultima and >relive those days of yore.... I know what you mean. Got a IIe when they came out, began hacking wares 'cause I couldnt afford any. Early "Cheap-O-Writer" and other wares became some of my most customized software that I used. When I started into the commercial software, I couldnt stand having someone elses wares on MY machine! I allways knoew what lines of code were being executed when mine ran, but now I've got this protected ware doing god-knows-what on my system! Hell, I still code my old Sinclair ZX81 that I got when I was 12! Just for old times sake... Now I'm 21, an Artificial Intelligence major, Ive got my GS, IIe and a donated II+ in my room (Also, my Toshiba t1000 for portable hacks), and I'm looking at a 86000 based machine (ie Amiga). But nothing could make me sell my IIgs. I'll add the Transwarp GS, and other goodies. It's a geat hacking machine...bar none. From display hacks to visual imaging software (for the robot) to life/core wars. I LOVE the apple II line, and Ive got ALOT of time (not to mention $$) invested in it. With all of these machines around, how can the fun die? We just gotta spend the hour or so playing with monitor, or writing small hacks that are FUN. I'd be interested in getting together with other Apple Hackers out there for some personal hack trading, and ideas too! If you missed my sound routine hack a while back (thanks to Cheshire Cat!), let me know and I'll zip it off to ya. later, -- David C. Troup ! SkunkWorks ! 2600 hz |"Im going to work at an office dtroup@carroll1.cc.edu | that has no phone, and 414-524-6809(dorm)7343(work) | returning home with sandy The Surf Rat - DC 12 on Neil Pryde and Seatrend | feet."