[comp.lang.pascal] Questions/Observations about TP v. 6.0

ebergman@isis.cs.du.edu (Eric Bergman-Terrell) (01/20/91)

I just upgraded from Turbo Pascal 5.0 to 6.0 had have some questions:

1.	Software Floating Point:  

	It looks like they've made rather dramatic improvements with
	software floating point.  My astronomy program, which relies
	heavily on floating point, runs about 40% faster when software
	floating point is used.  Has anyone noticed similar speedups?

2.	Turbo Vision:

	Turbo Vision is supposed to allow you to have hints associated
	with submenus that appear in the status line.  For example, when
	you're running the Turbo Pascal Integrated Development
	Environment, if you hold down the left mouse button and scan
	down the submenus, brief "hints" will appear in the status line for
	each submenu.

	The manual makes brief mention of this, but unfortunately I could
	not find an example in the manual or in the demo source directories.

	Does anyone have an example of submenus with "hints"?

3.	Turbo Pascal for Windows:

	Turbo Pascal for Windows is supposed to be out in the first quarter
	of this year.  Has anyone heard if Borland is going to make
	Turbo Vision "talk to" Windows 3.0?  If I knew that Turbo Vision
	applications could become Windows 3.0 applications by changing
	a compilation option, I suppose that it would make the investment
	in learning Turbo Vision worthwhile...


Thanks in advance,


Eric Bergman-Terrell

ace@cc.ic.ac.uk (Andriko del Saludo) (01/22/91)

In article <1991Jan20.152128.21994@isis.cs.du.edu> ebergman@isis.UUCP (Eric Bergman-Terrell) writes:
>
>I just upgraded from Turbo Pascal 5.0 to 6.0 had have some questions:
>
>1.	Software Floating Point:  
>3.	Turbo Pascal for Windows:
>
>	Turbo Pascal for Windows is supposed to be out in the first quarter
>	of this year.  Has anyone heard if Borland is going to make
>	Turbo Vision "talk to" Windows 3.0?  If I knew that Turbo Vision
>	applications could become Windows 3.0 applications by changing
>	a compilation option, I suppose that it would make the investment
>	in learning Turbo Vision worthwhile...
>
 I picked up a thread like that on compuserve. Apparently Borland will
 not say that TPW will support turbo vision (in fact it strongly denies
 it). On the other hand the comment was that if you learn TV now,
 porting to TPW will bw much much easier, which implies a measure of
 support for TV. Also, when I saw a beta version of TPW it looked like
 compiling a TV app quite effortlessly. IMHO TV is a useful thing to
 learn.

 ace

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------
- Andreas C. Enotiadis (ace@cc.ic.ac.uk, ace@epstech.uucp)    -
- (I'm still thinking about something clever to put here...)  -
---------------------------------------------------------------

eli@smectos.gang.umass.edu (Eli Brandt) (01/23/91)

In article <1991Jan20.152128.21994@isis.cs.du.edu> ebergman@isis.UUCP (Eric Bergman-Terrell) writes:
>
>I just upgraded from Turbo Pascal 5.0 to 6.0 had have some questions:
>
>1.	Software Floating Point:  
>
>	It looks like they've made rather dramatic improvements with
>	software floating point.  My astronomy program, which relies
>	heavily on floating point, runs about 40% faster when software
>	floating point is used.  Has anyone noticed similar speedups?

This sounds like you're using {$E+}, IEEE floating point.  IMHO, this is a bad
idea: without a coprocessor, it's so damned slow (though yes, it is faster than
5.0, I got about 30%) that it's intolerable.  What I end up doing is distributing
two versions of every fp-intensive program: one '87-only and the other with
six-byte reals.  In 5.0, E+ was about one third the speed of E-, if I'm remembering
the right numbers.  I haven't looked at 6.0 output, but in 5.0, every time you
do an E+ fp instruction, it calls some INT 37h I believe, which then goes to
Borland fp code to convert your real to 10-bytes, multiply these mongo 10-byte reals,
convert them back, and return from the interrupt.  What's worse, even if the user
has an '87, it still goes through an interrupt for each instruction, which is 
some serious overhead...

[ second question deleted; I haven't learned TV yet ]

>3.	Turbo Pascal for Windows:
>
>	Turbo Pascal for Windows is supposed to be out in the first quarter
>	of this year.  Has anyone heard if Borland is going to make
>	Turbo Vision "talk to" Windows 3.0?  If I knew that Turbo Vision
>	applications could become Windows 3.0 applications by changing
>	a compilation option, I suppose that it would make the investment
>	in learning Turbo Vision worthwhile...

I would guess that that's why they put it in.  However, who knows?  If I write
a few 20 K-line programs in Turbo Vision and Borland pulls a Turbo Basic on it,
I'm going to be *annoyed*.  I couldn't care less about TP/Windows, but TP for
X might be interesting.

>Thanks in advance,
>
>
>Eric Bergman-Terrell

 Eli 

ebergman@isis.cs.du.edu (Eric Bergman-Terrell) (01/27/91)

No, the software floating point that I noticed a 40% improvement in was
the standard one (i.e. not 8X87 emulation).  I've never used the software
8X87 emulation because it was (in 5.0 anyway) about 50% slower than the
standard software floating point...

Apparently Borland tuned some of the floating point library routines -
compared with my program compiled under 5.0 and 6.0, some of the numerical
results differ in the least significant digit displayed by my program.

Terrell

dmurdoch@watstat.waterloo.edu (Duncan Murdoch) (02/07/91)

In article <25453@dime.cs.umass.edu> eli@smectos.CS.UMASS.EDU (Eli Brandt) writes:
>
>This sounds like you're using {$E+}, IEEE floating point.  IMHO, this is a bad
>idea: without a coprocessor, it's so damned slow (though yes, it is faster than
>5.0, I got about 30%) that it's intolerable.  What I end up doing is distributing
>two versions of every fp-intensive program: one '87-only and the other with
>six-byte reals.  In 5.0, E+ was about one third the speed of E-, if I'm remembering
>the right numbers.  I haven't looked at 6.0 output, but in 5.0, every time you
>do an E+ fp instruction, it calls some INT 37h I believe, which then goes to
>Borland fp code to convert your real to 10-bytes, multiply these mongo 10-byte reals,
>convert them back, and return from the interrupt.  What's worse, even if the user
>has an '87, it still goes through an interrupt for each instruction, which is 
>some serious overhead...

No, it only goes through the interrupt the first time.  The interrupt checks
to see if there's an FPU installed, and if so, patches the caller back to 
inline code.

I always use the E+ version, but you're right:  I wouldn't want to execute any

Duncan Murdoch