root@ozdaltx.UUCP (root) (09/20/86)
In article <109@sbstaff2.UUCP>, faunt@sbstaff2.UUCP (Jim Fauntleroy) writes: > I too know twin brothers only one of whom is gay. This caused a few > odd moments before I realized he was twins. ...... > which found that gay men were more likely to have a gay brother than straight > men. ..... I know it's Saturday and my brain quit functioning yesterday, but am I interpreting correctly the above statement as; In families with 2 or more male children, if one of the children is Gay, then the odds are greater that the other(s) will be also (gay). I can only recall knowing one set of gay twins, While in the Navy in Kingsville, Tx, there were these two fellows. They called themselves, 'White Russians'. I think their family came from Southern Russia. HUBBA-HUBBA! they were real hunks. Also, for what ever it's worth, they WERE NOT identical in all ways, either. ;-) On the other side on the coin, anyone venture any stats on incidents of Gay fathers/gay sons? or Gay parents/gay children? Scotty ...ihnp4!killer!ozdaltx!root "Oh, my friend, it's not what they take away from you that counts- It's what you do with what you have left." - Hubert Humphrey
francis@cit-vax.Caltech.Edu (Joseph Francis) (09/30/86)
Organization : California Institute of Technology Keywords: In article <109@sbstaff2.UUCP> faunt@sbstaff2.UUCP (Jim Fauntleroy) writes: >> I have a gay friend whose identical twin brother is straight. >> ... > As for citations of studies, there was a news note in the Gay Community >Boston University School of Medicine, and the principal investigator was >Richard Pillard. > ... A friend of mine works in this area (with Richard Pillard I believe). James Weinrich, of Boston University School of Medicine, family studies or something like that. I can't remember the study (I have copies somewhere) but if you are gay, they you are k times more likely to have a gay brother than if you are straight, etc. and same (somewhat smaller k) for lesbians. The study implied heritability of homosexuality on the same order as something like alcoholism or schizophrenia (no pejorative association though). See E.O. Wilson on the subject, too (If you believe in sociobiology, clap your hands! (re: New York Review of books, latest issue) (Nice to talk to everyone again) -- J o e J o e (francis@csvax.caltech.edu || ...seismo!cit-vax!francis)
rb@cci632.UUCP (Rex Ballard) (10/06/86)
In article <999@cit-vax.Caltech.Edu> francis@cit-vax.UUCP (Joseph Francis) writes: >Organization : California Institute of Technology >Keywords: > >In article <109@sbstaff2.UUCP> faunt@sbstaff2.UUCP (Jim Fauntleroy) writes: >>> I have a gay friend whose identical twin brother is straight. >>> ... >> As for citations of studies, there was a news note in the Gay Community >>Boston University School of Medicine, and the principal investigator was >>Richard Pillard. >> ... > >A friend of mine works in this area (with Richard Pillard I believe). >James Weinrich, of Boston University School of Medicine, family studies >or something like that. >I can't remember the study (I have copies somewhere) but if you are gay, >they you are k times more likely to have a gay brother than if you are >straight, etc. and same (somewhat smaller k) for lesbians. >The study >implied heritability of homosexuality on the same order as something like >alcoholism or schizophrenia (no pejorative association though). >See E.O. Wilson on the subject, too (If you believe in sociobiology, clap >your hands! (re: New York Review of books, latest issue) >J o e J o e (francis@csvax.caltech.edu || ...seismo!cit-vax!francis) As I understood it, there were some correlations between "left brain" effeminate characteristics and pre-natal stress, but that sexual preferences were established before one had the verbal skills to express them. As early as 18 months. While it is possible for two identical twins to have different sexual preferences, it is less likely that one would be "butch" and the other "nell". Studies of men born in concentration camps indicated that nearly 80% had more "feminine" psychological patterns and neurological brain development. Similar percentages of women treated for depression while pregnant, pre-natal trauma, and other "high stress" conditions were also found. Homosexuality however was not that much more common. What difference may have been noticed may have been people who had only slightly stronger preferences for women, but found the ability to attract men sufficient to outweigh any natural preferences. While there might be a higher likelyhood that men with these feminine patterns might be more likely to prefer men to women, there is an equally high chance that they would admire feminine characteristics in others, with a preference toward women. The same is true with men who have more masculine neurology. Though they might be more likely to prefer women, they might be attracted to masculine characterstics, with a preference toward women. For various reasons, effeminate behaviour is often associated with homosexuality. Just as not all gays are effeminate, not all effeminate men are gay. The "stress factor" is actually measurable, biologically based, and easily provable. It appears that testosterone levels are significantly lower during the critical time (3-4 months?) that sexual characteristics are established, than for non-stressed "butch" infants. If the testosterone levels are low enough, the result will be transexual characteristics that can be quite profound, in spite of the presence of the male chromosome. There are even cases on record of children being born as women in spite of the male chromosome. In some cases, the genetic programming may be sufficient to overcome the adverse effects, usually during puberty. This is usually after the sexual preferences occur, and too late to compensate for the different neurology.
nazgul@apollo.uucp (Kee Hinckley) (10/08/86)
In article <999@cit-vax.Caltech.Edu> francis@cit-vax.UUCP (Joseph Francis) writes: > I can't remember the study (I have copies somewhere) but if you are gay, > they you are k times more likely to have a gay brother than if you are > straight, etc. and same (somewhat smaller k) for lesbians. The study > implied heritability of homosexuality on the same order as something like > alcoholism or schizophrenia (no pejorative association though). The thing to remember with such studies is not to jump to the conclusion that a correlation implies that the attribute is inherited. Unless the study involved siblings who were separated at birth (and ideally, with a control group of unrelated children who were also separated from their parents at birth) (can you find your copy?) you still have no proof as to whether the trait is inherited or socially acquired. It doesn't suprise me at all to hear that there is a correlation - what I'd really like to see is a definitive study of *why* there is a correlation. -- -kee ...{mit-erl,mit-eddie,yale,uw-beaver,decvax!wanginst}!apollo!nazgul Apollo Computer, Chelmsford MA. (617) 256-6600 x7587 or 499B Boston Rd, Groton MA. (617) 448-2863 I'm not sure which upsets me more; that people are so unwilling to accept responsibility for their own actions, or that they are so eager to regulate everyone else's.