RMRichardson.PA@Xerox.COM (08/22/87)
> There is no "new line" character in ASCII. UNIX uses "line feed" as the new > line character. OS/9 uses "carriage return". I'd say the 'C' language itself > is suffering from parochialism here. Wellllll, ... maybe, maybe not. From "USA Standard Code for Informations Interchange," United States of America Standards Institute (Approved October 10, 1968) (USAS X3.4-1968), pg 8: -------- 5. Definitions [ ... ] 5.1 Control Characters [ ... ] LF (Line Feed): A format effector which controls the movement of the printing position to the next print- ing line. (Applicable also to display devices.) Where ap- propriate, this character may have the meaning "New Line" (NL), a format effector which controls the move- ment of the printing point to the first printing position on the next print line. Use of this convention requires agreement between sender and recipient of data. -------- So the idea of New Line has been around for some time now and NL == LF is a standard convention. Would anyone like to quote from a later version of the standard? (Is there one?) From reading K&R, I get the implication: if you use C, you agree to this convention (at least within the C code). If the operating system does not agree to the convention, then, as Guy points out, the I/O routines must do the translations, e.g. PC/MS DOS which uses <CR><LF> for a new line. Rich
henry@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer) (08/24/87)
> ... Would anyone like to quote from a later > version of the standard? (Is there one?) X3.4-1977 is the current ASCII standard, I believe. The differences from the 1968 one are pretty minor, I am told; I've never seen the 1968 version. For those who are interested, its full name is "X3.4-1977 American National Standard Code For Information Interchange", available from American National Standards Institute Inc., 1430 Broadway, New York NY 10018. I don't have a price list handy, but be warned that it will not be cheap. -- Apollo was the doorway to the stars. | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology Next time, we should open it. | {allegra,ihnp4,decvax,utai}!utzoo!henry
drw@cullvax.UUCP (Dale Worley) (08/26/87)
henry@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer) writes: > For those who are interested, its full name is "X3.4-1977 American National > Standard Code For Information Interchange", available from American National > Standards Institute Inc., 1430 Broadway, New York NY 10018. I don't have a > price list handy, but be warned that it will not be cheap. I believe that all standards are, in fact, without copyright (you can check in the front). If this is true, you can just go to a library and xerox(*) yourself a copy. Dale (*) Deliberately trying to break Xerox's trademark. But since I'm not using it to sell a product, it's legal! -- Dale Worley Cullinet Software ARPA: cullvax!drw@eddie.mit.edu UUCP: ...!seismo!harvard!mit-eddie!cullvax!drw Apollo was the doorway to the stars - next time we should open it. Disclaimer: Don't sue me, sue my company - they have more money.
barmar@think.COM (Barry Margolin) (08/27/87)
In article <1492@cullvax.UUCP> drw@cullvax.UUCP (Dale Worley) writes: >I believe that all standards are, in fact, without copyright (you can >check in the front). If this is true, you can just go to a library >and xerox(*) yourself a copy. This is false. I just pulled out my copy of X3.4-1977, and on page 2 it says: Copyright (c) 1977 by American National Standards Institute, Inc All rights reserved. No part of this document may be reproduced in any form, in an electronic retrieval system or otherwise, without the prior written permission of the publisher. I also recall a discussion in X3J13 (Common Lisp) regarding allowing Lisp system vendors to use the standard in their online documentation. Our chairman says that it may be difficult to get ANSI to agree to this. ANSI is primarily a publishing house, so they have little incentive to allow vendors to make it easy to circumvent them. --- Barry Margolin Thinking Machines Corp. barmar@think.com seismo!think!barmar
kevin@kosman.UUCP (08/28/87)
In article <1492@cullvax.UUCP>, drw@cullvax.UUCP (Dale Worley) writes: > henry@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer) writes: > > For those who are interested, its full name is "X3.4-1977 American National > > Standard Code For Information Interchange", available from American National > > Standards Institute Inc., 1430 Broadway, New York NY 10018. I don't have a > > price list handy, but be warned that it will not be cheap. > > I believe that all standards are, in fact, without copyright (you can > check in the front). If this is true, you can just go to a library > and xerox(*) yourself a copy. I quote from my copy of X3.4-1977 (just inside the front cover). Copyright (c) 1977 by American National Standards Institute, Inc. All rights reserved. No part of this publication may be reproduced....... And this should not surprise anyone, if you think about it. There's a considerable expense involved in the administration of these documents, even by a not-for-profit corporation like ANSI. The volunteers who serve on the committees aren't going to pay for it. YOU pay for it by buying copies of the standard that you're going to use. So don't do it -- ante up when you want a copy. Most of the ones I have cost about $5.00 (US), and I think the biggies like COBOL went for $30.00 or so.
henry@utzoo.UUCP (Henry Spencer) (08/29/87)
> I believe that all standards are, in fact, without copyright (you can > check in the front)... Sorry, not true. X3.4-1977 in particular is copyrighted. Publications of the US government often do not carry copyright, but ANSI is not a government organization. -- "There's a lot more to do in space | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology than sending people to Mars." --Bova | {allegra,ihnp4,decvax,utai}!utzoo!henry