leimberger@truman.dec.com (09/17/86)
I have come across a rumer about a new apple that is supposed to be a threat to the amiga. gs... something.I feel that the amiga can hold it's own. While our user base may not be as large the quality of public domain own. While our user base may not be as large as others the quality of the public domain software available reflects well on the support given by amiga users. This is my first venture on the usenet so please be patient with any errors. bill
jacobson@uiucuxe.CSO.UIUC.EDU (09/20/86)
The rumor that you have heard about is the Apple IIgs. It is a mac-like machie with supposed higres graphics like the Amiga. The speech synthesizer built in has a very human like voice, ulike ours which still sounds like a computer. It supposedly will run many of the old Apple II software, but is like a mac in its user interface. I think this is the first barage from Apple against the ST and Amiga. It is an attempt to make a color mac out of the Apple II. My dealer who unfortunately is an Apple dealer first and Amiga, IBM, Epson, ect second is all wound up about it. They plan to fly it in with some sort of big promotion here next week. I agree the Amiga will hold its own against this new one from Apple. Actually it is kind of flattering. The Amiga improved on the Mac by long way, but it was imitation the path blazed by the Mac. Now the new Apple II is trying to imitate the path blazed by the Amiga and ST. It never ends.
wtm@neoucom.UUCP (Bill Mayhew) (09/23/86)
### Hi line munchie. ### At first blush, I feared that the Apple // GS might be the demise of the Amiga. In reality, they seem to be aiming at a different group of, albeit probably more profitable, group of consumers. The GS is really aimed at the big group of Apple ][ users that are anxious for more power from the Apple, rather than desiring the features of the Amiga. The main fix will be *finally* giving the Apple a decent address space to run modern programming. It sure has been blinking hard for me to write nice stuff because of the tiny 64K memory. The GS will be a relief, especailly since it has good support from the [ROM] O.S. a-la Amiga and Mac. The GS still is not an Amiga, though, as as far I know that the updated ProDOS/16 OS that it is going to have does not support multitasking in the way we are accustomed on the Amiga. I'd bet that programming for the GS is going to be very MAC-like, where your own program has to call the OS all the time in order to keep the system breathing. The sound for the GS seems to be the most exciting part of the machine. Its sound chip has 15 (I presume) DMA channels for output. I don't know if they are real ADCs as in the Amiga. The preview I read claimed that the GS also had a built-in audio input, presumably for digitizing sound. I forget the exact numbers, but the GS video display should be roughly equivalent to the Amiga hi-res noninterlaced display mode. The apple, I think, offers more colors. (The amiga has enough colors for me, thanks any way.) Given that the GS is not a quantum step, I don't think that it will terribly interest Atari, Amiga, and MAC owners. The GS is also relatively expensive for what you get. (Remember that Apple discounts aren't very good for consumers.) For the cost of the Apple system box, I can buy an entire Amiga or ST. Also Apple's attitude is that their computers should be treated more as appliances, rather than hacking for fun, thus the Amiga still appeals more to me. --Bill
daveh@cbmvax.cbm.UUCP (Dave Haynie) (09/25/86)
> Summary: Not a significant threat A different market niche > > The GS is really aimed at the big group of Apple ][ users > that are anxious for more power from the Apple, rather than > desiring the features of the Amiga. The main fix will be *finally* > giving the Apple a decent address space to run modern programming. Unfortunately for the machine, only new software will be able to use that extra address space. Of course, it could probably bank 64K chunks just like a IIe, but that's defeating the purpose of the $8.00 65C816 chip. > It sure has been blinking hard for me to write nice stuff because > of the tiny 64K memory. Than again, all that stuff you guys squeeze into the 64K address space is often highly optimized assembly (albeit optimized for size, not speed). This thing should run about as fast as a 10-11 MHz 8088 based IBM PC; give or take some depending on the actual task at hand. > I forget the exact numbers, but the GS video display should > be roughly equivalent to the Amiga hi-res noninterlaced display > mode. The apple, I think, offers more colors. (The amiga has > enough colors for me, thanks any way.) All kinds of stories on this one. They have a 4096 color palette, same as the Amiga. Though one source claims only 512 colors out of this palette can ever be used together. Out of that, they limit it to 16 colors per scan line in an Amiga-Lo-Res equivalent mode, and 4 colors in an Amiga Hi-Res, non-interlaced, equivalent mode. How they switch via scan lines I haven't heard; one rumor claims that each scan line can choose one of sixteen (4 or 16 element) color sets, others claim that its an active process, like what you'd have to do to make an Atari ST change colors per scan line. Guess we'll all know in a month or so. > Given that the GS is not a quantum step, I don't think that > it will terribly interest Atari, Amiga, and MAC owners. The GS is > also relatively expensive for what you get. (Remember that Apple > discounts aren't very good for consumers.) For the cost of the > Apple system box, I can buy an entire Amiga or ST. Also Apple's > attitude is that their computers should be treated more as > appliances, rather than hacking for fun, thus the Amiga still > appeals more to me. > > --Bill Well, Apple's consistantly selling the same (or nearly same) class of machine for several time what everyone (like CBM and Atari) sell theirs for; Apple II series versus C64/C128 is a good example of this. And of course the Amiga and ST drove down the Mac cost. I wouldn't expect them to come out at a reasonable price. Hey, they've had some of the best marketing in the business, and will probably continue. -- ============================================================================ Dave Haynie {caip,ihnp4,allegra,seismo}!cbmvax!daveh These opinions are my own, though for a small fee they be yours too.