mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.ARPA (Mike Khaw) (11/15/88)
In article <8414@alice.UUCP> bs@alice.UUCP (Bjarne Stroustrup) writes: >its environment and libraries. I am in particular looking forward to >trying ParcPlace's Cynegy C++ program development environment. It has ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ What's the scoop on this? Does in run *under* PS Smalltalk-80, or as a separate standalone system? Is it selling or still under development? Mike Khaw -- internet: mkhaw@teknowledge.arpa uucp: {uunet|sun|ucbvax|decwrl|ames|hplabs}!mkhaw%teknowledge.arpa hardcopy: Teknowledge Inc, 1850 Embarcadero Rd, POB 10119, Palo Alto, CA 94303
david@beowulf.JPL.NASA.GOV (David Smyth) (11/15/88)
mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.UUCP (Mike Khaw) writes: >bs@alice.UUCP (Bjarne Stroustrup) writes: >>its environment and libraries. I am in particular looking forward to >>trying ParcPlace's Cynegy C++ program development environment. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >What's the scoop on this? Does in run *under* PS Smalltalk-80, or as >a separate standalone system? Is it selling or still under development? Talk to Steve Lavine @ (800) 822-7880. Friday he told me: It does run under ST80 on Suns under SunView, it is under development, alpha test in December, Beta in Jan, ship in mid 2nd Qtr '89. Currently it uses cfront, provides ST80 environment and tools for C++ development: editor, browser, "incremental linking", "incremental compilation" <- I don't quite know what they really mean by this: and automatic dependency "control", again, I'm not sure from the one page blurb they handed out at OOPSLA'88. Sounds interesting, were may be an alpha site, probably a beta site, and I'm sure we will buy some licenses here at JPL. disclaimer: I don't have any vested interest in ParcPlace systems, and I'm not yet a customer: might be someday, tho'
jonathan@pitt.UUCP (Jonathan S. Eunice) (11/19/88)
Mike Khaw (mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.UUCP) asks, "What's the scoop on
ParcPlace's Cynergy C++ program development environment?" I asked
ParcPlace essentially the same question. The answer went something
like this: It's a program development environment adding some of the
nice Smalltalk-80 development tools (browsing, cross-referencing,
dynamic linking, incremental compilation) to conventional languages
like C and C++.
I'm not certain what Carlos Carrion (carlos@beowulf.JPL.NASA.GOV) meant
when he answered that "Cynergy ... is basically the Smalltalk-80
environment pushed onto C++." But read on...
Cynergy IS NOT, as I and perhaps others have thought, an environment
whereby software is developed in Smalltalk-80, then ported for delivery
in C or C++. For that, look to ET++ or Stepstone's Objective-C and
Producer combination. Cynergy IS, if you will pardon the expression, a
CASE tool. It manages and supports the development process, not
unlike the current combination of UNIX tools.
That Cynergy is not a prototype-in-Smalltalk-then-deploy-in-C++ tool
brings up another question. Namely, why not? Such a thing would seem
more valuable, leveraging the benefits of both languages. Why does
ParcPlace choose to compete with what will eventually be tens of other
companies in an area where its incremental value will likely be
limited? Why sell to a market that will not easily be swayed from
current tools and approaches? Yeah, it leaves me wondering, too.
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Jonathan S. Eunice ARPA: jonathan@vax.cs.pittsburgh.edu
University of Pittsburgh UUCP: jonathan@pitt
Computer Science BITNET: jonathan@pittvms
(412) 624-1368psrc@poseidon.ATT.COM (Paul S. R. Chisholm) (11/23/88)
<"He seemed like such a nice man . . . and then he turned out to be a writer!"> In article <4271@pitt.UUCP>, jonathan@pitt.UUCP (Jonathan S. Eunice) writes: > Mike Khaw (mkhaw@teknowledge-vaxc.UUCP) asks, "What's the scoop on > ParcPlace's Cynergy C++ program development environment?" I asked > ParcPlace essentially the same question. The answer went something > like this: It's a program development environment adding some of the > nice Smalltalk-80 development tools (browsing, cross-referencing, > dynamic linking, incremental compilation) to conventional languages > like C and C++. >... > That Cynergy is not a prototype-in-Smalltalk-then-deploy-in-C++ tool > brings up another question. Namely, why not? Such a thing would seem > more valuable, leveraging the benefits of both languages. Absolutely -- as soon as Dr. Stroustrup adds class arguments and polymorphism to C++. Until then, the Smalltalk-80* collection classes (such as Bag, LinkedList, and Dictionary) can't be implemented in C++. There are other problems, such as Object becomes: (which maybe shouldn't be in Smalltalk-80, and definitely doesn't fit into the C++ mindset). > Jonathan S. Eunice ARPA: jonathan@vax.cs.pittsburgh.edu > University of Pittsburgh UUCP: jonathan@pitt > Computer Science BITNET: jonathan@pittvms > (412) 624-1368 Paul S. R. Chisholm, psrc@poseidon.att.com (formerly psc@lznv.att.com) AT&T Bell Laboratories, att!poseidon!psrc, AT&T Mail !psrchisholm I'm not speaking for the company, I'm just speaking my mind. "Smalltalk-80" (but not "Smalltalk") is a trademark of Xerox Corp.