mfogg@druwa.ATT.COM (Richard-Fogg) (06/28/91)
Register as an Object Vendor Beginning this Fall, Fogg Design will be offering developed and tested objects to its expanding client base in the United States. We are seeking the participation of independent contractors to sell us the objects that our clients wish to use in their projects. C++ will be the primary language of development, with SmallTalk being secondary. We will be setting up an Object Requirement BBS, describing the objects being sought, and requesting bids on providing them. We believe that this fixed cost, object oriented approach offers a great number advantages to both the development corporations and the purchasing corporations. 1. The tax advantages of retaining control over a product are retained. The IRS cannot ask for a cut of a product that is sold at wholesale. 2. Objects which are available for purchase can be sold with support or without support. These objects can be compiled or with source, the vendor can retain control or relinquish it. As long as the object passes the quality acceptance tests of Fogg Design, Limited and of Fogg Design's customer, all other options are stated up front, in the purchase contract. 3. The development corporation retains control over the work environment. Fogg Design is interested in purchasing working modules as specified, only. 4. The purchasing corporation gets what is specified, only. Object specifications must pass Fogg Design's Request For Purchase Authorization process before being posted as requested. 5. The purchasing corporation pays for the object when it is proven to be working. All acceptance test plans will be provided with the Request for Purchase. This unequivocal procedure eliminates one of the more unpleasant experiences of the development community: customers who are unwilling or unable to communicate their needs, and who decide not to pay upon delivery because it isn't quite right. Payment is made, modifications can be ordered, and the cycle stays on small incremental steps. 6. The development corporation assumes the risk of development. There will be no payment made for good attempts, or hard work, only for objects delivered to a high professional standard, on time, for a fixed fee. Fogg Design has identified this as a major selling point to its customers. The development corporations that succeed will need to be accurate about cost and effort required to produce first class, working product. 7. This enterprise is designed around the model that the IRS has been pushing on the development community for years. The development corporation is selling a discrete product, and is free to sell it to others, or to refrain therefrom based on a contractual sales contract. 8. If you are interested in participating, please send a description of your corporation, including name address, contact, phone, fax, bbs, areas of expertise, objects offered for sale currently, human languages available, computer systems supported, and other information that will assist us. Please respond in writing (or by disk with sample work) to : Carolyn Richard Resales Manager Fogg Design, Limited P.O. Box 472020 San Francisco, CA 94147-2020 SPECIAL NOTE TO UNDERGRADS, GRADUATE STUDENTS, INDEPENDENTS, EMPLOYEES of other corporations, and others. Fogg Design, Limited is a retail seller of software OBJECTS. In order to sell a software object to Fogg Design, you must have one to sell that matches the requirements which are plainly stated, and you must have a fixed price for that object. If you intend to offer support, you must be available to provide it. In some cases, support will be required, in most, satisfaction of the quality assurance testing will be sufficient for payment. You are not required to have a federal tax identification number, as your object will be resold, and Fogg Design, Limited, will provide a tax exemption certificate with each sale. This is a new business concept (although our John Dvorak predicted it) but one which we feel will do very well. It matches the needs of the purchasers of software for on time, on price delivery of software; and it matches the needs of the development community for work that can be done within a specified timeframe, and for payment in a timely manner. Both seller and buyer benefit by knowing in advance what is expected and when. Fogg Design, Limited is a Colorado Corporation.
johnson@cs.uiuc.EDU (Ralph Johnson) (06/30/91)
This is an interesting idea. I assume that you mean "classes", not "objects", since it is pretty hard to sell a single C++ or Smalltalk object. There are several technical questions that I have, and one major socio-economic objection. The technical questions are how you are going to specify classes, and how you will know whether classes meet their specification. Are you going to provide formal specifications? I doubt it, because few people know how to write or read them. If you use informal specifications, how can you possible "prove" that a class works? At best, you can provide a set of test cases with your specifications and see whether the delivered code executes them correctly. If my class executes the test cases, but it doesn't meet the informal specifications, then what? The socio-economic objection is that "class" is not the correct granularity of reuse. People reuse entire systems, or abstract designs, and then reuse classes that fit into them. For example, Smalltalk programmers reuse Model/View/Controller as a framework for user interfaces. Once you agree upon this framework, you can discuss classes for displaying graphs, text, etc. However, if you don't have the framework then it will be very difficult to specify the individual components. Also, you are describing a top-down specification of components, which does against the way that most O-O systems are built. While this is not a proof that your scheme will not work, I am curious whether you have arguments against the usual O-O style. Ralph Johnson -- University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
davidm@uunet.UU.NET (David S. Masterson) (07/01/91)
>>>>> On 28 Jun 91 15:05:04 GMT, mfogg@druwa.ATT.COM (Richard-Fogg) said:
mfogg> Register as an Object Vendor
mfogg> Beginning this Fall, Fogg Design will be offering developed and tested
mfogg> objects to its expanding client base in the United States. We are
mfogg> seeking the participation of independent contractors to sell us the
mfogg> objects that our clients wish to use in their projects. C++ will be
mfogg> the primary language of development, with SmallTalk being secondary.
mfogg> We will be setting up an Object Requirement BBS, describing the objects
mfogg> being sought, and requesting bids on providing them. We believe that
mfogg> this fixed cost, object oriented approach offers a great number
mfogg> advantages to both the development corporations and the purchasing
mfogg> corporations.
...
mfogg> Fogg Design, Limited is a Colorado Corporation.
At first glance, this sounds like an interesting concept, but, then again, it
might not work. Currently, I am not in a position to find out anything about
this, so I would appreciate seeing any reviews of actual people who deal with
this corporation. Based on the reviews, I may try to get involved.
Please post reviews!!
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David Masterson Consilium, Inc.
(415) 691-6311 640 Clyde Ct.
uunet!cimshop!davidm Mtn. View, CA 94043
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