mazina@pur-ee.UUCP (Der Kaiser) (09/08/85)
>In article <16323@watmath.UUCP> jagardner@watmath.UUCP (Jim Gardner) writes: >How does this game compare to another "train" game: Rail Baron. I've >been playing it for about 7 years and, although I sometimes put it away >for a couple of months, I never get tired of it. > >I've seen several stategies for playing the game - none of which work for >me, but always work for other people (sniff). Anyone got new suggestions? >-- > Rick Gillespie > ARPANET: rick@ucla-locus.ARPA or (soon) rick@LOCUS.UCLA.EDU > UUCP: ...!{cepu|ihnp4|sdcrdcf|ucbvax}!ucla-cs!rick > SPUDNET: ...eye%rick@russet.spud The entire game is in the buying strategies. What to buy: 1) Either the PA, NYC, or the B&O 2) One of the northern railroads. 3) Either the AT&SF, the SP, or the UP Don't buy anything in the South East until late in the game... Thomas Ruschak pur-ee!mazina "By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes... " --- W. Shakespeare
fox@daemen.UUCP (Merlin) (09/19/85)
> >In article <16323@watmath.UUCP> jagardner@watmath.UUCP (Jim Gardner) writes: > >How does this game compare to another "train" game: Rail Baron. I've > >been playing it for about 7 years and, although I sometimes put it away > >for a couple of months, I never get tired of it. > > > >I've seen several stategies for playing the game - none of which work for > >me, but always work for other people (sniff). Anyone got new suggestions? > >-- > > Rick Gillespie > > ARPANET: rick@ucla-locus.ARPA or (soon) rick@LOCUS.UCLA.EDU > > UUCP: ...!{cepu|ihnp4|sdcrdcf|ucbvax}!ucla-cs!rick > > SPUDNET: ...eye%rick@russet.spud > > The entire game is in the buying strategies. What to buy: > > 1) Either the PA, NYC, or the B&O > 2) One of the northern railroads. > 3) Either the AT&SF, the SP, or the UP > > Don't buy anything in the South East until late in the game... > > Thomas Ruschak > pur-ee!mazina > I certainly don't agree with this strategy, although I agree that the game is in buying strategies. The North East rails are important but they are expensive (especially early in the game) The BEST (in my opinion) line to buy first is the SAL this allows you at least one lock out. The next would be the ACL is one person gets these two the south east is just about locked out for everyone else. The next lines would be North-South runs such as the L&N or the GM&O. From here you can either expand north or west, Going north involes getting the NYC or the PA or of all things the C&O. Which locks out more of the south and gets you into BUF. I agree that that AT&SF, SP, and the UP are VERY important but they are VERY expensive. These are the LAST three to sell because if someone is saving for those he IS going to be locked out of the south the north and possible the upper regions of the US. (Namely where the CMSTP&P, the GN, and the NP are. Don't forget that the little raillines are important too. The RF&P can get you a little was into the North (if your locked out) or it can make a very short link from the North to the South The DRGW and the WP can get you to the west coast so the SP, UP and the AT&SF aren't that powerful, but it is important to buy one (at least) Of all of these I consider the AT&SF the most powerful because it travels thru five(I think) regions. Last the sooner that you get the Super Frieght the faster you move but again don't get locked out of an area just because you MUST have the Super. That defeats the purpose of it. Namely to get you someplace fast. If you have to travel over someone else's line to get to that place it doesn't help. Merlin alias Dave Fox Kirk> Bones, your suffering from a Vulcan mind-meld. McCoy> That green-blooded son-of-bitch. It's his revenge for all those arguments he lost -- Merlin alias Dave Fox Kirk> Bones, your suffering from a Vulcan mind-meld. McCoy> That green-blooded son-of-bitch. It's his revenge for all those arguments he lost
franka@mmintl.UUCP (Frank Adams) (09/24/85)
[Not food] The first thing to buy in Rail Baron is a northeastern railroad. Preferably the Pennsy, but the NYC and the B&O will do; the C&O is a last resort. You can win the game locked out of any other region; if locked out of the north-east, forget it. (By the way, the Pennsy is far and away the best value for the money in the game.) After that, it is a bit less obvious. The southeastern railroads are quite valuable, especially the SAL. If I can't get it or the ACL, I will generally go on to the next step, which is getting a central connector -- the C&NW, CRI&P, CB&Q, or MP, generally. These will connect you with any of the southwestern lines; all but the MP connect to the nortwest, as well. After this, get a northwestern line, and then one of the four routes to the southwest: the AT&SF, the SP, the UP, or the D&RGW and the WP (in order of desirability). Now there are exceptions to all this, of course. If you have a lot of long runs early on, you may want to buy a southwestern line earlier than this (probably the AT&SF). If you don't get a good central connector, you may want the IC and the SP (or the AT&SF, of course). Frank Adams ihpn4!philabs!pwa-b!mmintl!franka Multimate International 52 Oakland Ave North E. Hartford, CT 06108
mazina@pur-ee.UUCP (Der Kaiser) (09/24/85)
>> The entire game is in the buying strategies. What to buy: >> >> 1) Either the PA, NYC, or the B&O >> 2) One of the northern railroads. >> 3) Either the AT&SF, the SP, or the UP >> >> Don't buy anything in the South East until late in the game... >> >> Thomas Ruschak >> pur-ee!mazina >> >I certainly don't agree with this strategy, although I agree that the game is >in buying strategies. > The North East rails are important but they are expensive (especially > early in the game) > The BEST (in my opinion) line to buy first is the SAL > this allows you at least one lock out. The next would be the ACL > is one person gets these two the south east is just about locked out > for everyone else. The next lines would be North-South runs such > as the L&N or the GM&O. From here you can either expand north or > west, Going north involes getting the NYC or the PA or of all > things the C&O. Which locks out more of the south and gets you into BUF. Sorry, but if you look at the chart, the South East comes up as a destination region about 8% of the time. Clearly not a huge consideration. Yes, if you roll Miami early, it will hurt badly, but the odds are much against it. Any other SE destination you can probably get over... > > I agree that that AT&SF, SP, and the UP are VERY important but they are > VERY expensive. These are the LAST three to sell because if someone > is saving for those he IS going to be locked out of the south the > north and possible the upper regions of the US. (Namely where the > CMSTP&P, the GN, and the NP are. > If you have a North Eastern Railroad, and a northern (CMSTP&P, GN, NP) railroad, you CAN'T be locked out (easily, at least) of any region that matters. (See my comments on the SE). Once you have those 2 you can think about saving for a big railroad.... > Last the sooner that you get the Super Frieght the faster you move > but again don't get locked out of an area just because you MUST > have the Super. That defeats the purpose of it. Namely to get > you someplace fast. If you have to travel over someone else's > line to get to that place it doesn't help. > When to buy a Super Freight is often the hardest descision in the game. > > > Merlin > alias Dave Fox Thomas Ruschak pur-ee!mazina "By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes... " --- W. Shakespeare
mazina@pur-ee.UUCP (Der Kaiser) (09/30/85)
In article <686@mmintl.UUCP> franka@mmintl.UUCP (Frank Adams) writes: > >After that, it is a bit less obvious. The southeastern railroads are quite >valuable, especially the SAL. If I can't get it or the ACL, I will generally >go on to the next step, which is getting a central connector -- the C&NW, >CRI&P, CB&Q, or MP, generally. These will connect you with any of the >southwestern lines; all but the MP connect to the nortwest, as well. After >this, get a northwestern line, and then one of the four routes to the >southwest: the AT&SF, the SP, the UP, or the D&RGW and the WP (in order of >desirability). Why do you want a South East railroad? The South East only comes up as a destination 7% of the time anyway!!! Thomas Ruschak pur-ee!mazina "By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes... " --- W. Shakespeare
rick@ucla-cs.UUCP (10/08/85)
In article <686@mmintl.UUCP> franka@mmintl.UUCP (Frank Adams) writes: >The first thing to buy in Rail Baron is a northeastern railroad. Preferably >the Pennsy, but the NYC and the B&O will do; the C&O is a last resort. You >can win the game locked out of any other region; if locked out of the >north-east, forget it. (By the way, the Pennsy is far and away the best >value for the money in the game.) I heartily agree. The PA is *the* best railroad on the board. Whenever the NYC owner heads south (say, Philadelphia) or the B&O owner heads north (say, New York) you can rake in a fortune. Throw in the NYNH&H and the B&M and you can get every single northeastern city. > >After that, it is a bit less obvious. The southeastern railroads are quite >valuable, especially the SAL. If I can't get it or the ACL, I will generally >go on to the next step, which is getting a central connector -- the C&NW, >CRI&P, CB&Q, or MP, generally. I rather like the L&N. It gets a great deal of the southeast and close to most everything else down there (except for the disasterous even-6 and even-8), and it also is a good connector for the northeastern railroads to the south and midwest. As an aside, I decided to try the Superchief strategy this past weekend. I couldn't get the PA so I got the Superchief as my first purchase. I was fortunate that one player has poor purchase judgement and never bought the B&O, so I never got shutout of the northeast. Consequently, I eked out a victory by running over another player twice as he headed for home. A lucky win, but I didn't roll well to begin the game so it was just evening out :-). -- Rick Gillespie ARPANET: rick@ucla-locus.ARPA or (soon) rick@LOCUS.UCLA.EDU UUCP: ...!{cepu|ihnp4|sdcrdcf|ucbvax}!ucla-cs!rick SPUDNET: ...eye%rick@russet.spud
wws@whuxlm.UUCP (Stoll W William) (10/08/85)
> > Why do you want a South East railroad? The South East only comes > up as a destination 7% of the time anyway!!! > If you can't get the PA, B&O, etc, it's nice when you are in the west and roll the region that you're in to have a faraway safe place to choose. So although you are only forced to go to the South East 7% of the time, you actually go there more often if you own most of it. Bill Stoll, ..!whuxlm!wws
srt@ucla-cs.UUCP (10/08/85)
In article <7016@ucla-cs.ARPA> rick@ucla-cs.UUCP (Richard Gillespie) writes: > >As an aside, I decided to try the Superchief strategy this past weekend. >I couldn't get the PA so I got the Superchief as my first purchase. I was >fortunate that one player has poor purchase judgement and never bought the >B&O, so I never got shutout of the northeast. Consequently, I eked out a >victory by running over another player twice as he headed for home. A lucky >win, but I didn't roll well to begin the game so it was just evening out :-). > As the player he rolled over to win, let me comment... Rick only got the chance to win because I rolled poorly. In the first run, I needed a 2 or greater to win; rolled a 1. In the second run, needed a 3 or greater to win; rolled a 2. To hit him and prevent a win I needed a 4, rolled a 2. Odds were 89% I'd win, Rick got lucky and hit that 11%. This wasn't a good test of the Superchief strategy. Rick's play was strangely unaffected by it. Also the game was odd because one player determined to suicide about half-way through, ended up auctioning all his property (interesting). If he'd sold it all back to the bank, I probably would have ended up with 90% of it. As it was, Rick outbid me for the crucial NYC.
aegroup@tekigm.UUCP (Dennis Ward) (11/20/85)
> In article <7016@ucla-cs.ARPA> rick@ucla-cs.UUCP (Richard Gillespie) writes: > >As an aside, I decided to try the Superchief strategy this past weekend. .....etc...... > > As the player he rolled over to win, let me comment... > > Rick only got the chance to win because I rolled poorly. In the first run, > I needed a 2 or greater to win; rolled a 1. Nice try, but tell me: what rules are you using that allows rolling a "1"? Both the "Seattle Rules" and the original rules quite clearly state "When it is his turn, a player moves by rolling the two white dice (not the colored die) and immediately moving his pawn along the rail lines on the board for the number of dots that he rolled." With two dice, the absolute minimum that you can roll is a 2 so if you need only 2, that is a "gimme"!!! Come on guys, read the rules. Or is this a :) ? (Or however you make a smiley face?)
aegroup@tekigm.UUCP (Dennis Ward) (11/20/85)
> > > > Why do you want a South East railroad? The South East only comes > > up as a destination 7% of the time anyway!!! > > > > If you can't get the PA, B&O, etc, it's nice when you are in the west > and roll the region that you're in to have a faraway safe place to > choose. So although you are only forced to go to the South East > 7% of the time, you actually go there more often if you own most of it. > > Bill Stoll, ..!whuxlm!wws And if you use the "Seattle Rules" the odds of getting the SE increase. Under the "Seattle Rules" reaching Southeast requires: an odd 3 an odd 10 or an even 6 The odds of rolling an odd 3 are [(l/2)(1/6 + 1/6)]; the odds of rolling an odd 10 are {[1/2][(1/6 + 1/6)(1/6 + 1/6)]}; and finally the odds of rolling an even 6 are {[1/2][(1/6 + 1/6)(1/6 + 1/6)(1/6 + 1/6)]}. To get the odds of any of these to happen is the sum of these three probabilities or reducing this down: (1/6) + (1/18) + (1/54) = .24 or 24% This compares to the 7% for the original rules. All of the above based on the forumulas of probability as expressed in "Introduction to Modern Algebra" by Neal H. McCoy. (And at least 20 years after receiving my B.S. in Math!)
ccs020@ucdavis.UUCP (Kevin Chu) (11/22/85)
> > And if you use the "Seattle Rules" the odds of getting the SE increase. What are these "Seattle Rules"? Are they included in the rules of the game as an appendice of something? I learned to play before I bought the game, so I never read the rule sheet. -- -- Kevin Chu -- !{ucbvax,lll-crg,dual}!ucdavis!vega!ccs020 -- ucdavis!vega!ccs020@ucb-vax.arpa
wrd@tekigm2.UUCP (Bill Dippert) (12/11/85)
My favorite railroads for Seattle Rules Railbaron in the order that I like to purchase them are: 1 PA 2 Milw 3 RF&P 4 SAL 5 ATSF 6 SLSF 7 WP 8 NYNHH 9 B&M 10 N&W Most of these are fairly obvious, however, not all are so obvious. No. 3 the RF&P gives access for the least amount of money to either the SAL or the ACL without having to buy something expensive. And yes, I would like to purchase the L&N, but it usually goes before I get a chance to get it. (Due to my having higher priorities.) If I can get these 10, I will then go after my Superchief, and then collect $$. (Or if the opportunity presents itself, I will purchase the Superchief after No. 5 is purchased.) Of course part of my rational is that I like to collect all of the electric railroads (not counting the GN tunnel electricification) and I also like the railroads that are exclusive. I.e. SAL for Miami, B&M for Boston,N&W for Norfolk, etc. --Bill--
jeff@hpcnoe.UUCP (12/11/85)
> My favorite railroads for Seattle Rules Railbaron in the order that I > like to purchase them are: > > 1 PA > 2 Milw > 3 RF&P > 4 SAL > 5 ATSF > 6 SLSF > 7 WP > 8 NYNHH > 9 B&M > 10 N&W The sum of these railroads total to about $154,000 (working from memory). You can expect to buy all these only in a three player game. With a four player game, you can expect about 1-6. With a five player game, about 1-5. Six player game 1-4. It seems that you risk losing major connection to the West by buying the AT&SF so late in the game. From experience, it seems that you will not lose the game if you own one of the big (UP,SP,ATSF) railroads. You won't be guaranteed a win, but you will not go bankrupt. -- Jeff Wu ..!ihnp4!hpfcla!j_wu
jeff@hpcnoe.UUCP (12/11/85)
> So what are my top ten? That varies, of course, depending on what has > been bought and what strategy I'm playing, but in general. True, I think being flexible should be an important part of the strategy. Overall I think your strategy is fairly sound, I have few comments however... > (2) SAL/ACL/L&N/SOU for access to the SE. Despite the fact that the SE is > the least visited region I think Plains and NorthWest are less visited than SouthEast (working from memory). > (3) ATSF/SP/Superchief/UP/WP & DGRW. The ATSF is the prime buy amongst the > $40+ railroads because it removes the need to buy a center railroad as well. > However, it does not give access to the SF area, which can be hazardous. I think ATSF is a good coverage railroad, the problem with it is that is is difficult to complement it without duplication of area. Actually I have never bought the AT&SF because other people I play with want it more than I do. I think ATSF goes to SF (working from memory again). > The SP, on the other hand, gives great access but in a roundabout manner, so > that you'll not often see the SP player paying tolls, but instead being > forced to take round-about routes. Round about routes don't get travelled on, so they don't make income either. One of my strategies is to buy SP, DRG&W, and MP. The combination makes a very nice and efficient route to the West (and you don't need a NW railroad as bad either. > I don't particularly like the UP UP has the problem of hooking up with Chicago. You need GM&O or SLSF. But it hooks up nicely with WP. > favor a Superchief ahead of the UP. I don't like buying a superchief in the middle of buying... either do it before or after buying railroads. When you buy a superchief in the middle, you might not have a chance to buy any more railroads, which will hurt in the end-game. Buying it as the first purchase gives you enough time to earn back the difference and end up owning as many railroads as if you didn't buy a Superchief. > Finally, the WP & DGRW combo is the cheap route west, but its hard to get > both halves without sacrificing some early game buys. I buy the DGRW as the first purchase. The reason: 1. It is cheap so I can save up for the big railroads, 2. It sells well later if you need to auction it off, 3. if it looks like you are going to be shut out of the SW, you can buy WP and get close (for a $14,000 investment). > (4) CMSP&P/GP/NP. The route across the top of the board isn't particularly important unless you have the ATSF and no other way to the West. NP is a good money maker, the little stretch between Seattle and Portland gets travelled by CMST&P owners and SP owners. It also hooks up with CB&Q. > -- Scott Turner All the above analysis have been from experience playing with 5 players. If you play with other numbers, you results may vary. -- Jeff Wu
srt@ucla-cs.UUCP (12/11/85)
In article <308@tekigm2.UUCP> wrd@tekigm2.UUCP (Bill Dippert) writes: >My favorite railroads for Seattle Rules Railbaron in the order that I >like to purchase them are: > >1 PA >2 Milw >3 RF&P >4 SAL >5 ATSF >6 SLSF >7 WP >8 NYNHH >9 B&M >10 N&W I'm not sure if this is serious or not. The PA is reasonable, of course, but why by the CMSP&P second? Assuming that you'll eventually build a path to the LA/SF area (and you'd better, considering the probs), and keeping in mind that there are three rrs across the top, it doesn't seem reasonable to buy one so early. (Of course the CMSP&P does connect to Chicago and the PA, which is nice.) Likewise the RF&P is a stupid buy early in the game. It isn't likely to be bought, and since you're buying it in order to get a connection to the SAL/ACL, you ought to buy one of those first! SLSF is a worthless railroad. There are many better buys in the middle of the board, particularly the CRIP and the CBQ. The Wuppie is only good if you also get the DG&RW, so putting just one of the two high in your list is pointless. Particularly if you've already got the CMSP&P and the ATSF ahead of it. The NYNHH with the B&M is valuable if you've already got the PA, but hopefully the NYC player is smart enough to keep you from getting both. So don't bother unless you think you can get two buys before he gets his next. Finally, the N&W is worthless, considering that there is only a 1.3% chance of going to Norfolk. So what are my top ten? That varies, of course, depending on what has been bought and what strategy I'm playing, but in general. (1) PA/NYC/B&O for access to the NE. As often as the NE comes up, you have to give yourself some access there. However, if the PA & NYC are both bought I'll hold off on buying the B&O since it isn't that great a railroad and probably won't get bought quickly. (2) SAL/ACL/L&N/SOU for access to the SE. Despite the fact that the SE is the least visited region, I like to have access there simply because being shut out there can be so much more expensive than being shut out of, say, the NE. So that the utility of owning a railroad here and in the NE is about the same (which is what the Portland Rules people are overlooking). SE rrs are also good because they can cut down drastically on your travel times late in the game. You can expect to be going in and out of the NE a lot; its nice to have short routes in and out. (3) ATSF/SP/Superchief/UP/WP & DGRW. The ATSF is the prime buy amongst the $40+ railroads because it removes the need to buy a center railroad as well. However, it does not give access to the SF area, which can be hazardous. The SP, on the other hand, gives great access but in a roundabout manner, so that you'll not often see the SP player paying tolls, but instead being forced to take round-about routes. I don't particularly like the UP, so I favor a Superchief ahead of the UP. The Superchief multiplies your income by 1.5 (actually slightly more since you can move in & out of a destination in one turn, saving on tolls), so if you're average trip is $20K, it pays for itself in 4 turns, and from then on is making you money. So I think the Superchief is a good buy as early as you can afford it; I only buy into the West before buying the Superchief if I think I'll get shut out otherwise. Finally, the WP & DGRW combo is the cheap route west, but its hard to get both halves without sacrificing some early game buys. (4) CMSP&P/GP/NP. The route across the top of the board isn't particularly important unless you have the ATSF and no other way to the West. If you get shut out of the 40K railroads you have to buy up here, of course. (5) CRIP/CBQ/MP etc. There are any number of good railroads/rr combos in the middle of the board. If you already have the ATSF you don't have to worry about this that much; you should try and get the WP/DGRW to give your- self a route towards SF. You should also buy in this area with an eye towards connecting up your railroads. The northern railroads (GP,NP) are particularly worthless if you don't connect to them in the center of the board. -- Scott Turner