[mod.politics] Question for Libertarians

foy@AEROSPACE.ARPA (08/20/86)

It is hard for me to understand some of the Libertarian attitudes
about rights. Some seem to say that people have a right to do anything
they want economically, but also have a right to be free from
phyusical agression.  They seem to imply that these are natural
rights.

I would like to understand where they think these rights come from. It
seems to me that these "rights" are arbitrary sets of rules defined by
arbitrary methods, by arbitrarily selected groups of people.

To illustrate my concern with a little story: Suppose;

I am not very well endowed with mental equipment. I have inherited a
small farm on which I grow potatoes and shoot a few rabbits for my
sustenence. I am good at growing potatoes and shooting rabbits because
my father was patient with me and trained me well. I make a few $ by
selling some of my potatoes to the city folks.

One day an intelligent, well educated Libertarian (perhaps not as
ethical as most Libertarians) comes along and tells mae that he will
sell me a rototiller which will make it easy for me to grow lots more
potatoes. He tells me that I only have to give him a few dollars every
month for this rototiller. That should be easy to do because I will be
able to grow and sell so many more potatoes. It sure sounds like a
good deal. He asks me to sign a piece oaf paper which he says is an
agreement that I will pay him the amount he says I need to pay for the
rototiller. It has lots of big words that I don't understand like
deeds and mortgage and interest and so on. I don't understand what
those words mean. He is a nice guy and I sure want to grow more
potatoes so maybe sometime I can buy one of those new fangled picture
boxes so I sign the paper and I get my roto tiller and I start growing
more potatoes and I make a few more $; not as much as my fried from
the city told me I would. Sometimes I can't make the monthly payment
like I was supposed. I knew that was OK because my friend had sais it
would be when he gave me the rototiller.

One day a man in a Uniform comes and shows me the piece of paper I
signed and some other papers and tells me I have to move off my farm
tomorrow.  I get angry. We have an argument. The next day when he
comes I tell him to leave my land. He says I have to leave. I shoot
him like I would a rabbit.

End of Story.

Why do the Libertarians think that one of these individuals has a
natural right to do what he did and that the other individual does
not?

Richard Foy, Redondo Beach, CA
The opinions I have expressed are the result of many years in the 
school of hard knocks. Thus they are my own.


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mcb%lll-tis-b.ARPA@LLL-TIS-GW.ARPA (08/25/86)

foy@aerospace.arpa writes:
> 
> It is hard for me to understand some of the Libertarian attitudes
> about rights. Some seem to say that people have a right to do 
> anything they want economically, but also have a right to be free 
> from phyusical agression.  They seem to imply that these are natural
> rights.
> 
> To illustrate my concern with a little story: Suppose;
> 
> [A "libertarian" con man defrauds an illiterate farmer into deeding 
>  away his farm, telling him he is merely signing an installment sale
>  for farm equipment...]
>
> Why do the Libertarians think that one of these individuals has a
> natural right to do what he did and that the other individual does
> not?

Nowhere does libertarianism condone fraud. The essence of fraud is
misrepresentation, which occurred in the scenario Mr. Foy posted.
The aggrieved farmer should have the right to collect damages and 
have his property returned to him. What we DON'T need is a barrage of
regulations that restrict, tax, encumber, and interfere with the
freedom to engage in real estate (or rototiller!) transactions.
The farmer's private right to sue is a sufficient remedy.

The key distinction is between relief from actual fraud versus relief
from having made a bad economic decision. The first is quite
legitimate under both libertarian and statist theory; the second seems
quite prevalent in the US today, but has no place in a libertarian
system.

Michael C. Berch
ARPA: mcb@lll-tis-b.ARPA
UUCP: {ihnp4,dual,sun}!lll-lcc!styx!mcb
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