[comp.lang.c] Unix System Security

karl@polyof.poly.edu (A1 karl muhlbach (staff) ) (12/12/89)

Dear All:

	I am a senior at Polytechnic University in Farmingdale N.Y.
and I am working on a senior project concerning Unix System
Security.  The project will consist of a program that will traverse
the file system checking for various security flaws and/or actual
violations in security.  I plan on checking for things like
excessive SUID and GUID settings, ln's to user directories etc.. I
also heard that there are a great deal of flaws with mail and UUCP.

	My problem is as follows.  I need to gather together as
much information as possible of the various areas of the Unix
Operating System security flaws.  I need this information to decide
the areas of concentration that I will embark on.  I realize that
no one would and/or could tell me the specific flaws that exist,
after all you don't know whether I am a "good guy" or "bad guy".
Let me assure you all that my intentions are quite honorable and that 
you will have to take my word as a gentlemen.

	I would appreciate any information of the various flawed
security areas of Unix and/or leads as to where I might find out
these things.  I have a book called "Unix System Security" by
Patrick Wood but that only covers basic minor flaws. I would like
to make this program as elaborate as possible.

	I WOULD APPRECIATE ANY CORRESPONDENCE CONCERNING THIS
MATTER TO BE SENT VIA EMAIL TO THE ABOVE ADDRESS SINCE IT WOULD
ASSURE ME A QUICKER RETURN AND SINCE I AM NOT ALWAYS ABLE TO CHECK
THE NETWORK FOR REPLIES.

	THANK YOU IN ADVANCE FOR ALL YOUR TIME AND EFFORT IN MY
BEHALF.

						Sincerely,
						
						Karl M.

tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) (12/12/89)

Posting details of known UNIX security holes to the net is a *very* bad idea;
I hope the reasons are obvious.

This argument can be extended to e-mail: is it wise to e-mail security holes
to someone you don't know? This is a general comment that is not" aimed" at 
any individual.

tom gardner

peter@ficc.uu.net (Peter da Silva) (12/13/89)

I can understand people asking IBM-PC specific questions here. The PC
group is noisy and there's no pc.tech group.

I can understand discussions veering off to operating systems.

But why on earth would you post an article that fits best into comp.unix.*,
comp.security, and the UNIX Security mailing list to comp.lang.c.
-- 
`-_-' Peter da Silva. +1 713 274 5180. <peter@ficc.uu.net>.
 'U`  Also <peter@ficc.lonestar.org> or <peter@sugar.lonestar.org>.
"It was just dumb luck that Unix managed to break through the Stupidity Barrier
and become popular in spite of its inherent elegance." -- gavin@krypton.sgi.com

bph@buengc.BU.EDU (Blair P. Houghton) (12/14/89)

In article <7276@ficc.uu.net> peter@ficc.uu.net (Peter da Silva) writes:
>I can understand people asking IBM-PC specific questions here. The PC
>group is noisy and there's no pc.tech group.
>
>I can understand discussions veering off to operating systems.
>
>But why on earth would you post an article that fits best into comp.unix.*,
>comp.security, and the UNIX Security mailing list to comp.lang.c.

Can you say 'gets()'?

				--Blair
				  "I knew that you could."

CCDN@levels.sait.edu.au (david newall) (12/25/89)

tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) writes:
> Posting details of known UNIX security holes to the net is a *very* bad idea;
> I hope the reasons are obvious.

Do you suggest that the bad people won't find out about security holes if
those holes aren't published?  So naive...

Personally I wish to hear about problems as soon as possible; so they can be
fixed.  What would *you* suggest is the best way of securing Unix?


David Newall                     Phone:  +61 8 343 3160
Unix Systems Programmer          Fax:    +61 8 349 6939
Academic Computing Service       E-mail: ccdn@levels.sait.oz.au
SA Institute of Technology       Post:   The Levels, South Australia, 5095

tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) (01/11/90)

David Newall                     Phone:  +61 8 343 3160
Unix Systems Programmer          Fax:    +61 8 349 6939
Academic Computing Service       E-mail: ccdn@levels.sait.oz.au
SA Institute of Technology       Post:   The Levels, South Australia, 5095

writes:

>>tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) writes:
>> Posting details of known UNIX security holes to the net is a *very* bad idea;
>> I hope the reasons are obvious.

>Do you suggest that the bad people won't find out about security holes if
>those holes aren't published?  So naive...

Please reread my posting; I implied no such thing. To use an analogy of dubious
validity, gun control does not prevent  murder, but it  does reduce the problem
(is that a sufficiently contentious statement? ;-} ).

>Personally I wish to hear about problems as soon as possible; so they can be
>fixed.  What would *you* suggest is the best way of securing Unix?

Sorry, my magic wand is fresh out of twinkle dust today... ;)

I want to hear about *fixes* as quickly as possible. The original posting could
have  resulted in details  of *open* holes being widely  circulated and read by
persons of unknown responsibility; I hope you would agree that would be unwise.

As  to  how to get Unix  holes   plugged: there    are a number  of conflicting
approaches  each of which  has advantages  and  disadvantages, and I  have   no
intention of proposing The Answer (tm). What is your Answer?

CCDN@levels.sait.edu.au (david newall) (01/15/90)

tgg@otter.hpl.hp.com (Tom Gardner) writes:
> I want to hear about *fixes* [ to security holes ] as quickly as possible.
> The original posting could have resulted in details of *open* holes being
> widely circulated and read by persons of unknown responsibility; I hope you
> would agree that would be unwise.

I want security holes fixed as quickly as possible.  Sitting quietly, waiting
for fixes, does little to add urgency to such problems.

The recent internet worm, which took advantage of a number of long standing
security holes, serves as a fine example of how these issues can be ignored.
Despite the fact that these were "well known" security problems, nothing had
been done to correct the situation.

I am grateful to the author, or authors, of the internet worm.  They brought
to the attention of the world, these rather obvious problems, and in such a
way that the problems were fixed, and were fixed quickly.  Never the less,
the legal ramifications of the worm are likely to deter anyone else from
using a similar technique to advertise security holes.  Perhaps the author
(or authors) might have served their purpose better by posting the program,
not running it?


David Newall                     Phone:  +61 8 343 3160
Unix Systems Programmer          Fax:    +61 8 349 6939
Academic Computing Service       E-mail: ccdn@levels.sait.oz.au
SA Institute of Technology       Post:   The Levels, South Australia, 5095

chris@mimsy.umd.edu (Chris Torek) (01/17/90)

(NB: this does not belong in comp.lang.c)

In article <6354@levels.sait.edu.au> CCDN@levels.sait.edu.au (david newall)
writes:
>The recent internet worm, which took advantage of a number of long standing
>security holes, serves as a fine example of how these issues can be ignored.
>Despite the fact that these were "well known" security problems, nothing had
>been done to correct the situation.

Despite the fact that people keep claiming that the finger bug and the
sendmail `debug' bug were well known, nothing had ever been reported of
them.  If anyone knew of these bugs, it did not include those responsible
for maintaining the software.
-- 
In-Real-Life: Chris Torek, Univ of MD Comp Sci Dept (+1 301 454 7163)
Domain:	chris@cs.umd.edu	Path:	uunet!mimsy!chris

bph@buengc.BU.EDU (Blair P. Houghton) (01/18/90)

In article <21880@mimsy.umd.edu> chris@mimsy.umd.edu (Chris Torek) writes:
>(NB: this does not belong in comp.lang.c)

Point taken.  Go look in misc.legal.  More facts available.

				--Blair
				  "Sounds like a Romanian press release.."