[mod.psi] psi research vs witchcraft

dean@mind.UUCP (12/29/86)

I hope that readers of this newsgroup realize that there is a vast 
difference between academic parapsychology and the practice of
witchcraft and other occult arts.  The former is a scientific discipline,
no different in principle than experimental psychology or physics; the latter
is essentially a belief system.

Whether there are any legitimate connections between occult beliefs 
and claims and the small magnitude, statistical psi effects as revealed 
in the laboratory, remains to be seen.

das@ulowell.UUCP (01/04/87)

[]


In article <429@mind.UUCP> dean@mind.UUCP writes:
>I hope that readers of this newsgroup realize that there is a vast 
>difference between academic parapsychology and the practice of
>witchcraft and other occult arts.  The former is a scientific discipline,
>no different in principle than experimental psychology or physics; the latter
>is essentially a belief system.

Vast difference, yes.  Yet, *both* involve strict adherence to appropriate
belief systems.  The scientific belief system, however, is based on an
approach of objectivity, reductive simplicity, repeatability, locality, 
etc..  Objectivity implies that the experiment is EXTERNAL, and presumably
*independant from consciousness*, for conciousness is not understood,
and this unknown must be excluded from the equations.  If  an
experimental outcome is not repeatable by skeptics, it is immediately
suspect, for there are few known ways that thought can affect physical
results.  Scientific discipline requires simplification to a few variables
for easier analysis.  For me, psychology falls somewhere in the middle
ground between witchcraft and the hard sciences.

Occult practitioners probably understand that every observer creates
his/her/its own reality, and use this fact in modifications to one 
or more of the 'personal-universes' (perceptual contexts, if one 
prefers) which are involved.

>Whether there are any legitimate connections between occult beliefs 
>and claims and the small magnitude, statistical psi effects as revealed 
>in the laboratory, remains to be seen.

Our collective universes harbor many more interconnections than we
currently realize.  Does it matter whether we dicover a connection
via quantum physics or parapsychology?   The attitudes of Science
and ( psi,witchcraft,parapsychology,etc. ) are quite at odds at
present, but we as humans will not understand ourselves or our 
place in our universe(s) until we fill in some of the continuums
between.  Exciting times, yes?  You can try this one at home:
apply your scientific curiousity to understanding your own inner
worlds, and also apply the insights gained in your inner experiences
to your Science.  Amazing things can and do happen.

**     **  Contents product of personal perception.  Some settling  **
** das **  of contents may have occurred during translation.        **
**     **  Return reality to personal creator for a full refund.    **

mod-psi@ulowell.UUCP (01/06/87)

In article <429@mind.UUCP> dean@mind.UUCP (Dean Radin) writes:
>I hope that readers of this newsgroup realize that there is a vast 
>difference between academic parapsychology and the practice of
>witchcraft and other occult arts.  The former is a scientific discipline,
>no different in principle than experimental psychology or physics; the latter
>is essentially a belief system.

False.  Parapsychology is the belief system, as demonstrated by the many
cases of experimenter fraud motivated by an obviously preconceived belief
that in the end the subject matter would prove to be real: a few little
twiddlings here and there are merely helping things along.  Parapsychology
is a pseudo-scientific extension of the nineteenth century cult of
spiritualism, as is made clear by, for instance, William James' summary of
the early work of the Society for Psychical Research, reprinted in "The Will
to Believe" (available from Dover).

It is obvious if you read Targ or Rogo or any of the other respected and
popular psi authors that they have always believed in psychic powers: that
they entered research with the aim not of discovering whether such powers
exist, but of proving that they do.  They make all sorts of grandiose claims
for which no experimental evidence is offered, such as how to build up one's
psychic powers.  I suggest that if they knew how to build up psychic powers,
they would be able to train themselves or others sufficiently well that
repeatable experiments would be possible.

There is still not a single repeatable experiment to demonstrate the
existence of any psychical phenomenon, after over a century of ostensibly
scientific work.  No legitimate science has ever suffered from this problem;
but we are supposed to believe that psychical effects are somehow harder to
study than nucleon shells.  A less preconceived response would simply be to
assume that the subject matter does not exist, if it resists so tenaciously
all attempts to observe it.  If physics worked like parapsychology, we would
all be making up rationalizations for the existence of the ether despite
Michelson-Morley.

Occultism and witchcraft, however, present a large number of repeatable
experiments in ritual and meditation which have been shown to have an effect
on the psyches of a number of people.  Unfortunately, psychological
experiments in these religious traditions and others have been avoided like
the plague, at what I believe to be an incalculable cost to psychology.
Occultism and witchcraft, unlike dogma-oriented religions like Christianity
(but like Buddhism and Taoism) are oriented towards action and inaction, or
in Gurdjieff's well-turned phrase "work on self", rather than belief.  The
primary reason for the avoidance of such experiments has been the perception
in the West that religion is primarily a matter of belief and explanation,
which of course is true only of the monotheistic religions.

>Whether there are any legitimate connections between occult beliefs 
>and claims and the small magnitude, statistical psi effects as revealed 
>in the laboratory, remains to be seen.

Oh sure.  Let's see even one such repeatable and falsifiable psi effect.

I have nothing against people who believe in psychic powers; I get rather
disgusted with Randi-style blanket condemnations of the intelligence and
honesty of such people.  It is not my intent to insult anyone who disagrees
with me, but I was not about to let such a ridiculous and inverted comparison
pass without comment.
--
Tim Maroney, Electronic Village Idiot
{ihnp4,sun,well,ptsfa,lll-crg,frog}!hoptoad!tim (uucp)
hoptoad!tim@lll-crg (arpa)