era@ddsw1.UUCP (Mark Ethan Smith) (09/15/87)
In article <1554@chinet.UUCP> rhonda@chinet.UUCP (Rhonda Scribner) writes: >>>Gene has tried to make this into a political argument, claiming that the >>>issue is "libertarianism." > >Oh, fiddlesticks, Gene. Do you think you're kidding anybody with this >"intelligent political discussion" fish story? Were you attempting to have >a serious discussion about how Matthew's getting the boot was related to >Judaism by posting to soc.culture.jewish? You were writing rhetorical articles >in an effort to sway opinion in your and Matthew's favor, period. Any >intelligent political discussion that resulted was incidental. How interesting. It is totally irrelevant that the people who censored me and harassed me and eventually succeeded in getting my password pulled on the Well and on Chinet were mostly Libertarians and that I happen to be Jewish. It is only a coincidence that the only people who get their passwords pulled by usenet sites happen to be Jewish, and that the people who do it happen to be Libertarians who, except in the case of Jews, pretend to advocate "absolute free speech." I certainly wouldn't be paranoid enough to see any discrimination in this. Definitely a non-issue. But if you happen to be Jewish, I'd advise you to try to get accounts on machines that aren't owned or dominated by Libertarians--just to be on the safe side. ;-) --Mark -- Poster assumes all liability for contents of this article. Mark Ethan Smith ihnp4!ddsw1!era
dmcanzi@watdcsu.UUCP (09/17/87)
In article <341@ddsw1.UUCP> era@ddsw1.UUCP (Mark Ethan Smith) writes: >It is only a coincidence that the only people who get their passwords >pulled by usenet sites happen to be Jewish, and that the people who do it >happen to be Libertarians who, except in the case of Jews, pretend to >advocate "absolute free speech." I bet Tim Maroney will be real surprised when he finds out that he's Jewish. Followups to talk.loonie.fringe. -- David Canzi
hollombe@ttidca.TTI.COM (The Polymath) (09/17/87)
Will you people please take soc.net-people out of the newsgroups lines of this thread? It's neither relevant nor appropriate to this group. -- The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe, hollombe@TTI.COM) Illegitimati Nil Citicorp(+)TTI Carborundum 3100 Ocean Park Blvd. (213) 452-9191, x2483 Santa Monica, CA 90405 {csun|philabs|psivax|trwrb}!ttidca!hollombe
rhonda@chinet.UUCP (Rhonda Scribner) (09/18/87)
In article <341@ddsw1.UUCP>, era@ddsw1.UUCP (Mark Ethan Smith) writes: >In article <1554@chinet.UUCP> rhonda@chinet.UUCP (Rhonda Scribner) writes: >>Oh, fiddlesticks, Gene. Do you think you're kidding anybody with this >>"intelligent political discussion" fish story? Were you attempting to have >>a serious discussion about how Matthew's getting the boot was related to >>Judaism by posting to soc.culture.jewish? You were writing rhetorical articles >>in an effort to sway opinion in your and Matthew's favor, period. Any >>intelligent political discussion that resulted was incidental. > >It is totally irrelevant that the people who censored me and harassed >me and eventually succeeded in getting my password pulled on the Well >and on Chinet were mostly Libertarians and that I happen to be Jewish. Perhaps it is. I am on Chinet and I am Jewish, and no one has made any effort to pull my account (although I have gotten a few requests to clean out my mail file :-) ) despite my own involvement in a loud boisterous debate or two. In addition to being Jewish, you have been arrogant and hostile to a large number of people. I would say that might be another reason your account was pulled. Perhaps it might even be the real reason. When I was younger someone said to me that the worst anti-semites are often Jews or ex-Jews. Through your ravings that you are a victim of "prejudice" against women and Jews, you actually hurt those of us fighting real discrimination. The other thing is that Gene Ward Smith posted his article to soc.culture.jewish with no relevance to Jewish issues whatsoever. It was never even claimed that Matthew was getting the boot because he was Jewish. He was simply rallying readers against Tim Maroney on the basis that Matthew, a Jew, was kicked off of the net by Tim Maroney, a man who made anti-Israel statements. To my mind that is pandering of the lowest kind. >It is only a coincidence that the only people who get their passwords >pulled by usenet sites happen to be Jewish, and that the people who do it >happen to be Libertarians who, except in the case of Jews, pretend to >advocate "absolute free speech." The only people? Tim Maroney once got himself pulled, and we know he isn't Jewish. I am in awe of your ability to formulate wild generalizations at the drop of a hat the way you do, for example, in your Myopia articles and other articles in soc.women. Like I just said, your whining that you are a victim of anti-semitic anti-female discrimination when you are really the "victim" of the more justifiable anti-obnoxious discrimination seriously damages any efforts to fight real prejudice and discrimination. >I certainly wouldn't be paranoid enough to see any discrimination in this. Obviously that's not true. By the way, as long as you brought up the topic of Matthew Wiener, let me ask you something out of curiosity. The first of your Myopia series of articles in soc.women was posted from an account at violet.berkeley.edu, a machine known to be the last net outpost of Matthew Wiener. Gene Ward Smith mentioned in passing that Matthew went back east after his accounts were deleted (obviously an act of anti-semitism by libertarians). Sure enough, later articles in that series (postdating Matthew's departure) were posted from a UNIX site in New York City. (Big Electric Cat, dasys1) You wouldn't by any chance happen to BE Matthew Wiener, would you? --Rhonda
gsmith@BOSCO.BERKELEY.EDU.UUCP (09/18/87)
In article <341@ddsw1.UUCP> era@ddsw1.UUCP (Mark Ethan Smith) writes: >In article <1554@chinet.UUCP> rhonda@chinet.UUCP (Rhonda Scribner) writes: >>>>Gene has tried to make this into a political argument, claiming that the >>>>issue is "libertarianism." >It is totally irrelevant that the people who censored me and harassed >me and eventually succeeded in getting my password pulled on the Well >and on Chinet were mostly Libertarians and that I happen to be Jewish. >It is only a coincidence that the only people who get their passwords >pulled by usenet sites happen to be Jewish, and that the people who do it >happen to be Libertarians who, except in the case of Jews, pretend to >advocate "absolute free speech." For the record and in the possibly mistaken belief that someone might be interested I should like to say: (1) Matthew Wiener's net-access problems have nothing to do with his ethnicity. (2) Rhonda to the contrary, I was not writing "diatribes" against Libertarianism, but asking certain questions relating to the nature of its commitment to liberty. (3) While I often disagree with what Mark Ethan Smith has to say, I think he should be allowed to continue saying it. If Libertarians kicked him off that would seem to add to my problems and questions about this philosophy. I hope my making this remark is not taken to be another "diatribe". "This paragraph is why I have felt free to insult you." -- Tim Maroney ucbvax!bosco!gsmith Gene Ward Smith/Brahms Gang/Berkeley CA 94720
pab@cbterra.UUCP (09/19/87)
In article <8709180834.AA26333@ronzoni>, gsmith@BOSCO.BERKELEY.EDU writes: > >In article <1554@chinet.UUCP> rhonda@chinet.UUCP (Rhonda Scribner) writes: > >>>>Gene has tried to make this into a political argument, claiming that the > >>>>issue is "libertarianism." > > For the record and in the possibly mistaken > belief that someone might be interested I should like to say: > > (2) Rhonda to the contrary, I was not writing "diatribes" against > Libertarianism, but asking certain questions relating to the > nature of its commitment to liberty. Why wasnt it posted to appropriate newsgroups then. Your "I'll take dame liberty for myself, thank you" was the most infantile saying i ever heard. It equally applies to the way conservatives view liberals and libertarians, how liberals view libertarians and conservatives, and how libertarians view liberals and conservatives. > Gene, when you first started the "portrait" series. You told a heart-wrenching story about how poor Matt had been canned because Tim complained to Matt's superiors at the university. Then about 3/4 the way into the article you start ranting about libertarians. Yes, somehow, the evil and twisted libertarians sprang from the rocks and bushwacked poor Matt. Tim isnt a libertarian, i dont know if the university oficials are, but what difference does political orientation make? I've been attacked by the "non-violent, nicey-nicey, holier-than-thou" liberals. Does that justify me making inflammatory remarks to discredit them? Your title speaks for itself. What did libertarian philosphy have to do with it? When did libertarian theory become your university's practice. > (3) While I often disagree with what Mark Ethan Smith has to say, > I think he should be allowed to continue saying it. If would you say the same about Tim Maroney? > Libertarians kicked him off that would seem to add to my problems > and questions about this philosophy. I hope my making Oh good grief! How does Mark even know the politics of the people who kicked him off? That has very little to do with it anyway. "Yep, them liberals tried to beat on me, only adds to my problems about their philosphy". > this remark is not taken to be another "diatribe". Again, your title was written as to slur libertarians. Whether it was intended that way or not. Your past postings make me suspect you of ill-intentions though. Gene, you and just about everyone on this net, obviously know nothing about libertarian philosphy. It seems all you have to go on are the lies and propaganda spread by ignorants. If ANYONE wants to know about libertarian philosphy or ANY ( liberal/conservative ) type of politics i suggest you mail it to the soc.politics moderator. Talk.politics.misc is also an option, though i doubt anything productive will come of it. It seems only 3 yr. olds post there. ex.- ( you're an idiot, no! you're pond scum. Yeah, well my mom can beat up your mom! nyaah! ) > > ucbvax!bosco!gsmith Gene Ward Smith/Brahms Gang/Berkeley CA 94720 I'm sorry Matt's gone too, I liked most of his postings, hilarious! However, i disliked most of his political postings. They were most irrational and Matt seemed incapable of carrying on a discussion. mm
roger@celtics.UUCP (Roger B.A. Klorese) (09/23/87)
In article <3710@cbterra.ATT.COM> pab@cbterra.ATT.COM (Mannequin Man) writes:
]
]> Libertarians kicked him off that would seem to add to my problems
]> and questions about this philosophy. I hope my making
]
] Oh good grief! How does Mark even know the politics of the people
] who kicked him off?
Simple... we all know that The Well is the house toy of The Whole Earth
People... if the American Nazi Party kicked you off one of its systems,
wouldn't it be fair to assume it was done by Nazis?
--
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