[comp.lang.c] How dare you!

Steve.Shapiro@p0.f35.n382.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Steve Shapiro) (02/05/90)

On <Feb 04 20:02> Andrew Cowie writes to Steve Shapiro:

 SS>I have just turned on this echo and am wondering if there are many 
 SS>MicroSoft C v5.1 programmers out there.

 >>BTW, this is the wrong place to ask. Try comp.sys.ibm.pc.programmer 
 >>when
 >>it is created in a few days. Also, please do not clutter the net with
 >>questions like this: These articles travel all over the continent, and
 >>sometimes all over the world. For some companies, this costs major
 >>dollars.

It is rather tough to leave messages into a newsgroup BEFORE it has been 
created. 

I understand how these newsgroups work and have been involved with them 
(although not this one) for years. 

 >BTW. This is not some small local echo net, nor is it FIDONET. It is 
 >as USENET,
 >informally as news. The subgroups (what you would call conferances) 
 >are called
 >newsgroups. Ergo, you just "subscribed" to the newsgroup comp.lang.c.
 >Ergo, you don't know what it is about, Ergo your question. PLEASE, 
 >wait
 >for at LEAST two months, reading all the articles to learn what kind
 >of discussions take place, then, if you have a question that would be 
 >>of
 >major importance to the rest of the world, because you have read all 
 >the
 >manuals without finding your answer, then you can turn to this group.

I have been reading this newsgroup for some time and do not find my question to 
be any less valid than those I have seen. 

I have several questions regarding Microsoft C v5.1 which I have not been able 
to get answered, either by Microsoft, internationally via the FidoNet C echo or 
locally via the local pc users group. 

At least everyone else believes that questions are how we learn.

> This is a flame of sorts, but more a helpful hint in an attempt to
> redirect those poor lost souls who haven't had time to experiance
> USENET yet. -> Try comp.sys.ibm.pc. Also, since there are around 5000
> flavours of UNIX, all anoyingly different, mention that you mean DOS 
> MSC 5.1 (Xenix 386 2.3.2, for example, uses a version of MSC 4.0)

Well then keep it to yourself. I feel that flames are unneccessary in so simple 
a question as I have asked. I do not appreciate your comments or superior 
attitude. A 2 page diatribe from you regarding a 2 line question is ridiculous. 

The actuall transmission time of the 200 characters I typed to be transmitted 
worldwide is probably less than the cost of a candy bar. Lighten up about 
costs.

I am glad that the rest of the Unix community is not as snobbish as you are. 

Part of my project will involve porting C from PC's to a variety of Unix 
platforms. Did you ever stop to think that maybe I first need to establish if 
the kind of support regarding my programming language is available before I 
dove in to a several page long diatribe?

 >Unnecessary. Like I said, this is going all around the world.
 
Do not judge lest ye be judged yourself.

Thank you for your help and assistance. No, don't bother with me again. I can 
see that you would rather abuse than assist.

Regards,
Steve.


--  
Steve Shapiro -- via The Q Continuum (FidoNet Node 1:382/31)
UUCP: ...!rpp386!tqc!35.0!Steve.Shapiro
ARPA: Steve.Shapiro@p0.f35.n382.z1.FIDONET.ORG

peter@ficc.uu.net (Peter da Silva) (02/06/90)

In article <157.25CE584F@tqc.FIDONET.ORG> Steve.Shapiro@p0.f35.n382.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Steve Shapiro) writes:
> I am glad that the rest of the Unix community is not as snobbish as you are. 

No, it's us C folks that are snobbish. We get just as testy when people start
posting a bunch of UNIX-y questions in comp.lang.c. It just doesn't happen as
often, because there are plenty of UNIX groups here. I'm trying to solve the
IBM-PC group shortage as quickly as I can. Patience.
-- 
 _--_|\  Peter da Silva. +1 713 274 5180. <peter@ficc.uu.net>.
/      \
\_.--._/ Xenix Support -- it's not just a job, it's an adventure!
      v  "Have you hugged your wolf today?" `-_-'

goer@sophist.uucp (Richard Goerwitz) (02/07/90)

Harmless query:

> SS>I have just turned on this echo and am wondering if there are many 
> SS>MicroSoft C v5.1 programmers out there.

Reply:

> >>BTW, this is the wrong place to ask. Try comp.sys.ibm.pc.programmer 
> >>when
> >>it is created in a few days. Also, please do not clutter the net with
> >>questions like this: These articles travel all over the continent, and
> >>sometimes all over the world. For some companies, this costs major
> >>dollars.

I too have noticed a certain snobbishness in many newsgroups about things
like this.  Microsoft's is a perfectly valid compiler.  My Xenix 2.3.3 runs
a version of 5.1 with a DOS cross-development system.  I would have been
interested in an answer.  I don't quote the names of the posters here be-
cause there is no reason to get personal.

   -Richard L. Goerwitz              goer%sophist@uchicago.bitnet
   goer@sophist.uchicago.edu         rutgers!oddjob!gide!sophist!goer

tneff@bfmny0.UU.NET (Tom Neff) (02/07/90)

question -
>I have just turned on this echo and am wondering if there are many 
>MicroSoft C v5.1 programmers out there.          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
												  note question

someone responded -
>BTW, this is the wrong place to ask. Try comp.sys.ibm.pc.programmer when
>it is created in a few days...

now the followup -
>I too have noticed a certain snobbishness in many newsgroups about things
>like this.  

Sometimes it can seem like snobbishness, sometimes it can even BE snobbish,
everyone's human -- but the basic idea is correct.  The underlying goal
is to put things where they belong and prevent chaos here.

>Microsoft's is a perfectly valid compiler.  My Xenix 2.3.3 runs
>a version of 5.1 with a DOS cross-development system.  

So it is, and so you do, but this newsgroup is not for discussing the
individual quirks of specific implementations.  It's for discussing the
language as a whole.  Precisely to the extent that MSC is a full and valid
C environment (which I agree it is), the concept of 'MSC programmer'
becomes irrelevant here.  'MSC programming' questions mean things like
how to detect keypress or play with stack size or link with MASM, which
are not C language issues.

>I would have been interested in an answer.  

But how exactly would the question "are there many MSC 5.1 programmers
here" have been answered in a way visible to you and others?  6,000
individual followup "Yes me too" articles?  That's what we try to
avoid.

At best, one might post something like "If you program MSC 5.1, please
reply to this article via email" which would be legitimate, but third
parties wouldn't see the answer.

There should indeed be sub-groups created to handle specific
implementations like MSC.  Comp.lang.c ain't it.