jea@ur-cvsvax.UUCP (Joanne Albano) (10/06/86)
> As a side note, I'm glad to see some really good Amiga-ized programs coming > out. The Pawn showed up yesterday (SUPERB graphics, nice music) and > Chessmaster 2000 last week, which I will try to get a good look at tomorrow. > Also Leather Goddesses of Phobos from Infocom, anyone know if Trinity is > released for the Amiga? > > John Russell > UUCP: {akgua,allegra,cbosgd,ihnp4,utcsri}!garfield!john13 > CDNNET: john13@garfield.mun.cdn We have been holding our breath for an AMIGA chess program. Are these programs generally available for purchase? Are there any PD chess programs? Do either of these programs play a challenging game? We have not previously heard of either.
kim@amdahl.UUCP (Kim DeVaughn) (10/08/86)
[ "Send lawyers, guns, and money ..." ] Sorry if you've seen this before, but it did not *appear* to get posted when I tried earlier. But then, who knows how news programs REALLY work :-) ... I'm also crossposting this to net.games.chess, as there may be some interest/comments in this topic from that news.group: In article <363@ur-cvsvax.UUCP>, jea@ur-cvsvax.UUCP (Joanne Albano) writes: > We have been holding our breath for an AMIGA chess program. > Are these programs generally available for purchase? > Are there any PD chess programs? Do either of these programs > play a challenging game? We have not previously heard of either. I don't know about "Pawn", but yes, "Chessmaster 2000" is available. I picked it up a couple of weeks ago at a local Amiga dealer for about $40. It's published by EA (sorry, I don't remember who developed it), and seems to be VERY good. Their advertising claims it is currently the Champion for microcomputer chess programs, having beaten Sargon III. I am a moderately good player (no USCF rating though), and it gives me a good game at the mid-range levels of difficulty ... haven't really tried the higher levels, but I suspect it can beat me fairly regularly in that range, which is what I want out of a chess program (that's how we learn, right?) It is very feature laden, has *excellent* graphics, and is fully menu driven (but can use "shortcut" keys, too). Some of its features include: o 2-D or 3-D display (with board rotation available for 3-D). o Optional Chess Clocks. o Quite a few "Levels" (don't remember how many). o Seperate control to enable/disable its "thinking" while waiting for you to move. o Large number of "Book" openings (can be disabled). o Ability to save/resume games. o 100 pre-saved Championship games (including 2 of its matches against Sargon III), to which you can add others. o All the usual "bells and whistles" like "take back", "suggest a move", "mate in two", "problem mode", "replay a game", "change sides" (anytime), etc. ... o Change colors of board for each side; change color of chessmen on each side. o "Wooden" or "metalic" chessmen. o Algebraic notation or abbreviated algebraic notation. o Watch while it "thinks". o Always make the "best" move, or sometimes pick the 2nd choice on a random basis. o Printing of the game (at the end, or on a move by move basis). o Speech, music, or a beep can be selected for cueing you when it is your turn, on captures, etc. (You can also select silence.) o Lots, lots more I can't recall right now! Criticisms: It *is* copy protected [boo, hiss], but can easily be "fixed" with Maurader-I's standard copy (parms = 0,0). Doesn't seem to allow multi-tasking (no front/back gadgets), though there may be a way I haven't tried yet. The 3-D perspective is a little too "foreshortened", though I don't see how it could be improved very much. Pieces never get totally "hidden", fortunately. I wish there were some approximation of its difficulty levels to the USCF ratings ... anyone know what Sargon III is rated at? It works just fine with a 68010, with an extra megabyte, with GRABBiT resident, and under1.2. It can be run from the WorkBench or the CLI. It comes with very good documentation, as well as a good chess history and tutorial. All in all, I think it's a GREAT buy! /kim Of course, I have no connection with Electronic Arts or with Discovery Software (the Maurader/GRABBiT folks) ... just reporting my perceptions. -- UUCP: {sun,decwrl,hplabs,pyramid,ihnp4,oliveb}!amdahl!kim DDD: 408-746-8462 USPS: Amdahl Corp. M/S 249, 1250 E. Arques Av, Sunnyvale, CA 94086 CIS: 76535,25 [ Any thoughts or opinions which may or may not have been expressed ] [ herein are my own. They are not necessarily those of my employer. ]
fry_b@husc4.harvard.edu (david fry) (10/09/86)
In article <3890@amdahl.UUCP> kim@amdahl.UUCP (Kim DeVaughn) writes: ... >I am a moderately good player (no USCF rating though), and it gives >me a good game at the mid-range levels of difficulty ... haven't >really tried the higher levels, but I suspect it can beat me fairly >regularly in that range, which is what I want out of a chess program >(that's how we learn, right?) > >I wish there were some approximation of its difficulty levels to the >USCF ratings ... anyone know what Sargon III is rated at? > Sargon III is rated at 1850 on the Mac. The New York Times said a couple of weeks ago that Chessmaster had a provisional rationg over 2000 as a result of its winning the Microcomputer championship. David Fry fry@huma1.harvard.EDU Department of Mathematics fry@harvma1.bitnet Harvard University fry%huma1@harvsc4.bitnet Cambridge, MA 02138 ...!harvard!huma1!fry
tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) (10/11/86)
>Sargon III is rated at 1850 on the Mac. The New York Times said a >couple of weeks ago that Chessmaster had a provisional rationg over >2000 as a result of its winning the Microcomputer championship. > On the other hand, no one I know who is an 1850 or above believes that rating for Sargon III. I don't really understand why there are not any really good chess programs available for home computers. Fidelity has a machine with an official USCF rating of 2100 for 200 bucks. I am pretty sure that this has an 8 bit processor. Someone should be able to come up with a 68k program that is better than this! I would certainly rather get crushed by a 68k! -- member, all HASA divisions POELOD ECBOMB -------------- ^-- Secret Satanic Message Tim Smith USENET: sdcrdcf!ism780c!tim Compuserve: 72257,3706 Delphi or GEnie: mnementh
ray@rochester.ARPA (Ray Frank) (10/13/86)
In article <3845@ism780c.UUCP>, tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) writes: > > I don't really understand why there are not any really good chess > programs available for home computers. Fidelity has a machine > with an official USCF rating of 2100 for 200 bucks. I am pretty > sure that this has an 8 bit processor. Someone should be able to > come up with a 68k program that is better than this! > > I would certainly rather get crushed by a 68k! > -- One of the reasons dedicated computers play better chess than home computers is that they are faster, given the clock speed for both is the same. The chess machines have very little over-head. There are very few interupts to be serviced, no screen to worry about, etc. Also, the expertise needed to program home computers to play chess well is not there to the extent it is at companies who make it their business to produce and sell chess computers. Kathy and Dan Spraklen for example, have made writting chess programs their life. They've written mostly for Fidelity, and their current brain child is the 2100 rated machine. Finally, the 6502 is currently the hit of the computer chess manufacturers. They've chosen this one over the Z80 series for a number of reasons, one being the 6502 running at 2mhz is as fast as a Z80A running at about 4mhz. Don't feel too badly about being crushed by an 8 bit machine, most 68k based machines are being crushed by them also. Bottom line here is, if you want a good chess playing machine, go out and by a good chess playing machine, and if you want a good home computer, go out and by a good home computer, but don't confuse the two. By the way, you can get one of them 2100 rated machines (Par Excellence) for under $150.00 from most mail order houses. ray
kim@amdahl.UUCP (Kim DeVaughn) (10/14/86)
In article <3845@ism780c.UUCP>, tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) writes: > On the other hand, no one I know who is an 1850 or above believes > that rating for Sargon III. > > I don't really understand why there are not any really good chess > programs available for home computers. Fidelity has a machine > with an official USCF rating of 2100 for 200 bucks. I am pretty > sure that this has an 8 bit processor. Someone should be able to > come up with a 68k program that is better than this! There is a review of Chessmaster 2000 in the most recent issue of "Compute!" (Oct? Nov? ... whatever, the one that just came out). It also mentions that Chessmaster 2000 has a "provisional rating" of 2000 (Grandmaster, so they say). What does "provisional" mean in this context, and why isn't it an "official" rating? Does the USCF rate dedicated chess-playing machines seperately from general-purpose machines running a chess program? Why? At one time, I thought I read that the Fidelity machines (at least some of their models) do/did run the Sargon (II or III) program. Have they changed, or am I mis-remembering? /kim -- UUCP: {sun,decwrl,hplabs,pyramid,ihnp4,seismo,oliveb}!amdahl!kim DDD: 408-746-8462 USPS: Amdahl Corp. M/S 249, 1250 E. Arques Av, Sunnyvale, CA 94086 CIS: 76535,25 [ Any thoughts or opinions which may or may not have been expressed ] [ herein are my own. They are not necessarily those of my employer. ]
ray@rochester.ARPA (Ray Frank) (10/14/86)
In article <3942@amdahl.UUCP>, kim@amdahl.UUCP (Kim DeVaughn) writes: > There is a review of Chessmaster 2000 in the most recent issue of > "Compute!" (Oct? Nov? ... whatever, the one that just came out). > > It also mentions that Chessmaster 2000 has a "provisional rating" > of 2000 (Grandmaster, so they say). What does "provisional" mean > in this context, and why isn't it an "official" rating? > > Does the USCF rate dedicated chess-playing machines seperately from > general-purpose machines running a chess program? Why? > The Chessmaster 2000 is available for 8 and 16 bit machines. This program running on an Atari 800 would certainly not rate as high as when running on a Mack or Atari ST. Also a provisional rating is by no means an offical measure of a chess players' ability. A provisional rating in simple terms means that not enough games have been played to represent the true strength of the player. The name of this program is extremely misleading. The word 'Chessmaster' in no way or stretch of the imagination should be intepreted as meaning this program plays master rated chess. The number '2000' also does not mean it plays 2000 rated chess. There is only one way to determine how good it is, and that is to have it officially rated by the USCF. I believe that only two consumer chess computers have official USCF ratings and they are: Par Excellence at 2100 and the Super Constellation at 2017. Most chess programs have never been officially rated for one reason or the other. But most chess programmers have some rather wild claims as to the ability of their programs. To my knowledge, there is only one formula used by the USCF for determining the rating of a chess player, be they human or machine. ray