SY.CHRISTINE@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU (Christine M Gianone) (10/28/86)
Info-Kermit Digest Tue, 28 Oct 1986 Volume 5 : Number 14
New York Mets:
The Official Baseball Team of the Kermit File Transfer Protocol
Today's Topics:
Call for IBM Mainframe Kermit Developers
Re: File encoding
Where to Get HP-1000 Kermit
Kermit Server at Bitnet node UOFT02
Prime Kermit 7.57
RT11 XM Kermit Problem
Mac connections
MS-Kermit options
Two Small Requests for MSKERMIT
MSKermit LOG suggestion
Kermit on Compuserve?
Problem with Kermit and DATAKIT
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Date: Thu 9 Oct 86 13:23:41-EDT
From: Frank da Cruz <SY.FDC@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject: Call for IBM Mainframe Kermit Developers
Keywords: VM/CMS Kermit, MVS/TSO Kermit
A lively discussion (and some work) is underway to merge the major IBM
System/370 series assembly-language Kermit programs, so that VM/CMS and
MVS/TSO Kermits can share common OS-independent modules (particularly
the code that implements the Kermit protocol itself). Any IBM mainframe
Kermit developer or maintainer who wants to be involved in this
discussion should send me a note (as SY.FDC@CU20B, or FDCCU@CUVMA.BITNET).
This includes those who have any connection with the Kermit programs for
MVS/GUTS, MUSIC, and MTS, and who might be interested in integrating Kermit
into the various dialects of Wylbur, and possibly also with CICS.
------------------------------
Date: Sat 11 Oct 86 02:08:17-PDT
From: Bob Larson <BLARSON@USC-ECLB.ARPA>
Subject: Re: File encoding
Keywords: File Encoding
Here are a couple of file encoding schemes that Frank da Cruz missed in his
list:
btoa/atob 4.0: 5/4 encoding to printable characters, space not included.
Designed for use with (and comes with) compress 4.0. Has header and trailer
lines so mail headers may be skipped and multiple files may be sent
together. (Available for ftp from the mod.sources archives at
seismo.css.gov, I have an os9/68k version if there is interest.)
Motorola S record: 2/1 encoding to printable characters. Designed for use
with eprom programmers, etc. so includes address specification. (Number of
address bits vary between various S record formats.) The only advantage of
this format that I know of is encoding/decoding programs come with os9.
Included for completeness.
Bob Larson
[Ed. - Thanks for completing the encoding form list Bob.]
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Date: Wed 15 Oct 86 11:24:44-EDT
From: Frank da Cruz <SY.FDC@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject: Where to Get HP-1000 Kermit
Keywords: HP-1000 Kermit
In V5 #3 of the Info-Kermit Digest, a message was posted by Michael Terenyi
describing a new HP-1000 Kermit that solved all the problems of the previous
versions, that was available from Paul Schuman of E-Systems, Inc,
Greenville, Texas. Some weeks later, we actually received, installed, and
announced this version in the regular Kermit distribution. However, Paul
has been getting numerous calls, blank tapes, etc, ever since. Although
Paul was kind enough to contribute his program to Kermit Distribution, he
does not have the time or resources to honor the high volume of requests
he's been getting for this program. If you need it, please get it either
from Columbia (by mail order, or over the networks as HPM*.*), or else from
the international Hewlett-Packard User Group:
Interex
680 Almanor Avenue
Sunnyvale, CA 94086-3513
Phone 1-408-738-4848
You probably have to be a member of Interex before you can order programs
from them. Paul thinks they have Kermit programs for a large variety of HP
minis, workstations, and PCs, all on native media, which is a service
Columbia has not been able to provide.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 86 12:43 EDT
From: <BRIAN@UOFT02.BITNET> (brian nelson)
Subject: Kermit Server at Bitnet node UOFT02
Keywords: Kermit BITnet Server
For those of you experiencing trouble accessing KERMSRV@UOFT02.BITNET there
was a problem in the way it sent interactive messages back. It was acting
as if it were a NODE and not a USER when sending messages. This has been
fixed.
Also, please note that it responds to interactive messages only, files sent
to it with imbedded commands will not cause it to send files back.
Brian Nelson
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 86 18:35:15 GMT
From: BROOKS@UK.AC.EXETER.PC
Subject: Prime Kermit 7.57
Keywords: Prime Kermit
There is a bug in PR1ME Kermit version 7.57.
If, when in SERVER mode, the user logs off with a BYE command on the
micro-Kermit, the NEXT user to get that PRIMOS usernumber can have problems
related to the PRIMOS KILL and ERASE characters. It showed up in the
Sheffield Editor for us.
The problem arises if other software expects that the PRIMOS routine ERKL$$
returns leading zeros in the words that give the user's KILL and ERASE
characters as documented in DOC3621-190 Subroutines Reference Guide page
10-23. What is not documented is that when writing the KILL and ERASE the
leading byte of the words should be ZERO. This is the only reason that
reading returns leading zeros!
Unfortunately, PRIMOS Kermit uses leading spaces when writing these
values. This in itself causes no problem as when Kermit exits SERVER mode
in all ways EXCEPT when it receives a BYE command, it restores the user's
KILL and ERASE characters with words it had read previously. Again this
seems no problem as LOGO$$ restores the System default KILL and ERASE
characters so everything appears OK to the next user. But logo$$ does not
seem to alter the leading byte of the words holding KILL and ERASE, hence
the problem.
The simplest fix in PRIMOS Kermit is as follows:-
In GENERIC_CMD.PLP, before
call logo$$(0,0,' ',0,0,code);
insert the line
call xfer_mode(0,code); /* restore terminal characteristics */
Ideally, the first call to erkl$$ in XFER_MODE.PLP should be fixed so
that it has leading zeros in the character strings it passes, but this needs
more changes to be made in the source. The fix given is short and it works!
There may be a problem with forced logouts which this fix obviously won't
cope with. The QUIT handler calls xfer_mode so there is no trouble there.
This caused us no end of trouble to track down to Kermit! It seemed an
epidemic had struck as more and more users hit this problem. (The PRIMOS
command TERM -kill and TERM -erase fixes a user in trouble). It didn't help
that we changed from Rev 19.3 to Rev 19.4 at the same time as we released
Kermit 7.57.
Neil Brooks
University of Exeter Computer Unit
[Thanks. We will forward this message to the authors of Kermit.]
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 23 Oct 86 11:51 EDT
From: <BRIAN@UOFT02.BITNET> (brian nelson)
Subject: RT11 XM Kermit Problem
Keywords: RT-11 Kermit
A problem with the RT11 XM version of Kermit-11 (K11XM.SAV) has been
reported. The symptom is that any command that requires additional prompting
for input, such as SHOW and SET, the prompt will be garbage. Ie, the
command:
Kermit-11>SHOW <cr>
should reply with:
What:
The cause is the command table being swapped over by the command line
editor, thus making the pointer to the prompt text invalid. The correction
is made in K11CMD.MAC as follows. The lines commented with /55/ are the
corrections.
Brian Nelson
Brian@Uoft02.Bitnet
[Ed. - Thanks. The fix is in KER:K11.BWR.]
------------------------------
Date: Fri 24 Oct 86 13:13:29-EDT
From: Frank da Cruz <SY.FDC@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject: Mac connections
Keywords: MacKermit
There have been increasing numbers of questions coming in about how to
connect Macintoshes and Mac-Pluses to modems and directly to other
computers. I hope the following details will help. I won't go into any
detail explaining terms -- you can look them up in a data communications
book (or the Kermit book!).
The Macintosh serial port is not RS-232, it's RS-422 and uses different
signalling. The Mac RS-422 port lacks the modem signals CD, DTR, DSR, RI,
and RTS, and any modems that expect to handshake with the Mac using these
signals will not work unless the handshaking can be overriden (e.g. by
setting configuration switches in the modem) or by fakeout wiring in the
modem end of the cable.
The Macintosh serial port connector has 9 pins rather than the customary 25
pins that RS-232 requires. The Mac-Plus has an 8-pin "Din-8" connector,
which needs a special converter from Din-8 to 9-pin to make it "plug
compatible" with the original Mac.
Here are the Macintosh 9-pin connector assignments, and the corresponding
Din-8 assignments:
9-pin Din-8 Signal
1 4 FG (frame ground)
2 +5V (not connected in DB9/Din-8 converter)
3 4 SG (signal ground)
4 8 TD+ (transmit positive)
5 5 TD- (transmit negative)
6 2 +12V
7 1 CTS (clear to send, or "handshake")
8 6 RD+ (receive positive)
9 3 RD- (receive negative)
The cable that you need to connect the Mac to a modem or to another Mac may
not be readily available in a store, so you might have to alter or build one
yourself. The parts (DB-9 and DB-25 connectors, pins, cables, tools, etc)
should be available from computer stores or in computer supply catalogs like
Inmac, Black Box, Misco, etc.
To connect a Macintosh to a modem, you need a male 9-pin (called DB-9, DE-9,
or D-9) on the Mac end. Only pins 3, 5, 8, and 9 need to be connected. On
the modem end, a 25-pin male DB-25 connector. Four wires in the cable
should connect the pins in the two ends as follows:
Mac DB-25
3 7 Signal ground
5 2 Transmitted data
8 1 Frame ground
9 3 Received data
Before testing this cable with your modem, be sure it's plugged into to
desired port (the present version of Kermit on the Macintosh, 0.8(34), works
only on the communication port, not on the printer, SCSI, or any other port;
this restriction may be lifted in future releases), and the baud rate is set
appropriately, usually 1200.
You should be able to dial the modem (if it's Hayes compatible) by typing
ATD and the phone number. If this doesn't work, check the configuration
switches of your modem. In particular, it must be in originate mode (ATD
puts Hayes-like modems in originate mode automatically), and it may need to
be instructed to ignore DTR (many modems require DTR signals from the PC,
but the Mac doesn't provide one). For further details, read your modem
manual.
To connect your Mac to another PC, use a "null modem" cable. Here is how
to set up a null modem cable with a Mac 9-pin (male) connector on one end
and a male DB-25 on the other:
Mac 9-pin DB-25 The DB-25 end of this cable can be plugged into
any computer that has a female RS-232 DB-25 serial
3 SG ---+ port connector. To connect a Mac with a PC/AT
| (which has a DB-9 connector, but with RS-232
+---- 7 SG rather than RS-422, signalling), use a regular Mac
| modem cable, described above, on the Mac, a regular
8 RD+ --+ PC/AT modem cable on the AT (available in stores
+-- 6 DSR and catalogs), and a female-female null modem
| (also available in stores and catalogs) to connect
7 CTS <---+-- 20 DTR the DB-25 ends of each cable.
|
+-- 8 CD To connect two Macs back-to-back, use a similar
trick: two Mac modem cables, plus a null modem.
5 TD- ------> 3 RD
Building, adapting, and testing connectors is
9 RD- <------ 2 TD not everyone's dish of tea. If it's not yours,
then take a copy of this message to a computer
+--- 4 RTS store and point to what you need. If possible,
| try to test it there on a configuration similar
+--> 5 CTS to yours before paying for it.
Back to modem cables. If your modem requires certain modem signals, and
this requirement cannot be disabled, you should be able to cajole the modem
into operation by using a null modem cable like the one above, but with
5 TD- ------> 2 TD
9 RD- <------ 3 RD
That is, the modem signals RTS, CTS, DTR, DSR, and CD are all faked in
the connectors, but receive and transmit are not cross-connected as in a
real null-modem cable.
------------------------------
Date: Thu 9 Oct 86 12:02:50-EDT
From: EXT1.FARHAD@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU
Subject: MS-Kermit options
Keywords: MS-DOS Kermit
(1) - In a recent message to Info-Kermit, someone proposed that the MS-DOS
Kermit subcommand parser incorporate assumption of a "run" prefix for inputs
that are not specifically Kermit subcommands. I suggest that, unless such
suggested feature is effected as a togglable option via Kermit's "set"
subcommand or as an equivalent togglable function, such proposed feature's
simplistic allure be resisted because the "feature" could potentially have
unintended side effects that would interfere undesirably with Kermit's
otherwise expected proper behavior.
As you are aware, the proposed run prefix assumption feature would send DOS
flying on PATH-related searches for each and every Kermit-level
nonsubcommand input, including typos. For example, people who park their
harddisks when they run Kermit for long remote sessions would see this
behavior of the proposed feature put their disk in "drive." The feature
might also necessitate that Kermit macros be named differently from programs
on the PATH which the "feature" would want to run -- clearly a cumbersome
and "nontransportable" requirement.
(2) - I much prefer to see Kermit continue to steer clear away from
special-interest "gimmeckery" such as commandline recall/edit, screensaver,
alarm and calculator functions, etc. I have seen many users (beginner and
advanced but not intermediate) who often choose to use earlier (even buggy)
versions of MS-Kermit just because they want a bare-bones program without
the fancy-schmancy code even though they have ready access to V-2.29a!
(4) - A universally useful feature would be runnability of MS-Kermit with
DOS-level subcommands, switches, etc. -- e. g.:
DOS>KERMIT -do MACRO1
or,
DOS>KERMIT -take INIT1.
(5) - Without implying that Kermit should become a whole O/S with
development tools, compilers and the rest, I ask whether Kermit could indeed
not be modularized so that a core program could be run and then desired
features could be loaded optionally through subcommands that work on
external file contents -- that'll take care of memory size, extra features
and the rest of the complaints and suggestions, wouldn't it? And, how about
an O/S-(in)dependent Kermit Function Module Protocol? /Farhad
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 11 Oct 86 08:11:16 EDT
From: John C Klensin <KLENSIN@INFOODS.MIT.EDU>
Subject: Two Small Requests for MSKERMIT
Keywords: MS-DOS Kermit
With apologies for joining the litany...
1) It would be nice if the key scanning table were expanded so that the two
new function keys (F11 and F12) on the extended keyboards could be used.
Neither their scan codes, nor the function key names are recognized by 'set
key', and 'show key' does not even recognize that they are keys.
[Ed. - There's nothing in Kermit that prevents the new scan codes from
being recognized. These keys simply are not generating them in the same
way the other keys generate scan codes. Even on the previous keyboards,
some keys -- like Ctrl-1, Ctrl-3, Ctrl-4, etc, keypad 5, Sys Req, etc --
generate no scan codes.]
2) There is apparently no convenient way to display the [path]name of the
current local directory. I can set it (with LOCAL CWD ...), or get a
directory of its contents (with LOCAL DIR), but can't just inquire about its
name. The CP/M-86 versions do an approximation to the job by displaying the
kermit prompt in the form
KERMIT86 DN>
where D and N are the drive and user number; MSKERMIT should have SOME way
to obtain this info without listing out the contents of the directory.
[Ed. - Right, this should show up in a future release.]
Similarly, it would be nice to be able to ask the thing to tell me to whence
I am logging. I can, more or less, find out if logging is turned on, but
can't (at least as far as I know) find the name of the file to which logging
is occurring.
Both of these things take on added importance as the presence of scripts and
TRANSMIT make it more possible to tailor the kermit environment to the needs
of a particular [naive] user, introducing more confusion as to what has
happended when something goes wrong.
[Ed. - All good points. Anything that can be SET should be capable of
being SHOWn.]
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 86 07:29 EST
From: CDTAXW%IRISHMVS.BITNET@WISCVM.WISC.EDU
Subject: MSKermit LOG suggestion
Keywords: MS-DOS Kermit, LOG command
Being an avid user of IBM's 7171 controller via an IBM PC and MSKermit, I
might suggest the following modification to MSKermit's LOG feature: allow
one to strip escape sequences if desired. Session logs of sessions through
a 7171 or Series 1 controller with IBM mainframes can be accomplished with
the escape sequence - F commands, but dumping screen at a time for more than
a few screens is anything but easy. If an option was available for the LOG
function which would allow the user to choose between keeping the escape
sequences and stripping them, I believe its functionality would be greatly
increased.
Mark
[Ed. - Doing what you ask would introduce a whole new level of complexity
into terminal emulation, slowing it down significantly. It would also add
dependence on the particular terminal being emulated, and on the system
doing the emulating. In your particular case, a way around the problem
is to use CMS Kermit's XTYPE and XECHO commands, to send stuff "raw" to
the ASCII terminal, where it can be logged.]
------------------------------
Date: Mon 13 Oct 86 13:12:46-EDT
From: Dan Caldano <CUL.CALDANO@CU20B.COLUMBIA.EDU>
Subject: Kermit on Compuserve?
Keywords: Compuserve
Does anyone have any info about downloading files from Compuserve using
Kermit on a 512K Mac? Am new to this sort of thing, and while I've mastered
downloading from our local DEC20 I must admit to being daunted by what I'm
reading on Compuserve (besides it's expensive just "grazing" through Compu-
serve) and in various magazines. Anyone out there able to point out what
I'm missing? Any help would be appreciated, thanks.
[Ed. - Good question. Can some knowledgable Compuserve subscriber post
a message to Info-Kermit telling whether Kermit is available on Compuserve,
and if so, how to get at it?]
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 86 17:19:47 EDT
From: vxb@harvisr.harvard.edu (Vernon Bradner)
Subject: Problem with Kermit and DATAKIT
Keywords: DATAKIT
I am trying to use Kermit over AT&T's DATAKIT packet switched data network.
Kermit file transfers work, but sometimes have many frame retransmits
resulting in much longer file transmit times.
The xmodem file transfer protocol has no such problems over DATAKIT. Of
course, I would much prefer to use Kermit (especially since with Kermit I
can transmit several files at once, unlike xmodem).
Has anyone else had similar problems with Kermit and DATAKIT? Possibly I
just have the wrong settings in Kermit?
Any ideas you might have would be a big help.
Thanks - Vern Bradner (vxb@wjh12.harvard.edu)
[Ed. - Has anyone had experience using DATAKIT packet switched data network?]
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End of Info-Kermit Digest
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