lsm@aluxp.UUCP (larry m. ) (12/07/85)
My brother recently purchased a '79 Spitfire. The problem:
the distance between the bottom of the rear wheels is
greater than the distance between the top of the rear wheels.
In fact, it is so bad, he has trouble travelling more than 20
feet without scraping some part of his exhaust system on the road.
Rear view of the rear wheels, with EF (exaggeration factor) = 5 :
---- ----
' ' ` `
' ' ` `
' ' ` `
' ' ` `
' ' ` `
---- ----
-------------------------------------------------
R O A D
I've seen quite a few Spitfire's exhibiting this effect, but none
as pronounced as the gem my brother has. Anyone have any idea
as to the cause of this and/or what the solution entails?
larry m
at&t allentown papjs@uw-june (Philip J. Schneider) (12/10/85)
Regarding the Triumph with the canted rear wheels - if you will take a
look under the car (you will likely have to jack it up), you will notice
that the rear axle is not solid. Rather, it sports universal joints on
either side of the differential, giving the car "independent" rear
suspension. The entire structure is connected to a single large leaf
spring. This spring is likely quite worn, since, as it sags, the rear
wheels gradually acquire that angle you mentioned. The only way to fix
this is to replace the leaf spring. (This may cost more than the car is
worth, if I know my British auto parts :-) ).
--
Philip Schneider
University of Washington Computer Science
pjs@{uw-june.arpa,washington.arpa}
{ihnp4,decvax,cornell}!uw-beaver!uw-june!pjs jay@hp-pcd.UUCP (jay) (12/11/85)
I own a '73 MGB. I had problems with a sagging rear end, but
without the tilted wheels you described, MG's don't have independent
rear suspension. Upon investigation, I found that MG's are
notorious for weak rear springs. Since Triumphs were made by the
same folks, a similar conclusion might be warranted.
In a vehicle with independent rear suspension, rear wheel tilt as
you described is caused by the body sitting too low with respect to
the suspension. This can be caused by weak rear springs or overloading
of the car.
Warning: If your brother decides to try replacing the springs DO NOT
buy used springs, they are likely to nearly as weak if not AS weak as
the springs being replaced, and you'll end up buying new ones anyway.
Jay Phillips
hp-pcd!jaytjsmedley@watmum.UUCP (Trevor J. Smedley) (12/11/85)
In article <177@uw-june> pjs@uw-june (Philip J. Schneider) writes: > >The entire structure is connected to a single large leaf >spring. This spring is likely quite worn, since, as it sags, the rear >wheels gradually acquire that angle you mentioned. The only way to fix >this is to replace the leaf spring. > Actually, I once *repaired* both of the leaf springs on a '72 MGB in an afternoon for about $20.00 (CDN). The procecdure is quite simple; (1) Get some used leaf springs and take them apart. (2) Remove and dismantle the springs on the car. (Don't use stands under the rear wheels or axle to support the car :-) (3) Reconstruct new springs using the best of the parts, and one *additional* leaf per spring. The main problem in my case was that two or three of the leaves were broken, including at least one main leaf. The clearance under the rocker panels was increased from about 6cm to more like 15-20cm. The price breakdown was as follows; Used springs - $10.00 (from a friend so this is probably low) New U-bolts - $5.00 (old ones will be too short and/or strip) New spring clips - $5.00 (old ones are destroyed dismantling springs) I don't know if you can do such a thing with a Spitfire, but it's certainly worth a try. >(This may cost more than the car is worth, if I know my >British auto parts :-) ). Whether the old 'B is worth $20.00 or not is another topic altogether. Trevor J. Smedley University of Waterloo {decvax,allegra,ihnp4,clyde,utzoo}!watmum!tjsmedley
ccrse@ucdavis.UUCP (0058) (12/11/85)
> ...The entire structure is connected to a single large leaf > spring. This spring is likely quite worn, since, as it sags, the rear > wheels gradually acquire that angle you mentioned. The only way to fix > this is to replace the leaf spring. (This may cost more than the car is > worth, if I know my British auto parts :-) ). There may be an option other than outright replacement. Locally, there is a blacksmith shop (yes, you read that right) that will 're-arc' leaf springs back to their original shape and (hopefully) 'springiness'. While I have never used the service myself, I say hopefully because my friend who had the rear springs of his '65 mustang re-arced found that the rear suspension settled back most of the way in a couple of years. Still, it would probably be much cheaper than replacement and should be considered, if available in your area.
fern@polyof.UUCP ( FTG ) (12/12/85)
> > My brother recently purchased a '79 Spitfire. The problem: > the distance between the bottom of the rear wheels is > greater than the distance between the top of the rear wheels. > In fact, it is so bad, he has trouble travelling more than 20 > feet without scraping some part of his exhaust system on the road. > Rear view of the rear wheels, with EF (exaggeration factor) = 5 : The Spitfire has a transverse leaf spring suspension. As the spring ages it loses some of its down force, so what you have observed is a nprmal consquence of too low a spring rate. The spring can be brought back to spec by a spring rebuilder. Look in the yellow pages. Also if your spring is that bad, you should replace all of the little rubber encased bushings on the control arms. When replacing the spring, there are six studs which attach the spring to the differential, these and the castlated nuts which hold the spring down MUST BE REPLACED. They will BREAK. This is very bad, particularly in the middle of a corner. It can change the entire geometry of the car (if enough break at the same time it can also change the drivers geometry). FTG ps dietz etz
ray@othervax.UUCP (Raymond D. Dunn) (12/12/85)
In response to a request for info on why the rear wheels of a Triumph Spitfire are canted, <177@uw-june> pjs@uw-june (Philip J. Schneider) writes: > >Regarding the Triumph with the canted rear wheels - if you will take a >look under the car (you will likely have to jack it up), you will notice >that the rear axle is not solid. Rather, it sports universal joints on >either side of the differential, giving the car "independent" rear >suspension. The entire structure is connected to a single large leaf >... This spring is likely quite worn, since, as it sags, the rear >wheels gradually acquire that angle you mentioned.... While I agree that there is obvious wear (or the suspension has been "lowered" by some idiot) if the car is dragging its bottom, it should be noted that the Spit's rear wheels have significant *negative camber* designed in (i.e. the wheels are closer together at the top than at the bottom). This is similar to, but with a much bigger angle than, the current Ford Escort. Never noticed it? - have a look. Sorry I cant give technical specs, but it is about 20 years (sigh) since I drove and maintained a Spitfire. I waited a few days before posting in the hope that a current techy would respond. Ray Dunn. ..philabs!micomvax!othervax!ray
segre@uicsl.UUCP (12/13/85)
I had the quarter-elliptical rear springs (!) for my old Bugeye rebuilt
by a spring shop a few years ago. It cost about $50 for the both of them,
including replacment of some broken leaves.
=====
Alberto Segre
Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering
Coordinated Science Laboratory
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
ARPA or CSNET: uicsl!segre@uiuc
UUCP: ...!{ihnp4, convex, pur-ee}!uiucdcs!uicsl!segrebill@crystal.UUCP (12/17/85)
> > ...The entire structure is connected to a single large leaf > > spring. This spring is likely quite worn, since, as it sags, the rear > > wheels gradually acquire that angle you mentioned. The only way to fix > > this is to replace the leaf spring. (This may cost more than the car is > > worth, if I know my British auto parts :-) ). > > There may be an option other than outright replacement. Locally, there > is a blacksmith shop (yes, you read that right) that will 're-arc' leaf > springs back to their original shape and (hopefully) 'springiness'. Another option: there are shops that add or replace leafs in springs. Call a local truck equipment dealer and ask who they suggest. They can (or at least did in the past) make new springs cheaper than the Dodge dealership I worked for could get them from Chrysler. My experience has been only for trucks, but they were doing some car springs too. -- William Cox Computer Sciences Department University of Wisconsin, Madison WI bill@wisc.crys.edu ...{ihnp4,seismo,allegra}!uwvax!bill