[net.micro.amiga] Spreadsheets & stuff

ed@plx.UUCP (Ed Chaban) (08/28/86)

	<<<Come & get it>>>

	Does anyone out there have any opinions on some of the amiga
	spreadsheets on the market.  I just bought Maxiplan and wish
	I had not!  Did they write this thing in Lattice or Manx?

	I realize that 1/2meg is not enough for the amiga but running
	out of memory when you only have 20 columns and 4 rows is 
	ridiculous!  Furthermore, I *HATE* to wait for the pointer to
	move when I "mouse around the sheet" (does that make sense?)
	can this symptom be remidied with more megabytes? It's really
	annoying since you always "miss" the cell you want to select.

	Maybe I'm being unfair but I expect better performance than
	what I've seen. In terms of features, Maxiplan seems great
	but it performs like a dog!

	Any Comments?

	Ed Chaban
	Plexus Computers Inc.
	Voice: (408) 943-2226
	Net:   sun!plx!mts!ed 

	I disclaim everything

cmcmanis@sun.uucp (Chuck McManis) (08/29/86)

> 
> 	Does anyone out there have any opinions on some of the amiga
> 	spreadsheets on the market.  I just bought Maxiplan and wish
> 	I had not!  Did they write this thing in Lattice or Manx?
> 
> 	I realize that 1/2meg is not enough for the amiga but running
> 	out of memory when you only have 20 columns and 4 rows is 
> 	ridiculous!  Furthermore, I *HATE* to wait for the pointer to
> 	move when I "mouse around the sheet" (does that make sense?)
> 	can this symptom be remidied with more megabytes? It's really
> 	annoying since you always "miss" the cell you want to select.
> 
> 	Maybe I'm being unfair but I expect better performance than
> 	what I've seen. In terms of features, Maxiplan seems great
> 	but it performs like a dog!
> 
> 	Any Comments?
> 
> 	Ed Chaban

Some comments : MaxiPlan and VIP professional both soak up the memory.
Probably because they were written in C, Lotus 1A on the PC was written
in assembler.  Unfortunately this is a pretty good reason why the PC
software is as fast and memory efficient as it is, first you only have
640K period, second you either have to access it in 64K chunks or write
your own memory management routines because for the longest time no
high level language could manage that feat. Now on the Amiga you have 
this nice flat address space and it is easy to write simple code for
it unfortunately that code is often bloated as a result. So until
someone writes a spread sheet in assembler I doubt it will live up to
the potential of the machine. 

Additional comment, I have the Alegra 512K board (yeah!) and MaxiPlan
runs fine with it, can't say I like their color scheme though. You 
can save memory by selecting the menu item "limitied colors" or some
such rather than the extended colors. Since this reduces the number of
bitplanes used it makes text rendering much faster. One thing I wished
for in 1.2 but now looks like 1.3 or a custom library ioss "FastText"
no kerning, no proportional spacing , no fancies, just damn fast. Of
course Charlies Heath's  TxED is awfully fast so it must be possible.


-- 
--Chuck McManis
uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis   BIX: cmcmanis  ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com
These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you.

ali@navajo.STANFORD.EDU (Ali Ozer) (08/29/86)

>:-o      <--- Finally, a picture of THE line eater!


In article <223@plx.UUCP> ed@plx.UUCP (Ed Chaban) writes:
>	Does anyone out there have any opinions on some of the amiga
>	spreadsheets on the market.  I just bought Maxiplan and wish
>	I had not!  Did they write this thing in Lattice or Manx?
>
>	I realize that 1/2meg is not enough for the amiga but running
>	out of memory when you only have 20 columns and 4 rows is 
>	ridiculous!  

I played with VIP Professional a bit, and it seems like
a great product. I ran through the demos they have (which just
go through the various features by simulating keyboard input),
and I was impressed. I did not push it to its limits, but with 512K,
it told me that 36K were available for the worksheet. (The source code 
is 400K or so!) I am not sure how many rows and columns that is, but
it probably is more than 20 x 4.

I had the program go through the graph demos, and it drew real
pretty pie charts and histograms on the screen. But it did not look
like the program was specifically written for the Amiga; it did not
use menus & stuff... In fact, the program is apparently modeled after 
Lotus 1-2-3. In any case, I liked the program.

(No, no, I do not work for whoever makes VIP Professional. I don't even
 know who makes it...)

Ali Ozer,  Ali@score.stanford.edu

ed@plx.UUCP (Ed Chaban) (08/29/86)

> runs fine with it, can't say I like their color scheme though. You 
> can save memory by selecting the menu item "limitied colors" or some
> such rather than the extended colors. Since this reduces the number of
> bitplanes used it makes text rendering much faster. One thing I wished
> for in 1.2 but now looks like 1.3 or a custom library ioss "FastText"
> no kerning, no proportional spacing , no fancies, just damn fast. Of
> course Charlies Heath's  TxED is awfully fast so it must be possible.
> 
> 
> -- 
> --Chuck McManis
> uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis   BIX: cmcmanis  ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com
> These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you.

On a further note, I find that the color scheme used for Maxiplan graphics
is kind of poor for doing monochrome stuff.  It helps to be able to use
dpaint to spruce the graphs up but dpaint can't do pattern fills
-sigh-


Ed Chaban
Plexus Computers Inc.
Phone: (408) 943-2226
Net: sun!plx!mts1!ed

"Boot me up on the Zen Machine"

		-Roger Powell

Disclaim, Disclaim, Disclaim etc...

cmcmanis@sun.uucp (Chuck McManis) (08/30/86)

> 
> On a further note, I find that the color scheme used for Maxiplan graphics
> is kind of poor for doing monochrome stuff.  It helps to be able to use
> dpaint to spruce the graphs up but dpaint can't do pattern fills
> -sigh-
> 
> 
> Ed Chaban
> Plexus Computers Inc.
> Phone: (408) 943-2226
> Net: sun!plx!mts1!ed
> 

Last I checked dpaint could do pattern fills, first you draw the area to 
be filled with some unused color, then you make that the "background" color
by clicking the select button over the palette color, then put the pattern
you want in the spare screen, then select merge in back from from the 
spare item off the project menu. Voila everything you painted with "background"
color gets what ever was in the spare screen. Now I realize this isn't as
easy to use as Aegis' pattern "colors" but it is very flexible. I hope
it stays in Version 2 even though they have added a more traditional pattern
fill option.

-- 
--Chuck McManis
uucp: {anywhere}!sun!cmcmanis   BIX: cmcmanis  ARPAnet: cmcmanis@sun.com
These opinions are my own and no one elses, but you knew that didn't you.

stroyan@hpfcdc.HP.COM (hpfcrg Mike Stroyan) (09/01/86)

> On a further note, I find that the color scheme used for Maxiplan graphics
> is kind of poor for doing monochrome stuff.  It helps to be able to use
> dpaint to spruce the graphs up but dpaint can't do pattern fills
> -sigh-

   Dpaint can do pattern fills with a little fancy manuevering.  The trick
uses the "merge in back" option under the spare picture control.  This
takes the spare picture and copies it into the front picture at each point
which is currently in the background color.

   You set background to a color not used in the picture.  Fill the area
with background, then load the spare picture with a pattern and do a
merge in back.  This involves a lot of steps, but gets the job done in
a very flexible way.

Mike Stroyan, [hplabs!]hpfcla!stroyan

P.S. The snap grid is immensely useful for making pattern screens.

walker@sas.UUCP (Doug Walker) (09/02/86)

In article <6672@sun.uucp>, cmcmanis@sun.uucp (Chuck McManis) writes:
> > 
> > 	Does anyone out there have any opinions on some of the amiga
> > 	spreadsheets on the market.  I just bought Maxiplan and wish
> > 	I had not!  Did they write this thing in Lattice or Manx?

I have been using Analyze! for some time now, seems to do fine.  It asks
you how much memory to partition at the beginning with 128K the default,
I always use 128K and I've never run out.  Admittedly, I only do my
checkbook on it, but I've had two months of checks at one time on there.
It doesn't have as many advanced features as, say, VIP, but I don't need
those anyway.

I saw MaxiDesk at one time and it ran like a dog, too.  Might be a trend
here.