[net.politics.theory] 1933 and Roosevelt, discussion wanted?

rdz@ccice5.UUCP (Robert D. Zarcone) (03/01/85)

It has been very fashionable lately for the right-of-center crowd to
praise Roosevelt as a great president (something we left-of-centers'
have known all along!).  But there is no evidence they would act any
differently than Hoover did.  (Too little government intervention,
too late).  I throw these statistics of 1933 out for discussion:

1. 1/4 of the work force was unemployed
2. the wage rate was 3/4 that of 1929
3. 1/5 of the nations banks had failed
4. prices were 3/4 their 1929 level

Roosevelt was trying to solve all these problems *without* deficet
spending (contrary to popular thought) and without the real socialism
Huey Long was getting growing support for.  Anyone want to take this
any further?

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plh@ukma.UUCP (Paul L. Hightower) (03/05/85)

>It has been very fashionable lately for the right-of-center crowd to
>praise Roosevelt as a great president (something we left-of-centers'
>have known all along!).  But there is no evidence they would act any
>differently than Hoover did.  (Too little government intervention,
>too late)...

Objection!  Hoover interfered far too much, jawboning industry into
keeping wages high despite falling prices.  Hoover succeeded in turning
a recession into depression.  Calvin Coolidge was a great president :
he would have done nothing, and the business cycle would have corrected
itself, as always.  But Hoover and other social engineers deplored the
cycle.  Many of us right-of-center types deplore social engineering!

>I throw these statistics of 1933 out for discussion:
>
>1. 1/4 of the work force was unemployed
>2. the wage rate was 3/4 that of 1929
>3. 1/5 of the nations banks had failed
>4. prices were 3/4 their 1929 level
>
>Roosevelt was trying to solve all these problems *without* deficit
>spending (contrary to popular thought)...

That's what we call a "Tax-and-Spend" Democrat. 

Paul Hightower
University of Kentucky

rdz@ccice5.UUCP (Robert D. Zarcone) (03/11/85)

> >I throw these statistics of 1933 out for discussion:
> >
> >1. 1/4 of the work force was unemployed
> >2. the wage rate was 3/4 that of 1929
> >3. 1/5 of the nations banks had failed
> >4. prices were 3/4 their 1929 level
> >
> >Roosevelt was trying to solve all these problems *without* deficit
> >spending (contrary to popular thought)...
> 
> That's what we call a "Tax-and-Spend" Democrat. 
> 
> Paul Hightower
> University of Kentucky

I must be missing something here!  If taxes aren't for raising revenue to
be spent, what are they for?  A national savings account?  Just in case?

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plh@ukma.UUCP (Paul L. Hightower) (03/14/85)

>> >I throw these statistics of 1933 out for discussion:
>> >
>> >1. 1/4 of the work force was unemployed
>> >2. the wage rate was 3/4 that of 1929
>> >3. 1/5 of the nations banks had failed
>> >4. prices were 3/4 their 1929 level
>> >
>> >Roosevelt was trying to solve all these problems *without* deficit
>> >spending (contrary to popular thought)...
>> 
>> That's what we call a "Tax-and-Spend" Democrat. 
>> 
>> Paul Hightower
>> University of Kentucky
>
>I must be missing something here!  If taxes aren't for raising revenue to
>be spent, what are they for?  A national savings account?  Just in case?

I prefer fewer taxes and less spending.  Government spending is invariably
inefficient and generally a misallocation of resources.  Roosevelt didn't
"solve" anything, except perhaps to delay recovery for a good decade or so.

Paul Hightower

rdz@ccice5.UUCP (Robert D. Zarcone) (03/18/85)

> 
> I prefer fewer taxes and less spending.  Government spending is invariably
> inefficient and generally a misallocation of resources.  Roosevelt didn't
> "solve" anything, except perhaps to delay recovery for a good decade or so.
> 
> Paul Hightower

I will agree with your first sentence if I can change "less" to "more
meaningful".  I won't touch the second one because I'm afraid I'll fall
into a battle with Libertarians.  We don't know if the third sentence is
true, economically.  There are all the "what-ifs" (replacement of economic
system, political system, involvement in WWII, etc.).  But I will argue
that the social costs were deffinately reduced by his action.  And I think
it was this action that certainly prevented the "what-ifs" from happening.
Now, if you think he did not have a duty to address the social costs, we
had better:
a) end the disscussion
b) move it to net.flame (we may become occasionally irrational!)
c) follow-up by mail

Thanks for showing an interest!

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